Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw there are plenty of examples of kids of color being failed by the school system itself (for example, being steered into ESL programs when they don't need them) and mountains of research on how teachers treat kids of color differently. So no, it's not just things "outside of school" that are to blame. Everyone should be concerned about MCPS low performing schools and gaslighting people by saying they don't exist is terrible.

? you seem to be blaming teachers for the low test scores of URM, when in fact, it's mostly the home life that is to blame. You can't seriously think that the low test scores for that group is mostly due to teacher bias.

You're suggesting teacher bias plays no role at all. We don't know how much is due to each but there absolutely are educational disparities (and health, and housing, and everything else) by race independent of income. Racism is real, and we know MCPS isn't meeting these kids' needs. It's true that some of these needs may be difficult to meet, but that doesn't mean we should dismiss the low test scores as signs of "bad home life". Most of the Latino students at Kennedy aren't even EML. These are English speaking kids many of which were born here or grew up here most of their lives. We're failing them.

How? How is MCPS responsible for their home life? That 100% impacts them more than anything in MCPS would. Administrators and counselors practically bend over backward to find ways to get kids to come to school consistently. How is this the fault of the school system? There are staff members out in the community trying to help as many families as they can.

+1 MCPS bends over backwards for URMs. They are so focused on the achievement gap that they have lowered the bar for everyone.

Is there some racism involved? Yes. But, you can't convince me that most of the low test scores are due to racism.

Doesn't matter if the kids aren't considered EML or were born here. If the student doesn't care about their education, no amount of hand holding by the teacher is going to help that student get high test scores.

I went to a majority minority HS out west, and most of the kids did not care about school. The AP classes were mostly white/Asian, even as they were the minorities at the school. Most of the disruptive kids were black/brown at our school; most of the fights were between black/brown students.

There were some Asian students who didn't so well in school (I knew several). These kids didn't really care that much about their academics. It had nothing to do with race, and everything to do with how much the kid (and family) valued education.

If you keep blaming the teachers, and pretend like most of the failing academics is because of the teachers rather than the home life, then you will never help those kids.

That's not to say that teachers are 100% blameless. Lord knows I and my kids have had some lackluster teachers who definitely should not be teaching.

I'm not saying we should give up on these kids, but not recognizing the root cause of the issue and looking elsewhere for the blame is not helpful. How can you help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root cause?

I've literally said multiple times the causes are complex. I am not the one not acknowledging the issues. You insist the issues are all outside the school, when the research says there are definitely issues inside schools. So why don't you tell me, how can your help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root CAUSES?

The cause is culture, namely poor culture. Color doesn't matter. Poor culture, whether it's a WV holler or a Baltimore ghetto, has an education aversion and there's not much anyone in schools can do about it. At some point we have to start leaving some kids behind so that the 80% who want to learn aren't hamstring but the 20% who don't.

Also if you really think poor kids that don't want to learn get in the way of other kids learning maybe we shouldn't put all the poor kids in the same schools and all the rich kids in different schools. Unless.ylu really think no poor kids want to learn which is stunningly ignorant and yes, racist.

This happens to a degree with neighborhood schools which is why the W schools are so great. They have a culture of success.

And are you saying all poor people are black? Come on man.

Poverty rates among Black and Hispanic people in Montgomery County are much higher than among White or Asian people. That is the fault of structural racism. So when you concentrate low income people in certain neighborhoods you are mostly concentrating low income Black and Brown kids together.

But you know this since you insist the achievement gap is because of socioeconomic issues and not racism.

I was speaking nationally. But if you want to focus locally, we can do that. Are you really saying that there's a substantial amount of structural racism is super progressive MoCo? Come on man. And no one is concentrated anywhere. Unlike the world you want where the government dictates where people live, people here choose where they live.

Starting with the fact that this is the MCPS board (MCPS is a LOCAL school system) literally everything you said is ignorant and ridiculous.

so, only in MCPS, URM do poorly because of structural racism, but in the rest of the country, kids who do poorly is due to other factors, and not structural racis?

Ignorant and ridiculous, indeed.

-dp

I can't help you either

Anonymous wrote:There are people who will tell you that no public school in MCPS is acceptable. It’s ridiculous. My kids went to Wheaton and Blair and got great educations.

Anonymous wrote:And how would all these people posting actually KNOW the difference, u less they've sent their kids to both? You're only hearing from those saying "we went to a non-W and it was fine." Same as me saying we went to a W and it was fine. It's anecdotal and irrelevant.

Look at HS graduation rates (if your kid falls into the wrong cohort, will they still graduate?). Look at test scores (what percentage get top test scores/have a chance at top colleges)? And, as others have stated, poverty is the true problem, so look at the percentages of FARMs students.

And, what do we do about poverty? Solving that will be more difficult than solving the elusive opportunity/achievement gap!

