Anonymous
11/05/2024 00:00
Subject: Re:William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I was just thinking about the same question today. At our very competitive FCPS, getting into William and Mary is very, very difficult. There is nowhere near a 40% acceptance rate. I am not sure why the acceptance rate appears so high, because coming from FCPS, I imagine it’s in the 20% range or lower. And only the top kids are applying.
It's more self selective. People who do not have the academic qualifications to get into W&M tend not to apply unlike other a lot of other schools
This. You can tell the cuts offs for WM (and UVA) in Naviance, and it is pretty clear what it takes to be admitted. (VT is a bit different because it doesn’t break out engineering and CS, which are very high stat, from other schools that are not. UVA has a much smaller engineering school). And WM has an optional extra essay that admissions clearly said in my kid’s info session is not optional. And they push demonstrated interest and consider it strongly, which means interviewing, visiting before being admitted, etc. You can a pretty clear idea of whether you will get in from NOVA just by looking at Naviance and checking demonstrated interest boxes. My kid had white/Asian female friends sitting in the 4.1-4.2 range who didn’t even bother to apply to WM because they knew they weren’t getting in and/or they didn’t want it enough to jump through the extra essay, interview, campus visit hoops.
The clear cut off, plus the fact it is the smallest T-whatever public university in the US and attracts a certain type of kid makes its applicant pool pretty self selecting.
Oddly, the same not really there on stats/ not applying to WM kids will often apply to UVA. Not sure why. I’m sure not having the extra essay helps. As does the fact UVA is more of a traditional flagship and WM attracts kids who want more undergrad focus, small classes, etc. and less big sports / highly visible Greek life.
But, statistically, it's more difficult to get into UVA.
UVA's admissions rate is lower, but the stats are pretty much even.
75th/50th/25th for SAT is 1520/1470/1410 for UVA vs 1530/1470/1400 for W&M. GPA is 4.5/4.4/4.2 for UVA vs 4.53/4.35/4.18 for W&M.
https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp
Actually UVA's admissions rates are much lower at 16% - 18% (12% for OOS; 24% for in-state) out of 60,000 apps. W&M's acceptance rate is 34%, same for in-state and OOS,out of 17,000 apps.
The enrolled stats are the same.
but you hide the fact that it's significantly more difficult to get in UVA, stats or no stats.
Well, if you just want to go on acceptance rate, Northeastern tops almost all schools with a 5.2% acceptance rate. I just think enrolled stats are overall a better indicator, and even then you need to take a close look at the percentage of enrolled students that are covered by those stats.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 23:59
Subject: Re:William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I was just thinking about the same question today. At our very competitive FCPS, getting into William and Mary is very, very difficult. There is nowhere near a 40% acceptance rate. I am not sure why the acceptance rate appears so high, because coming from FCPS, I imagine it’s in the 20% range or lower. And only the top kids are applying.
It's more self selective. People who do not have the academic qualifications to get into W&M tend not to apply unlike other a lot of other schools
This. You can tell the cuts offs for WM (and UVA) in Naviance, and it is pretty clear what it takes to be admitted. (VT is a bit different because it doesn’t break out engineering and CS, which are very high stat, from other schools that are not. UVA has a much smaller engineering school). And WM has an optional extra essay that admissions clearly said in my kid’s info session is not optional. And they push demonstrated interest and consider it strongly, which means interviewing, visiting before being admitted, etc. You can a pretty clear idea of whether you will get in from NOVA just by looking at Naviance and checking demonstrated interest boxes. My kid had white/Asian female friends sitting in the 4.1-4.2 range who didn’t even bother to apply to WM because they knew they weren’t getting in and/or they didn’t want it enough to jump through the extra essay, interview, campus visit hoops.
The clear cut off, plus the fact it is the smallest T-whatever public university in the US and attracts a certain type of kid makes its applicant pool pretty self selecting.
Oddly, the same not really there on stats/ not applying to WM kids will often apply to UVA. Not sure why. I’m sure not having the extra essay helps. As does the fact UVA is more of a traditional flagship and WM attracts kids who want more undergrad focus, small classes, etc. and less big sports / highly visible Greek life.
But, statistically, it's more difficult to get into UVA.
UVA's admissions rate is lower, but the stats are pretty much even.
