Anonymous
04/25/2023 07:58
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:In this thread, a group of people who have no idea how colleges and universities operate. Colleges are complex organizations. Running a residential college is akin to running a small city - those 6500 administrators you site at Princeton - they help keep the lights on, students housed and feed, curriculum certified, research evaluated, data measured, funds raised, and bills paid. If you really want to know, read Power’s “Organization and Administration in Higher Ed.”
Are you saying that’s it requires 2-3 times as many people to do this as it took 25 years ago, even though the number of undergraduates at these institutions are roughly the same?
Yes, because the demands we place on colleges for services are bigger and more complex than 25 years ago.
Especially mental health & tutoring services.
Anonymous
04/25/2023 07:07
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:In this thread, a group of people who have no idea how colleges and universities operate. Colleges are complex organizations. Running a residential college is akin to running a small city - those 6500 administrators you site at Princeton - they help keep the lights on, students housed and feed, curriculum certified, research evaluated, data measured, funds raised, and bills paid. If you really want to know, read Power’s “Organization and Administration in Higher Ed.”
Are you saying that’s it requires 2-3 times as many people to do this as it took 25 years ago, even though the number of undergraduates at these institutions are roughly the same?
Yes, because the demands we place on colleges for services are bigger and more complex than 25 years ago.
Anonymous
04/25/2023 06:59
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:In this thread, a group of people who have no idea how colleges and universities operate. Colleges are complex organizations. Running a residential college is akin to running a small city - those 6500 administrators you site at Princeton - they help keep the lights on, students housed and feed, curriculum certified, research evaluated, data measured, funds raised, and bills paid. If you really want to know, read Power’s “Organization and Administration in Higher Ed.”
Are you saying that’s it requires 2-3 times as many people to do this as it took 25 years ago, even though the number of undergraduates at these institutions are roughly the same?
Anonymous
04/25/2023 06:50
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
In this thread, a group of people who have no idea how colleges and universities operate. Colleges are complex organizations. Running a residential college is akin to running a small city - those 6500 administrators you site at Princeton - they help keep the lights on, students housed and feed, curriculum certified, research evaluated, data measured, funds raised, and bills paid. If you really want to know, read Power’s “Organization and Administration in Higher Ed.”
Anonymous
04/25/2023 06:40
Subject: Re:College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yale has 6500+ administrators
More administrators than undergraduates.
How many of those administrators are running graduate schools and research centers? Also, how many of us expect unfettered access to academic and career advisors? Fast responses to problems? Etc.
I don’t get these alarmist posts about having staff at a big university.
https://yaledailynews.com/blog/2021/11/10/reluctance-on-the-part-of-its-leadership-to-lead-yales-administration-increases-by-nearly-50-percent/
Very few are doing anything important I’d imagine. There’s enough administrators to give each undergraduate their own personal advisor.
People wonder why college costs keep going up faster than inflation; unless these newly hired administrators work for free, this is probably a large part of it.
Anonymous
04/25/2023 06:26
Subject: Re:College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Yale has 6500+ administrators
More administrators than undergraduates.
How many of those administrators are running graduate schools and research centers? Also, how many of us expect unfettered access to academic and career advisors? Fast responses to problems? Etc.
I don’t get these alarmist posts about having staff at a big university.
Anonymous
04/25/2023 03:02
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:The distain for people who choose to work in education across the DCUM forums is so sad.
The reality is that, at current pay rates, education (higher education & k-12) aren’t attracting the best & the brightest in most settings.
Are you willing to pay more in taxes or tuition?
No. I think schools should have harder applications so fewer kids apply. And I think standardized test scores should play a bigger role to cull a batch of apps.
YES!
Anonymous
04/24/2023 22:37
Subject: Re:College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Yale has 6500+ administrators
More administrators than undergraduates.
Anonymous
04/24/2023 21:47
Subject: Re:College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Just 4 years ago, the application process to top schools involved submitting at least two good SAT II’s (at least a 760 on each one) related to your subject of interest and SAT or ACT. Nobody was applying to top schools in the general pool without at least a 1480.
Anonymous
04/24/2023 21:34
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Will AI take over a lot of it?
In a Northeastern thread, presumably a hater claims mockingly that the school uses data science and AI in student selection.
I'm not sure how much is true, but they actually get to admit high performing kids and the kids choose to stay. Its retention rate is like top 10 and graduation rate is top 25 among national universities. They are able to do this without the annoying additional essay.
If AI thing is true, it seems like actually a good thing.
More school should do it.
Anonymous
04/24/2023 21:14
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Admission staff are usually college's own grads who don't have better job options.
+1
Also typically grew up in the town the college is in.
Anonymous
04/24/2023 21:10
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Univ Prof here. I agree with the main observation of this thread. Admissions offices are being staffed, on average, by poorly trained and poorly educated folks (who are, in general, MUCH less able than folks they are screening). Fact of life and it will not change.
Seriously?
I've yet to meet an admissions person who is "MUCH less able than folks they are screening." I've met a variety of folks with a variety skills - none in the "MUCH less" category.
Also, did you not get the memo that many PT AO staff are work study students and many entry-level FT employees are recent college grads. That reflects more on their professors than anything else.
But if this is the case on your campus, then what steps are you taking to increase pay in order to attract better trained and educated talent (as well as what improvements are you making in your classroom to improve the quality of your college's grads?)?
You should know that universities use HR/admissions offices to staff up on URM so they can meet their URM quotas. They often hire graduates from schools that are ranked far below their own rank. You can do the math on the rest.
Maybe a clue they know rankings don't mean much.
Anonymous
04/24/2023 21:03
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Univ Prof here. I agree with the main observation of this thread. Admissions offices are being staffed, on average, by poorly trained and poorly educated folks (who are, in general, MUCH less able than folks they are screening). Fact of life and it will not change.
Seriously?
I've yet to meet an admissions person who is "MUCH less able than folks they are screening." I've met a variety of folks with a variety skills - none in the "MUCH less" category.
Also, did you not get the memo that many PT AO staff are work study students and many entry-level FT employees are recent college grads. That reflects more on their professors than anything else.
But if this is the case on your campus, then what steps are you taking to increase pay in order to attract better trained and educated talent (as well as what improvements are you making in your classroom to improve the quality of your college's grads?)?
You should know that universities use HR/admissions offices to staff up on URM so they can meet their URM quotas. They often hire graduates from schools that are ranked far below their own rank. You can do the math on the rest.
Anonymous
04/24/2023 20:53
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Will AI take over a lot of it?
Anonymous
04/24/2023 20:37
Subject: College Admissions Staff - Massive turnover
Anonymous wrote:Talk to AOs and many are there because they were confused by the college process themselves and are committed to helping kids through it. Some are living with lots of roommates and scrimping because they believe in the work. Others are from well-off families and have help paying the bills. Plenty are using the education benefit to get graduate degrees while working.
Assuming they lack talent says you don’t know what you’re talking about.
+1