Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Curious - are more LDS women still getting married young, but waiting several years to have kids so that they can get their careers established first? I know one LDS woman like this; she even showed off her implanted birth control in her arm.

Surprisingly, the LDS has no ban or moral issues with birth control as say, the Catholic Church does. But they are taught that having children is essential to God's plan and as such, they do tend to have children younger- but that might have to do with the fact they marry younger? Like if the average couple, both LDS and non-LDS waits 3 years after marriage to have kids...that means the average LDS couple would have kids at 26 since they, on average, get married at 23, whereas the average non-LDS couple gets married at 28 or whatever so they have their kid at 31. if that makes sense?

You are wrong. Go read the history of b.c. in the Mormon church in wiki.

You don't need to go to Wikipedia, just go straight to the source. https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/birth-control?lang=eng

"The decision of how many children to have and when to have them is a private matter for the husband and wife."
Sexual relations within marriage are not only for the purpose of procreation, but also a means of expressing love and strengthening emotional and spiritual ties between husband and wife


ER, no. How would I know about the biannual
meeting with the bishop (who us a lay person serving a 5 year term) if I weren’t LDS? AMA


FALSE. Ask any bishop. Go read

Husband and wife are encouraged to pray and counsel together as they plan their families. Issues to consider include the physical and mental health of the mother and father and their capacity to provide the basic necessities of life for their children.

Decisions about birth control and the consequences of those decisions rest solely with each married couple.

FALSE. Ask any bishop. Go read the 2003 edict. Could not be clearer. You are supposed to turn out as many babies as possible to give spirit children bodies. Of course the church tries to play cute on this issue as it did discriminating against black people - it which justified through 1976 by claiming that black people had asked to be born black, ergo it was ok to discriminate against them and deny the M priesthood. The church’s stance was abhorrent but the PR games even worse. And you are required to deliver scuds this at your meeting with great bishop. You are not supposed to be in bc in the Mormon church.

My dad was the bishop of our ward when I was growing up and I know my parents used BC. I'm not defending the church--I want nothing to do with it as an adult--but the church does not have a blanket ban against BC.

But good Mormons don’t use b.c. And if you do, it’s expected that you will disclose same during your biannual meetings with your bishop. Said bishop will also try to get you off b. c. because you need to be giving bodies to spirit babies

Right. I spent 35 years of my life immersed in the LDS church, went on a mission, dad was a bishop, had a temple recommend...but you know better. Because of your Wikipedia links.

are, no. How would I know about the biannual meeting with the lay bishop if I weren’t LDS? AMA

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Curious - are more LDS women still getting married young, but waiting several years to have kids so that they can get their careers established first? I know one LDS woman like this; she even showed off her implanted birth control in her arm.

Surprisingly, the LDS has no ban or moral issues with birth control as say, the Catholic Church does. But they are taught that having children is essential to God's plan and as such, they do tend to have children younger- but that might have to do with the fact they marry younger? Like if the average couple, both LDS and non-LDS waits 3 years after marriage to have kids...that means the average LDS couple would have kids at 26 since they, on average, get married at 23, whereas the average non-LDS couple gets married at 28 or whatever so they have their kid at 31. if that makes sense?

You are wrong. Go read the history of b.c. in the Mormon church in wiki.

You don't need to go to Wikipedia, just go straight to the source. https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/birth-control?lang=eng

"The decision of how many children to have and when to have them is a private matter for the husband and wife."
Sexual relations within marriage are not only for the purpose of procreation, but also a means of expressing love and strengthening emotional and spiritual ties between husband and wife


ER, no. How would I know about the biannual
meeting with the bishop (who us a lay person serving a 5 year term) if I weren’t LDS? AMA


FALSE. Ask any bishop. Go read

Husband and wife are encouraged to pray and counsel together as they plan their families. Issues to consider include the physical and mental health of the mother and father and their capacity to provide the basic necessities of life for their children.

Decisions about birth control and the consequences of those decisions rest solely with each married couple.

