Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.

Maybe spouse wasn't at home, but spouse did not have a professional job because the share of women in corporate america was tiny back then. So worked full time as a teache or similar pink collar job which was more accomdoting to family life. Now both parents need to go full tilt in career and its aged us.

DP here.

What are you talking about? Not true at all.

Agree. PP seems to be attributing the 60s and 70s and possibly earlier to the 80s and beyond. Is this the history schools are teaching?

+1 Even in the 80s, we were the latchkey kids because both parents were working all day.

Anonymous wrote:It's probably salary requirements more than age

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of people complain about this, but the problem is straightforward. By the time most employees are 50, they are expensive and their skills are dated. As for expense, they want a lot of money and time off, and the subsidy business pays for their healthcare is out of sight. As for skills, most people let them atrophy. Basically, if you’re 50 and not a senior manger/C-suite/rainmaker, you are likely to be let go. If you are super-capable on the technical front, you may still be let go, but can probably get consulting work, but that’s it. The other alternatives are government jobs, retirement, take something below your last pay grade, or work on a passion project.

That’s ridiculous. I’m just as a capable as 28 year old who easily make $200k at most corporations and roles.

Most “skills” these days are so much simpler and more automated than when we were staring out, I learned python in a weekend, it’s basically the baby psuedocode they taught us before we had to learn a lower level language (where you dealt with memory addresses and trash collection on your own). There is a whole world of virtualization and other tools to build on, but a random 50 year old is at least as capable as a random 28 year old.

It comes down to people don’t like managing people older than themselves. Sort of like how some people don’t like working with women or different races.

I’m a software developer that’s pushing 60. In my experience the vast majority of older developers actually can’t outperform a 28 year old. That’s someone with 6+ years of experience out of college. They’re generally quite competent as they’ve learned some real skills. They might not have a lot of breadth, but are generally very proficient in what they’ve been asked to do. I love computer science and software development so I spend a lot if time learning new skills and keeping up to date, but most older developers don’t.

I didn't claim to outperform, but I have no doubt that the average matches the average. First off, you have survivor bias filter -- the ones who made it to 50 are people who have proven they can actually do the job, not just people who happened to major in the hot industry and used some relatives connections to land a job. Second, theres more than just raw technical ability to being a competent contributor -- and a mature worker will again have seen it all and hopefully avoid pitfalls. Third, you know they won't be chomping at the bit to get promoted to manager or whatever -- they have already shown their preference to stay at the IC level in the coding dirt.

I agree, if you have someone who refuses to switch tools or paradigms ("in my day, we hand coded in assembly and we liked it"), sure that might not be a good fit. But if they have the skills on their resume, even having a portfolio of work products, they still won't get an interview 9 times out of 10. And that is because we as a society are uncomfortable with old people by and large.

Our society only wants 35-39 year olds.
22-35 you are not experienced.
Over 40 you are old.

Not if you are a physician. My DH is finally making $500k at age 50 and plans to retire at 70.

Oh he needs to retire by 60. 70 is way too old to be treating people.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of people complain about this, but the problem is straightforward. By the time most employees are 50, they are expensive and their skills are dated. As for expense, they want a lot of money and time off, and the subsidy business pays for their healthcare is out of sight. As for skills, most people let them atrophy. Basically, if you’re 50 and not a senior manger/C-suite/rainmaker, you are likely to be let go. If you are super-capable on the technical front, you may still be let go, but can probably get consulting work, but that’s it. The other alternatives are government jobs, retirement, take something below your last pay grade, or work on a passion project.

That’s ridiculous. I’m just as a capable as 28 year old who easily make $200k at most corporations and roles.

Most “skills” these days are so much simpler and more automated than when we were staring out, I learned python in a weekend, it’s basically the baby psuedocode they taught us before we had to learn a lower level language (where you dealt with memory addresses and trash collection on your own). There is a whole world of virtualization and other tools to build on, but a random 50 year old is at least as capable as a random 28 year old.

It comes down to people don’t like managing people older than themselves. Sort of like how some people don’t like working with women or different races.

I’m a software developer that’s pushing 60. In my experience the vast majority of older developers actually can’t outperform a 28 year old. That’s someone with 6+ years of experience out of college. They’re generally quite competent as they’ve learned some real skills. They might not have a lot of breadth, but are generally very proficient in what they’ve been asked to do. I love computer science and software development so I spend a lot if time learning new skills and keeping up to date, but most older developers don’t.

I didn't claim to outperform, but I have no doubt that the average matches the average. First off, you have survivor bias filter -- the ones who made it to 50 are people who have proven they can actually do the job, not just people who happened to major in the hot industry and used some relatives connections to land a job. Second, theres more than just raw technical ability to being a competent contributor -- and a mature worker will again have seen it all and hopefully avoid pitfalls. Third, you know they won't be chomping at the bit to get promoted to manager or whatever -- they have already shown their preference to stay at the IC level in the coding dirt.

I agree, if you have someone who refuses to switch tools or paradigms ("in my day, we hand coded in assembly and we liked it"), sure that might not be a good fit. But if they have the skills on their resume, even having a portfolio of work products, they still won't get an interview 9 times out of 10. And that is because we as a society are uncomfortable with old people by and large.

Our society only wants 35-39 year olds.
22-35 you are not experienced.
Over 40 you are old.

Not if you are a physician. My DH is finally making $500k at age 50 and plans to retire at 70.

Oh he needs to retire by 60. 70 is way too old to be treating people.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.

