Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What’s the difference between a group of daycare kids who play on the playground for several hours a day being watched by people who make $15-25/hr and a group of nannies who meet at the same neighborhood park every day? The difference to the kids is Zilch!

What’s the difference between a nanny share with 3 kids that doesn’t meet at my house and an in-home daycare with 3 kids and 1 caregiver? The difference my kid is Zilch.

The only difference I can see is that to some people the middle aged white woman at the church preschool who has been teaching for 20 years is somehow superior to the 24 yr old Black woman who has a community college certificate in early education and is working at Bright Horizons until she earns enough money to get a 4 yr degree to teach elementary school. Having participated in a variety of childcare scenarios, the main difference I see in preschool teachers vs daycare worker, nanny, or au pair is not their qualifications and educational background. It’s their age and ethnicity. Preschool teachers tend to be older and whiter because that is who can afford to work part time hours. Somehow looking like the stereotypical teacher from a picture book commands more respect.

I think anyone wringing their hands about “group learning is not evidence based before 3” and “children do best one on one” and “PRE school is DIFFERENT!” are actually saying -
1. I can afford to not work / work part time / pay a nanny.
2. I place a premium on having my children cared for by white native English speakers.
3. I want my children to be socialized with other children whose parents share the same privileges and priorities.
4. The fact that children thrive in a wide variety of care scenarios is a threat to my choice for my family.
5. If another kid is securely attached, well socialized, and well prepared for school despite their parent’s inferior choice of childcare, then what was my sacrifice even for?

Oh I love this post. PP, A+.

+1 Amen

Anonymous wrote:The law defines these programs very specifically.

For example, in Alexandria, these 2 very different programs are both "child day centers:"

Bright Horizons Old Town https://dss.virginia.gov/facility/search/cc2.cgi?rm=Details;ID=41241;search_keywords_name=alexandria;search_require_client_code-2101=1

Westminster Weekday Preschool https://dss.virginia.gov/facility/search/cc2.cgi?rm=Details;ID=16029;search_exact_fips=510;search_keywords_name=preschool;search_require_client_code-2101=1

This one is a "religious exempt child day center:"

St. Paul's Episcopal Preschool https://dss.virginia.gov/facility/search/cc2.cgi?rm=Details;ID=42004;search_require_client_code-2105=1;search_exact_fips=510

Although they all have serve preschool-aged children, none of them is a "preschool" as defined by law.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The data just doesn’t support group learning before age 3 or so. If your goal is to ‘school’ a two year old you would hire a nanny because they are learning from a single caregiver and not from peers. The peers are only competitors for the caregivers attention. Any center that is trying to sell you on STEM classes for 2 year olds is ripping you off. They are usually just trying to distract you from the caregiver ratio.

Look for a high caregiver ratio not a curriculum or ‘school’ before age 3/4. Often an in-home daycare is better in this regard, frankly.

After age 3/4 they do learn from peers so there is definite benefit to a school environment.

Let’s just be honest about the tough choices all parents make and not let an industry try to sell us on non-evidence based nonsense.

https://criticalscience.medium.com/on-the-science-of-daycare-4d1ab4c2efb4#:~:text=Children%20spending%20long%20hours%20in,negative%20effect%20on%20later%20behavior.

If you actually read the studies cited on this blog post you'll see "the data" is not nearly as definitive as the author makes it sound. Talk to any speech therapist that works with young toddlers and they will tell you many 1 year olds with expressive language delays magically start talking when they are in a group setting. Just because they aren't playing cooperatively yet doesn't mean they aren't learning from each other.

NP here. I’m a mom of 3 and my youngest (currently 18 months) is by far my most verbally and socially advanced toddler. I totally credit this to having older siblings + their friends around all the time. She is so aware/interested in what these kids are doing and repeats words/tries to talk to them all the time. When we go to the pool or library story time, she is the outgoing kid walking up to others trying to share toys and waving and saying “hi.” She is currently in a nanny share, but we’re looking to switch to a group setting soon because I absolutely believe she benefits from social interaction and will do great in a setting with structured activities.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I only find it weird when people use the term “preschool” for a kid under 3 who is clearly going to daycare. I always get the vibe that they’re self conscious that their kid is going to daycare so they rebrand it as “school.” I say this as someone with a kid in daycare—it’s not school and it’s not supposed to be.

So what should I call where my DD goes? Her childcare center starts at 18 months and offers part time and full time options that largely follow the public school calendar. In fact you apply for admission in the spring to start when school goes back. Summer enrollment is optional. The staff call themselves teachers and there is a curriculum. I call it her preschool because she thinks she is in school like her older sibling in public school. I’ve sent my oldest to a daycare that started at infant age so I have zero problems with daycare FWIW.

It just seems like people are unnecessarily trying to gate keep what can be called school when really the kids are learning at all sorts of centers. Personally I don’t really care if someone calls their childcare a daycare or a school.