FALSE. Ask any bishop. Go read the 2003 edict. Could not be clearer. You are supposed to turn out as many babies as possible to give spirit children bodies. Of course the church tries to play cute on this issue as it did discriminating against black people - it which justified through 1976 by claiming that black people had asked to be born black, ergo it was ok to discriminate against them and deny the M priesthood. The church’s stance was abhorrent but the PR games even worse. And you are required to deliver scuds this at your meeting with great bishop. You are not supposed to be in bc in the Mormon church.

My dad was the bishop of our ward when I was growing up and I know my parents used BC. I'm not defending the church--I want nothing to do with it as an adult--but the church does not have a blanket ban against BC.

But good Mormons don’t use b.c. And if you do, it’s expected that you will disclose same during your biannual meetings with your bishop. Said bishop will also try to get you off b. c. because you need to be giving bodies to spirit babies

Right. I spent 35 years of my life immersed in the LDS church, went on a mission, dad was a bishop, had a temple recommend...but you know better. Because of your Wikipedia links.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Curious - are more LDS women still getting married young, but waiting several years to have kids so that they can get their careers established first? I know one LDS woman like this; she even showed off her implanted birth control in her arm.

Surprisingly, the LDS has no ban or moral issues with birth control as say, the Catholic Church does. But they are taught that having children is essential to God's plan and as such, they do tend to have children younger- but that might have to do with the fact they marry younger? Like if the average couple, both LDS and non-LDS waits 3 years after marriage to have kids...that means the average LDS couple would have kids at 26 since they, on average, get married at 23, whereas the average non-LDS couple gets married at 28 or whatever so they have their kid at 31. if that makes sense?

You are wrong. Go read the history of b.c. in the Mormon church in wiki.

You don't need to go to Wikipedia, just go straight to the source. https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/birth-control?lang=eng

"The decision of how many children to have and when to have them is a private matter for the husband and wife."
Sexual relations within marriage are not only for the purpose of procreation, but also a means of expressing love and strengthening emotional and spiritual ties between husband and wife.


FALSE. Ask any bishop. Go read

Husband and wife are encouraged to pray and counsel together as they plan their families. Issues to consider include the physical and mental health of the mother and father and their capacity to provide the basic necessities of life for their children.

Decisions about birth control and the consequences of those decisions rest solely with each married couple.

FALSE. Ask any bishop. Go read the 2003 edict. Could not be clearer. You are supposed to turn out as many babies as possible to give spirit children bodies. Of course the church tries to play cute on this issue as it did discriminating against black people - it which justified through 1976 by claiming that black people had asked to be born black, ergo it was ok to discriminate against them and deny the M priesthood. The church’s stance was abhorrent but the PR games even worse. And you are required to deliver scuds this at your meeting with great bishop. You are not supposed to be in bc in the Mormon church.

My dad was the bishop of our ward when I was growing up and I know my parents used BC. I'm not defending the church--I want nothing to do with it as an adult--but the church does not have a blanket ban against BC.

But good Mormons don’t use b.c. And if you do, it’s expected that you will disclose same during your biannual meetings with your bishop. Said bishop will also try to get you off b. c. because you need to be giving bodies to spirit babies

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Note comment from Spencer Kimball:

In the past the use of birth control methods including artificial contraception was explicitly condemned by LDS Church leaders. Beginning in July 1916, apostles were quoted stating that birth control was a "pernicious doctrine" and that "limiting the number of children in a family...is sinful".[103][104] The first time that any approval of a non-abstinence fertility control method was publicly expressed occurred in a 1942 Improvement Era article in which apostle John A. Widtsoe mentioned the rhythm method as an acceptable means of spacing children.[105] In his influential 1956 treatise Doctrines of Salvation, then apostle Joseph Fielding Smith called birth control a wickedness which leads to damnation and caused the downfall of nations. He further stated that an LDS couple that deliberately prevents themselves from having more children after their second or third child is guilty of iniquity which must be punished.[106][107] The 1958 edition of Bruce R. McConkie's popular book Mormon Doctrine stated that all those using condoms or other artificial contraception are "in rebellion against God and are guilty of gross wickedness."[108]: 12  The BYU Honor Code in 1968 stated that "the Church does not approve of any form of birth control."[109] In 1969 the first and only First Presidency statement on birth control was released; it reemphasized that it was "contrary to the teachings of the Church artificially to curtail or prevent the birth of children", though, for the first time there was a clarification that men should be considerate to "conserve" the "health and strength" of their wives when planning families since they carry the "greater responsibility" for bearing and rearing children.[110]