Anonymous wrote:OP, I get why you are concerned with the school district and what high school you will be zoned for. But your child is 3. A lot can change in your life between now and when they are going off to middle school or high school. Also, schools get redistricted. You know what they say about the best laid plans. I would not make any financial sacrifices to be in a W district right now. I'd personally want to make sure the elementary school is strong and go from there. And keep in mind, there are all kinds of magnet middle schools and high schools. If your kid is into engineering, they could end up somewhere like Wheaton which has a highly competitive program in that discipline.

Anonymous wrote:Our kids grew up and went to school (ES, MS and HS) in a W cluster. They all had some excellent teachers, some adequate teachers, and some horrible teachers. I imagine it's the same at every school.

They all had good cohorts. One of ours is out of college and is employed at a good job that will pay for grad school and his friends also seem to have what sounds like good jobs.

The other 2 are in college, both top 20 schools. One received merit aid and one did not. All 3 were well prepared for college, found it challenging but not too difficult, made good friend groups in HS that they've so far kept, and made friends in college that we have also met.

I cannot speak to any other clusters, but we moved to Montgomery County (and not DC and not VA) for the schools, and ha e not regretted that choice

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both my dcc kids went from CES -> TPMS magnet -> Blair SMCS and I feel this was much stronger education that what any W could provide and is an option for anyone who is serious about their education.

But it is a lottery. What if your name isn’t picked? Or are you saying it is better to avoid the pressure of Ws by living in DCC and pushing your child to guaranteed magnet admission all the way through.

Obviously the 1000 high achieving kids in W schools and around the county should all sit together in the 100 seats in the magenet. It's so simple!

maybe high-achieving by W standards but most wouldn't make the cut for the magnets.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw there are plenty of examples of kids of color being failed by the school system itself (for example, being steered into ESL programs when they don't need them) and mountains of research on how teachers treat kids of color differently. So no, it's not just things "outside of school" that are to blame. Everyone should be concerned about MCPS low performing schools and gaslighting people by saying they don't exist is terrible.

? you seem to be blaming teachers for the low test scores of URM, when in fact, it's mostly the home life that is to blame. You can't seriously think that the low test scores for that group is mostly due to teacher bias.

You're suggesting teacher bias plays no role at all. We don't know how much is due to each but there absolutely are educational disparities (and health, and housing, and everything else) by race independent of income. Racism is real, and we know MCPS isn't meeting these kids' needs. It's true that some of these needs may be difficult to meet, but that doesn't mean we should dismiss the low test scores as signs of "bad home life". Most of the Latino students at Kennedy aren't even EML. These are English speaking kids many of which were born here or grew up here most of their lives. We're failing them.

How? How is MCPS responsible for their home life? That 100% impacts them more than anything in MCPS would. Administrators and counselors practically bend over backward to find ways to get kids to come to school consistently. How is this the fault of the school system? There are staff members out in the community trying to help as many families as they can.

+1 MCPS bends over backwards for URMs. They are so focused on the achievement gap that they have lowered the bar for everyone.

Is there some racism involved? Yes. But, you can't convince me that most of the low test scores are due to racism.

Doesn't matter if the kids aren't considered EML or were born here. If the student doesn't care about their education, no amount of hand holding by the teacher is going to help that student get high test scores.

I went to a majority minority HS out west, and most of the kids did not care about school. The AP classes were mostly white/Asian, even as they were the minorities at the school. Most of the disruptive kids were black/brown at our school; most of the fights were between black/brown students.

There were some Asian students who didn't so well in school (I knew several). These kids didn't really care that much about their academics. It had nothing to do with race, and everything to do with how much the kid (and family) valued education.

If you keep blaming the teachers, and pretend like most of the failing academics is because of the teachers rather than the home life, then you will never help those kids.

That's not to say that teachers are 100% blameless. Lord knows I and my kids have had some lackluster teachers who definitely should not be teaching.

I'm not saying we should give up on these kids, but not recognizing the root cause of the issue and looking elsewhere for the blame is not helpful. How can you help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root cause?

I've literally said multiple times the causes are complex. I am not the one not acknowledging the issues. You insist the issues are all outside the school, when the research says there are definitely issues inside schools. So why don't you tell me, how can your help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root CAUSES?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw there are plenty of examples of kids of color being failed by the school system itself (for example, being steered into ESL programs when they don't need them) and mountains of research on how teachers treat kids of color differently. So no, it's not just things "outside of school" that are to blame. Everyone should be concerned about MCPS low performing schools and gaslighting people by saying they don't exist is terrible.

? you seem to be blaming teachers for the low test scores of URM, when in fact, it's mostly the home life that is to blame. You can't seriously think that the low test scores for that group is mostly due to teacher bias.