75th/50th/25th for SAT is 1520/1470/1410 for UVA vs 1530/1470/1400 for W&M. GPA is 4.5/4.4/4.2 for UVA vs 4.53/4.35/4.18 for W&M.
https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp
Actually UVA's admissions rates are much lower at 16% - 18% (12% for OOS; 24% for in-state) out of 60,000 apps. W&M's acceptance rate is 34%, same for in-state and OOS,out of 17,000 apps.
The enrolled stats are the same.
but you hide the fact that it's significantly more difficult to get in UVA, stats or no stats.
But for whom is it more difficult? For everyone?? I’m not sure the numbers bear that out.
It seems neither school is a good bet for Joe Average.
But a student with high stats seems to have a better shot of getting into W&M than at UVA.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 23:55
Subject: Re:William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I was just thinking about the same question today. At our very competitive FCPS, getting into William and Mary is very, very difficult. There is nowhere near a 40% acceptance rate. I am not sure why the acceptance rate appears so high, because coming from FCPS, I imagine it’s in the 20% range or lower. And only the top kids are applying.
It's more self selective. People who do not have the academic qualifications to get into W&M tend not to apply unlike other a lot of other schools
This. You can tell the cuts offs for WM (and UVA) in Naviance, and it is pretty clear what it takes to be admitted. (VT is a bit different because it doesn’t break out engineering and CS, which are very high stat, from other schools that are not. UVA has a much smaller engineering school). And WM has an optional extra essay that admissions clearly said in my kid’s info session is not optional. And they push demonstrated interest and consider it strongly, which means interviewing, visiting before being admitted, etc. You can a pretty clear idea of whether you will get in from NOVA just by looking at Naviance and checking demonstrated interest boxes. My kid had white/Asian female friends sitting in the 4.1-4.2 range who didn’t even bother to apply to WM because they knew they weren’t getting in and/or they didn’t want it enough to jump through the extra essay, interview, campus visit hoops.
The clear cut off, plus the fact it is the smallest T-whatever public university in the US and attracts a certain type of kid makes its applicant pool pretty self selecting.
Oddly, the same not really there on stats/ not applying to WM kids will often apply to UVA. Not sure why. I’m sure not having the extra essay helps. As does the fact UVA is more of a traditional flagship and WM attracts kids who want more undergrad focus, small classes, etc. and less big sports / highly visible Greek life.
But, statistically, it's more difficult to get into UVA.
UVA's admissions rate is lower, but the stats are pretty much even.
75th/50th/25th for SAT is 1520/1470/1410 for UVA vs 1530/1470/1400 for W&M. GPA is 4.5/4.4/4.2 for UVA vs 4.53/4.35/4.18 for W&M.
https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp
Actually UVA's admissions rates are much lower at 16% - 18% (12% for OOS; 24% for in-state) out of 60,000 apps. W&M's acceptance rate is 34%, same for in-state and OOS,out of 17,000 apps.
The enrolled stats are the same.
but you hide the fact that it's significantly more difficult to get in UVA, stats or no stats.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 23:35
Subject: Re:William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I was just thinking about the same question today. At our very competitive FCPS, getting into William and Mary is very, very difficult. There is nowhere near a 40% acceptance rate. I am not sure why the acceptance rate appears so high, because coming from FCPS, I imagine it’s in the 20% range or lower. And only the top kids are applying.
It's more self selective. People who do not have the academic qualifications to get into W&M tend not to apply unlike other a lot of other schools
This. You can tell the cuts offs for WM (and UVA) in Naviance, and it is pretty clear what it takes to be admitted. (VT is a bit different because it doesn’t break out engineering and CS, which are very high stat, from other schools that are not. UVA has a much smaller engineering school). And WM has an optional extra essay that admissions clearly said in my kid’s info session is not optional. And they push demonstrated interest and consider it strongly, which means interviewing, visiting before being admitted, etc. You can a pretty clear idea of whether you will get in from NOVA just by looking at Naviance and checking demonstrated interest boxes. My kid had white/Asian female friends sitting in the 4.1-4.2 range who didn’t even bother to apply to WM because they knew they weren’t getting in and/or they didn’t want it enough to jump through the extra essay, interview, campus visit hoops.