Other discussions of the topic include those by Ezra Taft Benson, who became a church president. He stated that those that advocate for birth control perpetuate types of government that cause famine,[111][112][113]: 540  that couples should not prevent births for selfish reasons,[113]: 543 [114][115] and that a sterilization operation could "jeapordiz[e] your exaltation."[113]: 541 [116][117] As recently as 2003 a church manual was published containing a quote from the late church president Spencer W. Kimball stating that the church does not "condone nor approve of" measures of contraception which greatly "limit the family".[118]

The church's insurance company Deseret Mutual Benefits Administrators which provides coverage for its employees does not cover any form of birth control and will only cover sterilization by vasectomy or tubal ligation for a couple if the woman has already had five children or is over forty.

Not paying for something isn't the same thing as not allowing it.

It’s from wiki.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Curious - are more LDS women still getting married young, but waiting several years to have kids so that they can get their careers established first? I know one LDS woman like this; she even showed off her implanted birth control in her arm.

Surprisingly, the LDS has no ban or moral issues with birth control as say, the Catholic Church does. But they are taught that having children is essential to God's plan and as such, they do tend to have children younger- but that might have to do with the fact they marry younger? Like if the average couple, both LDS and non-LDS waits 3 years after marriage to have kids...that means the average LDS couple would have kids at 26 since they, on average, get married at 23, whereas the average non-LDS couple gets married at 28 or whatever so they have their kid at 31. if that makes sense?

You are wrong. Go read the history of b.c. in the Mormon church in wiki.

You don't need to go to Wikipedia, just go straight to the source. https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/birth-control?lang=eng

"The decision of how many children to have and when to have them is a private matter for the husband and wife."
Sexual relations within marriage are not only for the purpose of procreation, but also a means of expressing love and strengthening emotional and spiritual ties between husband and wife.


FALSE. Ask any bishop. Go read

Husband and wife are encouraged to pray and counsel together as they plan their families. Issues to consider include the physical and mental health of the mother and father and their capacity to provide the basic necessities of life for their children.

Decisions about birth control and the consequences of those decisions rest solely with each married couple.

FALSE. Ask any bishop. Go read the 2003 edict. Could not be clearer. You are supposed to turn out as many babies as possible to give spirit children bodies. Of course the church tries to play cute on this issue as it did discriminating against black people - it which justified through 1976 by claiming that black people had asked to be born black, ergo it was ok to discriminate against them and deny the M priesthood. The church’s stance was abhorrent but the PR games even worse. And you are required to deliver scuds this at your meeting with great bishop. You are not supposed to be in bc in the Mormon church.

My dad was the bishop of our ward when I was growing up and I know my parents used BC. I'm not defending the church--I want nothing to do with it as an adult--but the church does not have a blanket ban against BC.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Note comment from Spencer Kimball:

In the past the use of birth control methods including artificial contraception was explicitly condemned by LDS Church leaders. Beginning in July 1916, apostles were quoted stating that birth control was a "pernicious doctrine" and that "limiting the number of children in a family...is sinful".[103][104] The first time that any approval of a non-abstinence fertility control method was publicly expressed occurred in a 1942 Improvement Era article in which apostle John A. Widtsoe mentioned the rhythm method as an acceptable means of spacing children.[105] In his influential 1956 treatise Doctrines of Salvation, then apostle Joseph Fielding Smith called birth control a wickedness which leads to damnation and caused the downfall of nations. He further stated that an LDS couple that deliberately prevents themselves from having more children after their second or third child is guilty of iniquity which must be punished.[106][107] The 1958 edition of Bruce R. McConkie's popular book Mormon Doctrine stated that all those using condoms or other artificial contraception are "in rebellion against God and are guilty of gross wickedness."[108]: 12  The BYU Honor Code in 1968 stated that "the Church does not approve of any form of birth control."[109] In 1969 the first and only First Presidency statement on birth control was released; it reemphasized that it was "contrary to the teachings of the Church artificially to curtail or prevent the birth of children", though, for the first time there was a clarification that men should be considerate to "conserve" the "health and strength" of their wives when planning families since they carry the "greater responsibility" for bearing and rearing children.[110]