You're suggesting teacher bias plays no role at all. We don't know how much is due to each but there absolutely are educational disparities (and health, and housing, and everything else) by race independent of income. Racism is real, and we know MCPS isn't meeting these kids' needs. It's true that some of these needs may be difficult to meet, but that doesn't mean we should dismiss the low test scores as signs of "bad home life". Most of the Latino students at Kennedy aren't even EML. These are English speaking kids many of which were born here or grew up here most of their lives. We're failing them.

How? How is MCPS responsible for their home life? That 100% impacts them more than anything in MCPS would. Administrators and counselors practically bend over backward to find ways to get kids to come to school consistently. How is this the fault of the school system? There are staff members out in the community trying to help as many families as they can.

+1 MCPS bends over backwards for URMs. They are so focused on the achievement gap that they have lowered the bar for everyone.

Is there some racism involved? Yes. But, you can't convince me that most of the low test scores are due to racism.

Doesn't matter if the kids aren't considered EML or were born here. If the student doesn't care about their education, no amount of hand holding by the teacher is going to help that student get high test scores.

I went to a majority minority HS out west, and most of the kids did not care about school. The AP classes were mostly white/Asian, even as they were the minorities at the school. Most of the disruptive kids were black/brown at our school; most of the fights were between black/brown students.

There were some Asian students who didn't so well in school (I knew several). These kids didn't really care that much about their academics. It had nothing to do with race, and everything to do with how much the kid (and family) valued education.

If you keep blaming the teachers, and pretend like most of the failing academics is because of the teachers rather than the home life, then you will never help those kids.

That's not to say that teachers are 100% blameless. Lord knows I and my kids have had some lackluster teachers who definitely should not be teaching.

I'm not saying we should give up on these kids, but not recognizing the root cause of the issue and looking elsewhere for the blame is not helpful. How can you help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root cause?

I've literally said multiple times the causes are complex. I am not the one not acknowledging the issues. You insist the issues are all outside the school, when the research says there are definitely issues inside schools. So why don't you tell me, how can your help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root CAUSES?

The cause is culture, namely poor culture. Color doesn't matter. Poor culture, whether it's a WV holler or a Baltimore ghetto, has an education aversion and there's not much anyone in schools can do about it. At some point we have to start leaving some kids behind so that the 80% who want to learn aren't hamstring but the 20% who don't.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw there are plenty of examples of kids of color being failed by the school system itself (for example, being steered into ESL programs when they don't need them) and mountains of research on how teachers treat kids of color differently. So no, it's not just things "outside of school" that are to blame. Everyone should be concerned about MCPS low performing schools and gaslighting people by saying they don't exist is terrible.

? you seem to be blaming teachers for the low test scores of URM, when in fact, it's mostly the home life that is to blame. You can't seriously think that the low test scores for that group is mostly due to teacher bias.

You're suggesting teacher bias plays no role at all. We don't know how much is due to each but there absolutely are educational disparities (and health, and housing, and everything else) by race independent of income. Racism is real, and we know MCPS isn't meeting these kids' needs. It's true that some of these needs may be difficult to meet, but that doesn't mean we should dismiss the low test scores as signs of "bad home life". Most of the Latino students at Kennedy aren't even EML. These are English speaking kids many of which were born here or grew up here most of their lives. We're failing them.

How? How is MCPS responsible for their home life? That 100% impacts them more than anything in MCPS would. Administrators and counselors practically bend over backward to find ways to get kids to come to school consistently. How is this the fault of the school system? There are staff members out in the community trying to help as many families as they can.

+1 MCPS bends over backwards for URMs. They are so focused on the achievement gap that they have lowered the bar for everyone.

Is there some racism involved? Yes. But, you can't convince me that most of the low test scores are due to racism.

Doesn't matter if the kids aren't considered EML or were born here. If the student doesn't care about their education, no amount of hand holding by the teacher is going to help that student get high test scores.

I went to a majority minority HS out west, and most of the kids did not care about school. The AP classes were mostly white/Asian, even as they were the minorities at the school. Most of the disruptive kids were black/brown at our school; most of the fights were between black/brown students.

There were some Asian students who didn't so well in school (I knew several). These kids didn't really care that much about their academics. It had nothing to do with race, and everything to do with how much the kid (and family) valued education.

If you keep blaming the teachers, and pretend like most of the failing academics is because of the teachers rather than the home life, then you will never help those kids.

That's not to say that teachers are 100% blameless. Lord knows I and my kids have had some lackluster teachers who definitely should not be teaching.

I'm not saying we should give up on these kids, but not recognizing the root cause of the issue and looking elsewhere for the blame is not helpful. How can you help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root cause?

I've literally said multiple times the causes are complex. I am not the one not acknowledging the issues. You insist the issues are all outside the school, when the research says there are definitely issues inside schools. So why don't you tell me, how can your help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root CAUSES?