Dp. You answered your own question. Fwiw I think there is a good debate about what the terms mean and gatekeeping, but the alternative language isn't hard to come up with.

However, that language is not widely used by parents or children. Don't know of any 4 year olds that say "I don't want to go to my childcare center!"

Your four year old is probably going to a preschool, unlike that 18 month old in a different part of the center.

If you don't like the word daycare, you could say, "I gotta pick my kid up from childcare," on your way out of work. You, as an adult, can even say daycare or childcare to other adults while your child says school.

Or just call it school for everyone as it sounds like you prefer?

You do have options, though. It's not like you have to say school to other adults just because your kid likes to call it school.

I also don’t have to call it daycare just because you don’t like my word choices.

Anonymous wrote:What’s the difference between a group of daycare kids who play on the playground for several hours a day being watched by people who make $15-25/hr and a group of nannies who meet at the same neighborhood park every day? The difference to the kids is Zilch!

What’s the difference between a nanny share with 3 kids that doesn’t meet at my house and an in-home daycare with 3 kids and 1 caregiver? The difference my kid is Zilch.

The only difference I can see is that to some people the middle aged white woman at the church preschool who has been teaching for 20 years is somehow superior to the 24 yr old Black woman who has a community college certificate in early education and is working at Bright Horizons until she earns enough money to get a 4 yr degree to teach elementary school. Having participated in a variety of childcare scenarios, the main difference I see in preschool teachers vs daycare worker, nanny, or au pair is not their qualifications and educational background. It’s their age and ethnicity. Preschool teachers tend to be older and whiter because that is who can afford to work part time hours. Somehow looking like the stereotypical teacher from a picture book commands more respect.

I think anyone wringing their hands about “group learning is not evidence based before 3” and “children do best one on one” and “PRE school is DIFFERENT!” are actually saying -
1. I can afford to not work / work part time / pay a nanny.
2. I place a premium on having my children cared for by white native English speakers.
3. I want my children to be socialized with other children whose parents share the same privileges and priorities.
4. The fact that children thrive in a wide variety of care scenarios is a threat to my choice for my family.
5. If another kid is securely attached, well socialized, and well prepared for school despite their parent’s inferior choice of childcare, then what was my sacrifice even for?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I only find it weird when people use the term “preschool” for a kid under 3 who is clearly going to daycare. I always get the vibe that they’re self conscious that their kid is going to daycare so they rebrand it as “school.” I say this as someone with a kid in daycare—it’s not school and it’s not supposed to be.

So what should I call where my DD goes? Her childcare center starts at 18 months and offers part time and full time options that largely follow the public school calendar. In fact you apply for admission in the spring to start when school goes back. Summer enrollment is optional. The staff call themselves teachers and there is a curriculum. I call it her preschool because she thinks she is in school like her older sibling in public school. I’ve sent my oldest to a daycare that started at infant age so I have zero problems with daycare FWIW.

It just seems like people are unnecessarily trying to gate keep what can be called school when really the kids are learning at all sorts of centers. Personally I don’t really care if someone calls their childcare a daycare or a school.

Dp. You answered your own question. Fwiw I think there is a good debate about what the terms mean and gatekeeping, but the alternative language isn't hard to come up with.

However, that language is not widely used by parents or children. Don't know of any 4 year olds that say "I don't want to go to my childcare center!"

Your four year old is probably going to a preschool, unlike that 18 month old in a different part of the center.

If you don't like the word daycare, you could say, "I gotta pick my kid up from childcare," on your way out of work. You, as an adult, can even say daycare or childcare to other adults while your child says school.

Or just call it school for everyone as it sounds like you prefer?

You do have options, though. It's not like you have to say school to other adults just because your kid likes to call it school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I only find it weird when people use the term “preschool” for a kid under 3 who is clearly going to daycare. I always get the vibe that they’re self conscious that their kid is going to daycare so they rebrand it as “school.” I say this as someone with a kid in daycare—it’s not school and it’s not supposed to be.

So what should I call where my DD goes? Her childcare center starts at 18 months and offers part time and full time options that largely follow the public school calendar. In fact you apply for admission in the spring to start when school goes back. Summer enrollment is optional. The staff call themselves teachers and there is a curriculum. I call it her preschool because she thinks she is in school like her older sibling in public school. I’ve sent my oldest to a daycare that started at infant age so I have zero problems with daycare FWIW.

It just seems like people are unnecessarily trying to gate keep what can be called school when really the kids are learning at all sorts of centers. Personally I don’t really care if someone calls their childcare a daycare or a school.

Dp. You answered your own question. Fwiw I think there is a good debate about what the terms mean and gatekeeping, but the alternative language isn't hard to come up with.

However, that language is not widely used by parents or children. Don't know of any 4 year olds that say "I don't want to go to my childcare center!"

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What’s the difference between a group of daycare kids who play on the playground for several hours a day being watched by people who make $15-25/hr and a group of nannies who meet at the same neighborhood park every day? The difference to the kids is Zilch!

