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Anonymous wrote:If we limit housing options that aren’t $2M+ new builds, people cry that the county is losing families with young kids. But if we support new housing, including multi-family dwellings, people cry that the schools will be overcrowded. Which is it? There are ways to make it easier for families with young kids to live in Arlington county, but residents fight it any chance they get.

Let’s say the quiet part out loud. What many residents want are families that can afford $2M+ houses and young adults living in condos or apartments who pay taxes but don’t have kids. I suppose families with young kids crowded into apartments in South Arlington are ok as long as people north of Langston Blvd. don’t have to think about them.

The young families are leaving for single family homes with yards. Neither the $2M new builds or the missing middle six family units will change that

Totally agree. Missing middle isn't going to help keep young families in Arlington. They don't want to live in a 6-plex 2 bedroom condo with no yard and not enough parking for $1.5m. They'll go to Fairfax for a SFH.

Most MM won’t be 6-plex. MANY families live in THs/duplexes.

Move this thread to political. Or delete it. Too much misinformation.

Only 15% of approved MM permits are for duplexes, while about 50% of permits are for 4-6 unit buildings with the most of those being 6 units.

Overall, the greatest number of MM permits are for 6 unit buildings (about 37%).

Most of the approved (and pending) projects are duplex/THs/semi-detached.
https://www.arlingtonva.us/Government/Programs/Building/Permits/EHO/Tracker

There are a limited number of large lots so as time goes on the average # units/building will go down.

WRONG. The percentages I posted are taken from the approved permits on the county site that you linked. Only 15% of approved permits are for duplexes. About 50% of permits are for 4-6 plexes.

I'm right. Look at the link.

There are 14 duplex/TH/semi-detached approved projects. And 13 MF (10 6-plex). 14 > 13

10 D/T/S are proposed and 8 MF. 10 > 8

I'll be waiting patiently for your apology.

I'm not wrong. Five out of 27 approved permits are for duplexes. Thirteen out of 27 approved projects are for 4-6 plexes.

OK. And there are also townhouses and semi-detached homes...

First, I said "Most MM won’t be 6-plex. MANY families live in THs/duplexes."

Then, I said: "Most of the approved (and pending) projects are duplex/THs/semi-detached."

Both are 100% accurate according to the tracker.

14 > 13 approved
10 > 8 under review

Patiently waiting here...

The largest category of housing being built under MM is a 6 unit multi family building. That's the single most popular option.

A plurality isn’t a majority.

Again:
>Many families live in THs/duplexes.
>Most MM won’t be 6-plex.
>Most of the approved (and pending) projects are duplex/THs/semi-detached.

You're lumping together 3-plexes with duplexes. I have serious doubts that young families are going to want to live in what MM is calling a 3 unit townhouse. The lots for these are tiny with no yards and aren't what people think of as a typical townhouse in Arlington. Families will choose Fairfax over these.

Be as pedantic as you want, but the vast majority of MM housing isnt anything a family would choose.

You’re mad because you misread what I wrote. I very clearly said THs/duplexes from the start.

Families all over the world, and even right here in Arlington, live in smaller THs/duplexes.

Yes, families all over the world live in smaller housing then in the US. A decent percentage of the US populations live in apartment buildings and condos but a higher percentage of people in the US live in larger single family housing, or want to, because that is a part of the American Dream. There is more space in the US then on most other countries. There has been a different idea of what housing should be and what space that we want to have. While the idea might be unique, it is pretty normal for a family to want a bedroom for every child and a yard to play in. People tolerate smaller places when they are younger or have a younger family but as the family grows, they want more space. Arguing that families will eventually suck it up and settle for living in a duplex or 6 plex or whatever because that happens in Europe or Asia or other parts of the world doesn't hold water because that is not the American experience.

Everyone I know who started living in NY City or DC or LA moved to the burbs once their kids were nearing ES because they decided that the confined space of their apartment or condo or townhouse wasn't working for them and they wanted more space. More space was available and they could afford it and they could afford the associated costs (longer commute) so they moved. The people who stayed were the people who could not afford the associated costs or they made enough that they could move to a larger apartment or condo in the city so everyone had more space even if they didn't have the yard.

We looked to buy in Arlington 15 years ago and realized that we could afford a house that needed massive remodeling in Arlington or we could buy a far larger house with a better backyard that required no work in a school boundary that offered an immersion language program for our future kids. And the house was under our budget. We bought in Fairfax County and didn't look back.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What misinfo am I spreading? Our north alrington school does not have homework and thats a fact. And I know that many of the elementary schools do not require homework. I also know Sawnson middle school (where I have a child) does not require much homework.

I'm not sure how that is misinformation? Please let me know which schools do require homework, especially at the elementary level. I'd love to know!!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We don't have any homework in our elementary school in north arlington. And very little in middle.

So you are incorrect!! Most elementarys in arlington do not.

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow such vitriol. I was just curious. We are a young family and about half our block goes to private — if we were doing it again, we would have moved to Fairfax and saved the tuition money.

Combined with less frequent commutes, I wonder if Arlington prices will actually decline.

You are so, so clueless.