The clear cut off, plus the fact it is the smallest T-whatever public university in the US and attracts a certain type of kid makes its applicant pool pretty self selecting.
Oddly, the same not really there on stats/ not applying to WM kids will often apply to UVA. Not sure why. I’m sure not having the extra essay helps. As does the fact UVA is more of a traditional flagship and WM attracts kids who want more undergrad focus, small classes, etc. and less big sports / highly visible Greek life.
But, statistically, it's more difficult to get into UVA.
UVA's admissions rate is lower, but the stats are pretty much even.
75th/50th/25th for SAT is 1520/1470/1410 for UVA vs 1530/1470/1400 for W&M. GPA is 4.5/4.4/4.2 for UVA vs 4.53/4.35/4.18 for W&M.
https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp
Actually UVA's admissions rates are much lower at 16% - 18% (12% for OOS; 24% for in-state) out of 60,000 apps. W&M's acceptance rate is 34%, same for in-state and OOS,out of 17,000 apps.
The enrolled stats are the same.
Exactly.
And to me, this says more students apply to UVA as a backup and then ultimately choose an Ivy or some prestigious out of state option if they get admitted there as well.
UVA doesn’t protect for yield that much if at all, and they don’t track interest.
But they have enough high-stats applicants to keep their admissions rates low without sacrificing admissions standards. And a ton of students apply who will never be admitted…but it’s the flagship state school so they gotta shoot their shot.
W&M attracts a certain type of applicant who is looking for a smaller school. And they track interest because they want to cultivate a student body culture that wants to be there.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 23:16
Subject: Re:William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I was just thinking about the same question today. At our very competitive FCPS, getting into William and Mary is very, very difficult. There is nowhere near a 40% acceptance rate. I am not sure why the acceptance rate appears so high, because coming from FCPS, I imagine it’s in the 20% range or lower. And only the top kids are applying.
It's more self selective. People who do not have the academic qualifications to get into W&M tend not to apply unlike other a lot of other schools
This. You can tell the cuts offs for WM (and UVA) in Naviance, and it is pretty clear what it takes to be admitted. (VT is a bit different because it doesn’t break out engineering and CS, which are very high stat, from other schools that are not. UVA has a much smaller engineering school). And WM has an optional extra essay that admissions clearly said in my kid’s info session is not optional. And they push demonstrated interest and consider it strongly, which means interviewing, visiting before being admitted, etc. You can a pretty clear idea of whether you will get in from NOVA just by looking at Naviance and checking demonstrated interest boxes. My kid had white/Asian female friends sitting in the 4.1-4.2 range who didn’t even bother to apply to WM because they knew they weren’t getting in and/or they didn’t want it enough to jump through the extra essay, interview, campus visit hoops.
The clear cut off, plus the fact it is the smallest T-whatever public university in the US and attracts a certain type of kid makes its applicant pool pretty self selecting.
Oddly, the same not really there on stats/ not applying to WM kids will often apply to UVA. Not sure why. I’m sure not having the extra essay helps. As does the fact UVA is more of a traditional flagship and WM attracts kids who want more undergrad focus, small classes, etc. and less big sports / highly visible Greek life.
But, statistically, it's more difficult to get into UVA.
UVA's admissions rate is lower, but the stats are pretty much even.
75th/50th/25th for SAT is 1520/1470/1410 for UVA vs 1530/1470/1400 for W&M. GPA is 4.5/4.4/4.2 for UVA vs 4.53/4.35/4.18 for W&M.
https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp
Actually UVA's admissions rates are much lower at 16% - 18% (12% for OOS; 24% for in-state) out of 60,000 apps. W&M's acceptance rate is 34%, same for in-state and OOS,out of 17,000 apps.
The enrolled stats are the same.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 23:12
Subject: Re:William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I was just thinking about the same question today. At our very competitive FCPS, getting into William and Mary is very, very difficult. There is nowhere near a 40% acceptance rate. I am not sure why the acceptance rate appears so high, because coming from FCPS, I imagine it’s in the 20% range or lower. And only the top kids are applying.