What’s the difference between a nanny share with 3 kids that doesn’t meet at my house and an in-home daycare with 3 kids and 1 caregiver? The difference my kid is Zilch.

The only difference I can see is that to some people the middle aged white woman at the church preschool who has been teaching for 20 years is somehow superior to the 24 yr old Black woman who has a community college certificate in early education and is working at Bright Horizons until she earns enough money to get a 4 yr degree to teach elementary school. Having participated in a variety of childcare scenarios, the main difference I see in preschool teachers vs daycare worker, nanny, or au pair is not their qualifications and educational background. It’s their age and ethnicity. Preschool teachers tend to be older and whiter because that is who can afford to work part time hours. Somehow looking like the stereotypical teacher from a picture book commands more respect.

I think anyone wringing their hands about “group learning is not evidence based before 3” and “children do best one on one” and “PRE school is DIFFERENT!” are actually saying -
1. I can afford to not work / work part time / pay a nanny.
2. I place a premium on having my children cared for by white native English speakers.
3. I want my children to be socialized with other children whose parents share the same privileges and priorities.
4. The fact that children thrive in a wide variety of care scenarios is a threat to my choice for my family.
5. If another kid is securely attached, well socialized, and well prepared for school despite their parent’s inferior choice of childcare, then what was my sacrifice even for?

Oh I love this post. PP, A+.

Anonymous wrote:What’s the difference between a group of daycare kids who play on the playground for several hours a day being watched by people who make $15-25/hr and a group of nannies who meet at the same neighborhood park every day? The difference to the kids is Zilch!

What’s the difference between a nanny share with 3 kids that doesn’t meet at my house and an in-home daycare with 3 kids and 1 caregiver? The difference my kid is Zilch.

The only difference I can see is that to some people the middle aged white woman at the church preschool who has been teaching for 20 years is somehow superior to the 24 yr old Black woman who has a community college certificate in early education and is working at Bright Horizons until she earns enough money to get a 4 yr degree to teach elementary school. Having participated in a variety of childcare scenarios, the main difference I see in preschool teachers vs daycare worker, nanny, or au pair is not their qualifications and educational background. It’s their age and ethnicity. Preschool teachers tend to be older and whiter because that is who can afford to work part time hours. Somehow looking like the stereotypical teacher from a picture book commands more respect.

I think anyone wringing their hands about “group learning is not evidence based before 3” and “children do best one on one” and “PRE school is DIFFERENT!” are actually saying -
1. I can afford to not work / work part time / pay a nanny.
2. I place a premium on having my children cared for by white native English speakers.
3. I want my children to be socialized with other children whose parents share the same privileges and priorities.
4. The fact that children thrive in a wide variety of care scenarios is a threat to my choice for my family.
5. If another kid is securely attached, well socialized, and well prepared for school despite their parent’s inferior choice of childcare, then what was my sacrifice even for?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The data just doesn’t support group learning before age 3 or so. If your goal is to ‘school’ a two year old you would hire a nanny because they are learning from a single caregiver and not from peers. The peers are only competitors for the caregivers attention. Any center that is trying to sell you on STEM classes for 2 year olds is ripping you off. They are usually just trying to distract you from the caregiver ratio.

Look for a high caregiver ratio not a curriculum or ‘school’ before age 3/4. Often an in-home daycare is better in this regard, frankly.

After age 3/4 they do learn from peers so there is definite benefit to a school environment.

Let’s just be honest about the tough choices all parents make and not let an industry try to sell us on non-evidence based nonsense.

https://criticalscience.medium.com/on-the-science-of-daycare-4d1ab4c2efb4#:~:text=Children%20spending%20long%20hours%20in,negative%20effect%20on%20later%20behavior.

If you actually read the studies cited on this blog post you'll see "the data" is not nearly as definitive as the author makes it sound. Talk to any speech therapist that works with young toddlers and they will tell you many 1 year olds with expressive language delays magically start talking when they are in a group setting. Just because they aren't playing cooperatively yet doesn't mean they aren't learning from each other.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I only find it weird when people use the term “preschool” for a kid under 3 who is clearly going to daycare. I always get the vibe that they’re self conscious that their kid is going to daycare so they rebrand it as “school.” I say this as someone with a kid in daycare—it’s not school and it’s not supposed to be.

So what should I call where my DD goes? Her childcare center starts at 18 months and offers part time and full time options that largely follow the public school calendar. In fact you apply for admission in the spring to start when school goes back. Summer enrollment is optional. The staff call themselves teachers and there is a curriculum. I call it her preschool because she thinks she is in school like her older sibling in public school. I’ve sent my oldest to a daycare that started at infant age so I have zero problems with daycare FWIW.

It just seems like people are unnecessarily trying to gate keep what can be called school when really the kids are learning at all sorts of centers. Personally I don’t really care if someone calls their childcare a daycare or a school.

Dp. You answered your own question. Fwiw I think there is a good debate about what the terms mean and gatekeeping, but the alternative language isn't hard to come up with.