Seriously. Starting with, less reject the premise that the schools lack rigor. What an absurd, lazy trope unsupported by any evidence.

They eliminated gifted, zero homework policy, unlimited test retakes, and standards based grading. Rigor ELIMINATED.

Do you actually have a kid in APS? Clearly not.

Because they haven’t eliminated gifts and kids still get homework. And there are not unlimited test retakes.

Stop spreading misinformation.

Some ES schools eliminating homework does not mean that APS eliminated homework. Stop spreading misinformation.

You didn't say "my kids' ES". We were talking about APS and spoke as if there wasn't homework anywhere.

Also you said they:
eliminated gifts - untrue
allow unlimited test retakes - untrue
are doing SBG - untrue

Okay lets pivot a bit:

rather than eliminate, we can say undermine and watered down?

reduced hours allowed and scope of allowed homework: https://www.arlingtonparentsforeducation.org/ape-reports/homework-policy
gifted rebranded to aac and no longer taughter by trained GT teacher but instead handled by classroom teacher and must be made available to all members of the class and the associated overhead that entails
unlimited retakes -- set a floor of 80% as the grade that student can ever get on a test (because they can retake until they get 80%)
SBG is happening at all elemtaries and is going to be expanded to middle school and eventually non-AP high school courses

without questions these are big changes that are unpopular with academically focused parents.

So go scream at your girl Miranda about it. You guys in APE have shown us all that you know how to yell at board members.

Word.

This is spot on.

Anonymous wrote:Families are leaving because they want more space and a backyard. MM is not going to change that preference or stop the outflow. That said, I did pull my kids from APS to go private. It is shocking to me how many families on my block send to private. I moved here 15 years ago and every family was at APS. Most worrisome is that most families did start at APS and then pulled. Private was not their plan. Arlington will be like Alexandria in 25 years - only rich families who send to private and everyone else at declining public schools.

This right here. APS needs to start course correcting. Teachers see it too. APS is not the district that it once even if housing prices are the bigger issue.

Families are leaving because they want more space and a backyard. MM is not going to change that preference or stop the outflow. That said, I did pull my kids from APS to go private. It is shocking to me how many families on my block send to private. I moved here 15 years ago and every family was at APS. Most worrisome is that most families did start at APS and then pulled. Private was not their plan. Arlington will be like Alexandria in 25 years - only rich families who send to private and everyone else at declining public schools.

APS = ACPS. That’s the new world order.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What misinfo am I spreading? Our north alrington school does not have homework and thats a fact. And I know that many of the elementary schools do not require homework. I also know Sawnson middle school (where I have a child) does not require much homework.

I'm not sure how that is misinformation? Please let me know which schools do require homework, especially at the elementary level. I'd love to know!!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We don't have any homework in our elementary school in north arlington. And very little in middle.

So you are incorrect!! Most elementarys in arlington do not.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow such vitriol. I was just curious. We are a young family and about half our block goes to private — if we were doing it again, we would have moved to Fairfax and saved the tuition money.

Combined with less frequent commutes, I wonder if Arlington prices will actually decline.

You are so, so clueless.

Seriously. Starting with, less reject the premise that the schools lack rigor. What an absurd, lazy trope unsupported by any evidence.

They eliminated gifted, zero homework policy, unlimited test retakes, and standards based grading. Rigor ELIMINATED.

Do you actually have a kid in APS? Clearly not.

Because they haven’t eliminated gifts and kids still get homework. And there are not unlimited test retakes.

Stop spreading misinformation.

Some ES schools eliminating homework does not mean that APS eliminated homework. Stop spreading misinformation.

You didn't say "my kids' ES". We were talking about APS and spoke as if there wasn't homework anywhere.

Also you said they:
eliminated gifts - untrue
allow unlimited test retakes - untrue
are doing SBG - untrue

Okay lets pivot a bit:

rather than eliminate, we can say undermine and watered down?

reduced hours allowed and scope of allowed homework: https://www.arlingtonparentsforeducation.org/ape-reports/homework-policy
gifted rebranded to aac and no longer taughter by trained GT teacher but instead handled by classroom teacher and must be made available to all members of the class and the associated overhead that entails
unlimited retakes -- set a floor of 80% as the grade that student can ever get on a test (because they can retake until they get 80%)
SBG is happening at all elemtaries and is going to be expanded to middle school and eventually non-AP high school courses

without questions these are big changes that are unpopular with academically focused parents.

Now I understand why you're spreading misinformation...

I find it hilarious when the APEs reference their own newsletter as fact. Keep classy APE.

PP here, not part of APE. They had links to the policy and PIP and I was too lazy to copy both links on phone. It’s clear the policy lowers the amount of homework allowed, and the PIP limits elementary homework to reading and math. So no project based work like you see in science and social studies in years past. I don’t think they even assign novels to read in elementary school anymore? It’s all “read whateva, 30 mins, we trust you”

I'm curious: is APE's newsletter incorrect? So far, the only defense I have seen in regards to the rigor at APS is that they have added back intensified classes in middle school. That said, my understanding is that all middle schoolers are required to take reading since so many are not at grade level (correct me if this is wrong).