Other discussions of the topic include those by Ezra Taft Benson, who became a church president. He stated that those that advocate for birth control perpetuate types of government that cause famine,[111][112][113]: 540  that couples should not prevent births for selfish reasons,[113]: 543 [114][115] and that a sterilization operation could "jeapordiz[e] your exaltation."[113]: 541 [116][117] As recently as 2003 a church manual was published containing a quote from the late church president Spencer W. Kimball stating that the church does not "condone nor approve of" measures of contraception which greatly "limit the family".[118]

The church's insurance company Deseret Mutual Benefits Administrators which provides coverage for its employees does not cover any form of birth control and will only cover sterilization by vasectomy or tubal ligation for a couple if the woman has already had five children or is over forty.

Not paying for something isn't the same thing as not allowing it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the honor code? Does it actually say no caffeine/coffee/soda?

Why are guys who completed a foreign mission the most desirable?

This is fascinating.

- non-Mormon

Because traditionally the foreign missions went to the guys with better resumes, basically, so more likely to be able to get a good job or go to a top law/med/business school . And it’s kind of circular I guess because certain employers view a foreign mission favorably and want to hire them.

So the missionaries we see around here (in the US) are "not as good?" What about missionaries from other countries that come to the US?

It's not an official "policy", per se, that people with better resumes or involvement go on foreign missions. You don't "apply" to missions or anything like that. You go where you are called, and how the process works is that you submit your papers to the church headquarters, and then after a computer system evaluates your language requests, any health needs, which missions have openings, etc. the 12 apostles then assign you to a mission based on "divine guidance" and "revelation". (insert eye rolls here) Of course, the pattern that the 6'2" blonde former homecoming kings whose dads are bishops tend to get sent to Tahiti or Japan or Paris while the pimply, introverted overweight kids with no "pull" in the church get sent to like...Omaha or Cleveland...is well-documented and kind of a running joke in the church.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the honor code? Does it actually say no caffeine/coffee/soda?

Why are guys who completed a foreign mission the most desirable?

This is fascinating.

- non-Mormon

Because traditionally the foreign missions went to the guys with better resumes, basically, so more likely to be able to get a good job or go to a top law/med/business school . And it’s kind of circular I guess because certain employers view a foreign mission favorably and want to hire them.

So the missionaries we see around here (in the US) are "not as good?" What about missionaries from other countries that come to the US?

It's not an official "policy", per se, that people with better resumes or involvement go on foreign missions. You don't "apply" to missions or anything like that. You go where you are called, and how the process works is that you submit your papers to the church headquarters, and then after a computer system evaluates your language requests, any health needs, which missions have openings, etc. the 12 apostles then assign you to a mission based on "divine guidance" and "revelation". (insert eye rolls here) Of course, the pattern that the 6'2" blonde former homecoming kings whose dads are bishops tend to get sent to Tahiti or Japan or Paris while the pimply, introverted overweight kids with no "pull" in the church get sent to like...Omaha or Cleveland...is well-documented and kind of a running joke in the church.

You pay for your mission too, so rich kids are more likely to be sent to higher cost of living locations.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the honor code? Does it actually say no caffeine/coffee/soda?

Why are guys who completed a foreign mission the most desirable?

This is fascinating.

- non-Mormon

Because traditionally the foreign missions went to the guys with better resumes, basically, so more likely to be able to get a good job or go to a top law/med/business school . And it’s kind of circular I guess because certain employers view a foreign mission favorably and want to hire them.

So the missionaries we see around here (in the US) are "not as good?" What about missionaries from other countries that come to the US?