It's more self selective. People who do not have the academic qualifications to get into W&M tend not to apply unlike other a lot of other schools
This. You can tell the cuts offs for WM (and UVA) in Naviance, and it is pretty clear what it takes to be admitted. (VT is a bit different because it doesn’t break out engineering and CS, which are very high stat, from other schools that are not. UVA has a much smaller engineering school). And WM has an optional extra essay that admissions clearly said in my kid’s info session is not optional. And they push demonstrated interest and consider it strongly, which means interviewing, visiting before being admitted, etc. You can a pretty clear idea of whether you will get in from NOVA just by looking at Naviance and checking demonstrated interest boxes. My kid had white/Asian female friends sitting in the 4.1-4.2 range who didn’t even bother to apply to WM because they knew they weren’t getting in and/or they didn’t want it enough to jump through the extra essay, interview, campus visit hoops.
The clear cut off, plus the fact it is the smallest T-whatever public university in the US and attracts a certain type of kid makes its applicant pool pretty self selecting.
Oddly, the same not really there on stats/ not applying to WM kids will often apply to UVA. Not sure why. I’m sure not having the extra essay helps. As does the fact UVA is more of a traditional flagship and WM attracts kids who want more undergrad focus, small classes, etc. and less big sports / highly visible Greek life.
But, statistically, it's more difficult to get into UVA.
UVA's admissions rate is lower, but the stats are pretty much even.
75th/50th/25th for SAT is 1520/1470/1410 for UVA vs 1530/1470/1400 for W&M. GPA is 4.5/4.4/4.2 for UVA vs 4.53/4.35/4.18 for W&M.
https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp
Actually UVA's admissions rates are much lower at 16% - 18% (12% for OOS; 24% for in-state) out of 60,000 apps. W&M's acceptance rate is 34%, same for in-state and OOS,out of 17,000 apps.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 23:01
Subject: Re:William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I was just thinking about the same question today. At our very competitive FCPS, getting into William and Mary is very, very difficult. There is nowhere near a 40% acceptance rate. I am not sure why the acceptance rate appears so high, because coming from FCPS, I imagine it’s in the 20% range or lower. And only the top kids are applying.
It's more self selective. People who do not have the academic qualifications to get into W&M tend not to apply unlike other a lot of other schools
This. You can tell the cuts offs for WM (and UVA) in Naviance, and it is pretty clear what it takes to be admitted. (VT is a bit different because it doesn’t break out engineering and CS, which are very high stat, from other schools that are not. UVA has a much smaller engineering school). And WM has an optional extra essay that admissions clearly said in my kid’s info session is not optional. And they push demonstrated interest and consider it strongly, which means interviewing, visiting before being admitted, etc. You can a pretty clear idea of whether you will get in from NOVA just by looking at Naviance and checking demonstrated interest boxes. My kid had white/Asian female friends sitting in the 4.1-4.2 range who didn’t even bother to apply to WM because they knew they weren’t getting in and/or they didn’t want it enough to jump through the extra essay, interview, campus visit hoops.
The clear cut off, plus the fact it is the smallest T-whatever public university in the US and attracts a certain type of kid makes its applicant pool pretty self selecting.
Oddly, the same not really there on stats/ not applying to WM kids will often apply to UVA. Not sure why. I’m sure not having the extra essay helps. As does the fact UVA is more of a traditional flagship and WM attracts kids who want more undergrad focus, small classes, etc. and less big sports / highly visible Greek life.
But, statistically, it's more difficult to get into UVA.
UVA's admissions rate is lower, but the stats are pretty much even.
75th/50th/25th for SAT is 1520/1470/1410 for UVA vs 1530/1470/1400 for W&M. GPA is 4.5/4.4/4.2 for UVA vs 4.53/4.35/4.18 for W&M.
https://research.schev.edu//enrollment/B10_FreshmenProfile.asp
Anonymous
11/04/2024 12:03
Subject: William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Our school doesn’t have quarter grades and semester isn’t avail until too late.
Our (public) has quarter grades, but they don’t appear on the final end-of-year transcript. Is it worth having high school counselor send a quarter grade report for ED consideration if it shows all As and a B in tough rigor courses? Or will they not care? (This would show improvement from 3 A- grades, a B and B- from junior year (same rigor) and will be available next week.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 11:59
Subject: William & Mary admission rates
I feel like I’ve heard tales of several kids who were deferred and then get antsy for a decision and end up committing elsewhere before they hear back from W&M. Is the chance pretty high that a deferred kid will get in? I dread deferral for any of those kids who get deferred as a response to ED bc the uncertainty is the worst. And likely the reason they applied ED is because they know what they want and would like to know early if it’s a yes or no in order to avoid that anxiety of the all-year wait.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 11:52
Subject: William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Does W&M consider ED2 to be demonstrating interest as strongly as ED1? If you’re doing ED2 they were clearly not your first choice.