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:LOL you think people move because they're concerned about rigor in schools?

What a clown you are.

This is NOT a way normal people think.

This. It’s because you can get a tear down in Arlignton for $1m or a mansion in ashburn with all of their Va tech friends. Easy choice. Arlington is becoming like
Nyc. Rich and poor that’s it.

Arlington has ALWAYS been way more expensive than Ashburn. Something else has changed. Could be telework increase, but schools could be a factor. But maybe with fewer families overcrowding should ease.

But there comes a tipping point when that high cost is just prohibitive and/or no longer worth it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What misinfo am I spreading? Our north alrington school does not have homework and thats a fact. And I know that many of the elementary schools do not require homework. I also know Sawnson middle school (where I have a child) does not require much homework.

I'm not sure how that is misinformation? Please let me know which schools do require homework, especially at the elementary level. I'd love to know!!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We don't have any homework in our elementary school in north arlington. And very little in middle.

So you are incorrect!! Most elementarys in arlington do not.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow such vitriol. I was just curious. We are a young family and about half our block goes to private — if we were doing it again, we would have moved to Fairfax and saved the tuition money.

Combined with less frequent commutes, I wonder if Arlington prices will actually decline.

You are so, so clueless.

Seriously. Starting with, less reject the premise that the schools lack rigor. What an absurd, lazy trope unsupported by any evidence.

They eliminated gifted, zero homework policy, unlimited test retakes, and standards based grading. Rigor ELIMINATED.

Do you actually have a kid in APS? Clearly not.

Because they haven’t eliminated gifts and kids still get homework. And there are not unlimited test retakes.

Stop spreading misinformation.

Some ES schools eliminating homework does not mean that APS eliminated homework. Stop spreading misinformation.

You didn't say "my kids' ES". We were talking about APS and spoke as if there wasn't homework anywhere.

Also you said they:
eliminated gifts - untrue
allow unlimited test retakes - untrue
are doing SBG - untrue

Okay lets pivot a bit:

rather than eliminate, we can say undermine and watered down?

reduced hours allowed and scope of allowed homework: https://www.arlingtonparentsforeducation.org/ape-reports/homework-policy
gifted rebranded to aac and no longer taughter by trained GT teacher but instead handled by classroom teacher and must be made available to all members of the class and the associated overhead that entails
unlimited retakes -- set a floor of 80% as the grade that student can ever get on a test (because they can retake until they get 80%)
SBG is happening at all elemtaries and is going to be expanded to middle school and eventually non-AP high school courses

without questions these are big changes that are unpopular with academically focused parents.

So go scream at your girl Miranda about it. You guys in APE have shown us all that you know how to yell at board members.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What misinfo am I spreading? Our north alrington school does not have homework and thats a fact. And I know that many of the elementary schools do not require homework. I also know Sawnson middle school (where I have a child) does not require much homework.

I'm not sure how that is misinformation? Please let me know which schools do require homework, especially at the elementary level. I'd love to know!!

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We don't have any homework in our elementary school in north arlington. And very little in middle.

So you are incorrect!! Most elementarys in arlington do not.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow such vitriol. I was just curious. We are a young family and about half our block goes to private — if we were doing it again, we would have moved to Fairfax and saved the tuition money.

Combined with less frequent commutes, I wonder if Arlington prices will actually decline.

You are so, so clueless.

Seriously. Starting with, less reject the premise that the schools lack rigor. What an absurd, lazy trope unsupported by any evidence.

They eliminated gifted, zero homework policy, unlimited test retakes, and standards based grading. Rigor ELIMINATED.

Do you actually have a kid in APS? Clearly not.

Because they haven’t eliminated gifts and kids still get homework. And there are not unlimited test retakes.

Stop spreading misinformation.

Some ES schools eliminating homework does not mean that APS eliminated homework. Stop spreading misinformation.

You didn't say "my kids' ES". We were talking about APS and spoke as if there wasn't homework anywhere.

Also you said they:
eliminated gifts - untrue
allow unlimited test retakes - untrue
are doing SBG - untrue

Okay lets pivot a bit:

rather than eliminate, we can say undermine and watered down?

reduced hours allowed and scope of allowed homework: https://www.arlingtonparentsforeducation.org/ape-reports/homework-policy
gifted rebranded to aac and no longer taughter by trained GT teacher but instead handled by classroom teacher and must be made available to all members of the class and the associated overhead that entails
unlimited retakes -- set a floor of 80% as the grade that student can ever get on a test (because they can retake until they get 80%)
SBG is happening at all elemtaries and is going to be expanded to middle school and eventually non-AP high school courses

without questions these are big changes that are unpopular with academically focused parents.

Now I understand why you're spreading misinformation...

I find it hilarious when the APEs reference their own newsletter as fact. Keep classy APE.

Anonymous wrote:They eliminated gifted, zero homework policy, unlimited test retakes, and standards based grading. Rigor ELIMINATED.

This is spreading misinformation. "Gifted" is not eliminated. "Gifted" based on what YOU think it should look like in schools is not what APS uses as the model.