The cause is culture, namely poor culture. Color doesn't matter. Poor culture, whether it's a WV holler or a Baltimore ghetto, has an education aversion and there's not much anyone in schools can do about it. At some point we have to start leaving some kids behind so that the 80% who want to learn aren't hamstring but the 20% who don't.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Btw there are plenty of examples of kids of color being failed by the school system itself (for example, being steered into ESL programs when they don't need them) and mountains of research on how teachers treat kids of color differently. So no, it's not just things "outside of school" that are to blame. Everyone should be concerned about MCPS low performing schools and gaslighting people by saying they don't exist is terrible.

? you seem to be blaming teachers for the low test scores of URM, when in fact, it's mostly the home life that is to blame. You can't seriously think that the low test scores for that group is mostly due to teacher bias.

You're suggesting teacher bias plays no role at all. We don't know how much is due to each but there absolutely are educational disparities (and health, and housing, and everything else) by race independent of income. Racism is real, and we know MCPS isn't meeting these kids' needs. It's true that some of these needs may be difficult to meet, but that doesn't mean we should dismiss the low test scores as signs of "bad home life". Most of the Latino students at Kennedy aren't even EML. These are English speaking kids many of which were born here or grew up here most of their lives. We're failing them.

How? How is MCPS responsible for their home life? That 100% impacts them more than anything in MCPS would. Administrators and counselors practically bend over backward to find ways to get kids to come to school consistently. How is this the fault of the school system? There are staff members out in the community trying to help as many families as they can.

+1 MCPS bends over backwards for URMs. They are so focused on the achievement gap that they have lowered the bar for everyone.

Is there some racism involved? Yes. But, you can't convince me that most of the low test scores are due to racism.

Doesn't matter if the kids aren't considered EML or were born here. If the student doesn't care about their education, no amount of hand holding by the teacher is going to help that student get high test scores.

I went to a majority minority HS out west, and most of the kids did not care about school. The AP classes were mostly white/Asian, even as they were the minorities at the school. Most of the disruptive kids were black/brown at our school; most of the fights were between black/brown students.

There were some Asian students who didn't so well in school (I knew several). These kids didn't really care that much about their academics. It had nothing to do with race, and everything to do with how much the kid (and family) valued education.

If you keep blaming the teachers, and pretend like most of the failing academics is because of the teachers rather than the home life, then you will never help those kids.

That's not to say that teachers are 100% blameless. Lord knows I and my kids have had some lackluster teachers who definitely should not be teaching.

I'm not saying we should give up on these kids, but not recognizing the root cause of the issue and looking elsewhere for the blame is not helpful. How can you help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root cause?

I've literally said multiple times the causes are complex. I am not the one not acknowledging the issues. You insist the issues are all outside the school, when the research says there are definitely issues inside schools. So why don't you tell me, how can your help these kids if you won't acknowledge the root CAUSES?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both my dcc kids went from CES -> TPMS magnet -> Blair SMCS and I feel this was much stronger education that what any W could provide and is an option for anyone who is serious about their education.

But it is a lottery. What if your name isn’t picked? Or are you saying it is better to avoid the pressure of Ws by living in DCC and pushing your child to guaranteed magnet admission all the way through.

Obviously the 1000 high achieving kids in W schools and around the county should all sit together in the 100 seats in the magenet. It's so simple!

maybe high-achieving by W standards but most wouldn't make the cut for the magnets.

But the W kids are all high performing!

Sure. At least they're not getting shit in school bathrooms.

Anonymous wrote:Btw there are plenty of examples of kids of color being failed by the school system itself (for example, being steered into ESL programs when they don't need them) and mountains of research on how teachers treat kids of color differently. So no, it's not just things "outside of school" that are to blame. Everyone should be concerned about MCPS low performing schools and gaslighting people by saying they don't exist is terrible.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:RM is great if you can get into the IB program (and the neighborhood kids are basically invited to take the IB classes anyway).

It is a little bit of a rough school. Lots of kids smoking weed jn bathrokm. And fights in hallway are not uncommon. Some issues with cars getting broken into or otherwise damaged. I think still a really good school with lots of really great kids and an incredibly diverse student body and caring administration. But don’t go expecting Candy Land. It’s an urban high school with a mixed income student body.

Tell me you didn't use "urban" as code for "Black and Brown kids". Nobody would describe that area as anything but the definition of suburbia.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both my dcc kids went from CES -> TPMS magnet -> Blair SMCS and I feel this was much stronger education that what any W could provide and is an option for anyone who is serious about their education.

But it is a lottery. What if your name isn’t picked? Or are you saying it is better to avoid the pressure of Ws by living in DCC and pushing your child to guaranteed magnet admission all the way through.

Obviously the 1000 high achieving kids in W schools and around the county should all sit together in the 100 seats in the magenet. It's so simple!

maybe high-achieving by W standards but most wouldn't make the cut for the magnets.

But the W kids are all high performing!