Maybe spouse wasn't at home, but spouse did not have a professional job because the share of women in corporate america was tiny back then. So worked full time as a teache or similar pink collar job which was more accomdoting to family life. Now both parents need to go full tilt in career and its aged us.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of people complain about this, but the problem is straightforward. By the time most employees are 50, they are expensive and their skills are dated. As for expense, they want a lot of money and time off, and the subsidy business pays for their healthcare is out of sight. As for skills, most people let them atrophy. Basically, if you’re 50 and not a senior manger/C-suite/rainmaker, you are likely to be let go. If you are super-capable on the technical front, you may still be let go, but can probably get consulting work, but that’s it. The other alternatives are government jobs, retirement, take something below your last pay grade, or work on a passion project.

That’s ridiculous. I’m just as a capable as 28 year old who easily make $200k at most corporations and roles.

Most “skills” these days are so much simpler and more automated than when we were staring out, I learned python in a weekend, it’s basically the baby psuedocode they taught us before we had to learn a lower level language (where you dealt with memory addresses and trash collection on your own). There is a whole world of virtualization and other tools to build on, but a random 50 year old is at least as capable as a random 28 year old.

It comes down to people don’t like managing people older than themselves. Sort of like how some people don’t like working with women or different races.

I’m a software developer that’s pushing 60. In my experience the vast majority of older developers actually can’t outperform a 28 year old. That’s someone with 6+ years of experience out of college. They’re generally quite competent as they’ve learned some real skills. They might not have a lot of breadth, but are generally very proficient in what they’ve been asked to do. I love computer science and software development so I spend a lot if time learning new skills and keeping up to date, but most older developers don’t.

I didn't claim to outperform, but I have no doubt that the average matches the average. First off, you have survivor bias filter -- the ones who made it to 50 are people who have proven they can actually do the job, not just people who happened to major in the hot industry and used some relatives connections to land a job. Second, theres more than just raw technical ability to being a competent contributor -- and a mature worker will again have seen it all and hopefully avoid pitfalls. Third, you know they won't be chomping at the bit to get promoted to manager or whatever -- they have already shown their preference to stay at the IC level in the coding dirt.

I agree, if you have someone who refuses to switch tools or paradigms ("in my day, we hand coded in assembly and we liked it"), sure that might not be a good fit. But if they have the skills on their resume, even having a portfolio of work products, they still won't get an interview 9 times out of 10. And that is because we as a society are uncomfortable with old people by and large.

Our society only wants 35-39 year olds.
22-35 you are not experienced.
Over 40 you are old.

Not if you are a physician. My DH is finally making $500k at age 50 and plans to retire at 70.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you don't get an interview, it is your resume. How do people know how old you are if you don't list jobs from 20 years ago?

AI is trained to recognize things. I don't know the specifics, but think about a person who leaves off the early years of their career. Resume starts with a much higher level of job that straight out of college type job. That alone is a red flag for someone who is trying to seem younger.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.

Maybe spouse wasn't at home, but spouse did not have a professional job because the share of women in corporate america was tiny back then. So worked full time as a teache or similar pink collar job which was more accomdoting to family life. Now both parents need to go full tilt in career and its aged us.

DP here.

What are you talking about? Not true at all.

Agree. PP seems to be attributing the 60s and 70s and possibly earlier to the 80s and beyond. Is this the history schools are teaching?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.

Maybe spouse wasn't at home, but spouse did not have a professional job because the share of women in corporate america was tiny back then. So worked full time as a teache or similar pink collar job which was more accomdoting to family life. Now both parents need to go full tilt in career and its aged us.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.

Maybe spouse wasn't at home, but spouse did not have a professional job because the share of women in corporate america was tiny back then. So worked full time as a teache or similar pink collar job which was more accomdoting to family life. Now both parents need to go full tilt in career and its aged us.

DP here.

What are you talking about? Not true at all.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.

Maybe spouse wasn't at home, but spouse did not have a professional job because the share of women in corporate america was tiny back then. So worked full time as a teache or similar pink collar job which was more accomdoting to family life. Now both parents need to go full tilt in career and its aged us.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.

Maybe spouse wasn't at home, but spouse did not have a professional job because the share of women in corporate america was tiny back then. So worked full time as a teache or similar pink collar job which was more accomdoting to family life. Now both parents need to go full tilt in career and its aged us.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My job the “young staff” are getting older at a way younger age than prior generations.

I have a 36 year old working for me who is near useless. She reminds me of when I was young of a 64 year old who already put in retirement papers counting down the days and refusing to learn new things and doing bare minimum.

Last year a 42 year man shut down on me burnt out long commute and in his words being “chained to office” wish he had more time at home, time to hang out. In my one in one I tried to motivate and tell him he has up to 25 years left in corporate world. He could get to CEO if he wanted. He quit

I also lost a 52 year old women juggling her sick mom and work too much.

Next week I am bringing in someone young. Maybe I will get 3-5 years out of him before his 31 year old mid life crisis.

30 is the new 50 at some IT companies

Sure? 30 years ago the worker had a spouse at home doing all the household work, commutes were way shorter and less traffic, and houses cost far less so in general a slower pace of life. Now your average 30 year old has slotted what the average 60 year old did over his entire career, and is on call and tethered to work

You’re off on this. Thirty years ago many/most did not have a spouse at home. We have become more busy in our heads thanks to tech and therefore more exhausted. We are in bubbles and socialize less in person. Thi is having a significant effect on our well-being. About 50-60% of 18yo teens today spend time socializing with friends two or more times a week outside of school / organized activities (eg, sports teams). I can’t recall if that does or does not include online interactions of any kind like texting, gaming, video chat. As a society, we are more depressed — and this started BEFORE COVID. We are trading mental well-being for work efficiency (both for our employer and household) by staying home more. This is true for extroverts as well as introverts. And the upcoming generations Z and Alpha are anxious before they even get to the adult work stage.