I don’t know for sure, but I don’t think they’d hold ED2 against someone. They don’t know if the student just needed more time to make up their mind, for example, but even if it is a case of not getting into their first choice ED1 somewhere else, and ED2 app indicates they are *now* the top remaining choice.
Kid's friend applied ED2 to W&M last year. It was his first choice, but he waited to take SAT once more to try to get score up. Deferred ED2, then admitted in RD.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 08:52
Subject: William & Mary admission rates
Our school doesn’t have quarter grades and semester isn’t avail until too late.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 07:35
Subject: William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Does W&M consider ED2 to be demonstrating interest as strongly as ED1? If you’re doing ED2 they were clearly not your first choice.
I don’t know for sure, but I don’t think they’d hold ED2 against someone. They don’t know if the student just needed more time to make up their mind, for example, but even if it is a case of not getting into their first choice ED1 somewhere else, and ED2 app indicates they are *now* the top remaining choice.
I think this is right. It’s still binding so it doesn’t count against you in terms of demonstrating interest and increasing yield. I think though it’s a question of how many spots are available after ED1. My kid is applying this fall and their CCO was explicitly told by W&M that ED gives a material advantage. If your senior year grades will be better than your overall GPA then it can be helpful to go ED2 since they will see fall semester grades in that case. For my DC, fall grades are in line with cumulative GPA so far so ED1 made the most sense.
Anonymous
11/04/2024 07:16
Subject: William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Does W&M consider ED2 to be demonstrating interest as strongly as ED1? If you’re doing ED2 they were clearly not your first choice.
I don’t know for sure, but I don’t think they’d hold ED2 against someone. They don’t know if the student just needed more time to make up their mind, for example, but even if it is a case of not getting into their first choice ED1 somewhere else, and ED2 app indicates they are *now* the top remaining choice.
Anonymous
11/03/2024 21:35
Subject: Re:William & Mary admission rates
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:They're ignoring that thousands of students that aren't anywhere close to being academically qualified for UVA apply every year and are essentially an auto reject. W&M doesn't really get that.
UVA is like the lottery ticket Harvard of Virginia.
UVA is a bigger school with "something for everyone" so why not buy a lottery ticket.
W&M applicants are more self-selecting. It's more niche and not for everyone. People either love it or hate it.
When we toured UVA, I asked random students around campus why they chose UVA. A memorable quote was "I didn't look. I just applied. Many probably apply blindly, without knowing much about the school except for its ranking and reputation, which of course is very attractive. Very different from W&M whose students talked more about the vibe or the strength of the program they were pursuing.
If you look at the yield rates, W&M is lower (again, this is the love it/hate it factor) than UVA, which means they would need to increase their acceptance rates to make their enrollment class- which does make them look less selective (usuall translation- easier to get into) based on that number alone. It is very interesting to see that the stats of the enrolled students in both schools.
Yep my point exactly. W&M is currently in the first year of a yield increase pilot though, so it will be interested to see how that changes things. I'm also curious to see if the new undergrad Marine Science and Computer/Data Science schools will cause application numbers to jump (CS schools usually result in a lot of shotgun applications)
How do you know W&M is currently in the first year of a yield increase pilot?
Board of Visitors discussed it last year
But a "discussion" by the Board means nothing. I'm on several boards for schools. We "discuss" all sorts of ideas.
No this wasn't discussed as a hypothetical, it's something admissions is implementing
This is correct. They are implementing a big yield protection push. I remember seeing it last year when my kid was applying.
I will say that the admitted student swag was great! But they need to work on the days for admitted students aside from the main big one, especially for Monroe Scholars.
Anonymous
11/03/2024 20:55
Subject: William & Mary admission rates
Does W&M consider ED2 to be demonstrating interest as strongly as ED1? If you’re doing ED2 they were clearly not your first choice.