It's not an official "policy", per se, that people with better resumes or involvement go on foreign missions. You don't "apply" to missions or anything like that. You go where you are called, and how the process works is that you submit your papers to the church headquarters, and then after a computer system evaluates your language requests, any health needs, which missions have openings, etc. the 12 apostles then assign you to a mission based on "divine guidance" and "revelation". (insert eye rolls here) Of course, the pattern that the 6'2" blonde former homecoming kings whose dads are bishops tend to get sent to Tahiti or Japan or Paris while the pimply, introverted overweight kids with no "pull" in the church get sent to like...Omaha or Cleveland...is well-documented and kind of a running joke in the church.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the honor code? Does it actually say no caffeine/coffee/soda?

Why are guys who completed a foreign mission the most desirable?

This is fascinating.

- non-Mormon

Because traditionally the foreign missions went to the guys with better resumes, basically, so more likely to be able to get a good job or go to a top law/med/business school . And it’s kind of circular I guess because certain employers view a foreign mission favorably and want to hire them.

So the missionaries we see around here (in the US) are "not as good?" What about missionaries from other countries that come to the US?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the honor code? Does it actually say no caffeine/coffee/soda?

Why are guys who completed a foreign mission the most desirable?

This is fascinating.

- non-Mormon

Yes, the honor code does say no caffeine. Non caffeinated sodas (like Sprite) are fine. The honor code also prohibits sexual relations before marriage. In 2011 a star from their basketball team was kicked off because he had pre-marital sexual relations with his girlfriend. https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/news/story?id=6175090

I'm in my mid 40's now, but grew up with a lot of friends that went to BYU. I know that while most freshmen live in lived in the dorms, most upper classmen got off campus apartments. With the BYU honor code, your off campus housing had to meet certain standards--entire apartment complexes would separate "male apartments" on one side and "female apartments" on another side. No way could a mixed group (even if they were "just friends) rent an apartment together.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the honor code? Does it actually say no caffeine/coffee/soda?

Why are guys who completed a foreign mission the most desirable?

This is fascinating.

- non-Mormon

Yes, the honor code does say no caffeine. Non caffeinated sodas (like Sprite) are fine. The honor code also prohibits sexual relations before marriage. In 2011 a star from their basketball team was kicked off because he had pre-marital sexual relations with his girlfriend. https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/news/story?id=6175090

I'm in my mid 40's now, but grew up with a lot of friends that went to BYU. I know that while most freshmen live in lived in the dorms, most upper classmen got off campus apartments. With the BYU honor code, your off campus housing had to meet certain standards--entire apartment complexes would separate "male apartments" on one side and "female apartments" on another side. No way could a mixed group (even if they were "just friends) rent an apartment together.

I stumbled upon the BYU subreddit somehow once and there were lots of posts about “married student housing.” Apparently you can’t just move off campus, you have to go with an “approved” landlord who knows the rules the students are expected to follow. Is this true?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the honor code? Does it actually say no caffeine/coffee/soda?

Why are guys who completed a foreign mission the most desirable?

This is fascinating.

- non-Mormon

Yes, the honor code does say no caffeine. Non caffeinated sodas (like Sprite) are fine. The honor code also prohibits sexual relations before marriage. In 2011 a star from their basketball team was kicked off because he had pre-marital sexual relations with his girlfriend. https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/news/story?id=6175090

I'm in my mid 40's now, but grew up with a lot of friends that went to BYU. I know that while most freshmen live in lived in the dorms, most upper classmen got off campus apartments. With the BYU honor code, your off campus housing had to meet certain standards--entire apartment complexes would separate "male apartments" on one side and "female apartments" on another side. No way could a mixed group (even if they were "just friends) rent an apartment together.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What is the honor code? Does it actually say no caffeine/coffee/soda?

Why are guys who completed a foreign mission the most desirable?

This is fascinating.

- non-Mormon

Because traditionally the foreign missions went to the guys with better resumes, basically, so more likely to be able to get a good job or go to a top law/med/business school . And it’s kind of circular I guess because certain employers view a foreign mission favorably and want to hire them.