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Anonymous wrote:I just read an article that staff at Alice Deal in DC chose to eliminate reading full novels from the 8th grade curriculum.

last year's 8th grade at Maret did not read a full book or write a full essay until the end of year.

Wow! At our ‘mediocre (to those on this forum)’ TX private school they read 6 novels in class and 2 out class. Perhaps we aren’t as provincial in TX as the snobs in DC think.

WHY are you here?

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Anonymous wrote:Because public school class sizes are huge, there's a range of abilities that is impossible for even the most seasoned teacher to accommodate, and well behaved kids who are on or above grade level are ignored. The established private schools aren't stupid and have done a good job advertising to UMC families of solid students who are increasingly fed up. Throw in a modest merit scholarship for the ones with top grades and test scores and it's not a hard sell.

There are not merit scholarships for top grades at local independent schools

Huh? There are definitely merit scholarships for local private high schools.

Below the high school level, it's not called a merit scholarship but the FA decision is often not *solely* about need, which makes a segment of DCUM crazy but is true nonetheless. Schools use FA to keep students they want to keep, including those who boost test scores or fill out the advanced track classes.

PP. Only the Catholic schools. Which is not what most of us think of when we say the words “private school”.

You cannot name an independent school in DC/MD that hands out true merit money to smart applicants as an enticement. It’s flat out not allowed in AISGW.

Really?

Why is that?

Because most of the public would label these “catholic schools” or “parochial schools.” In the DMV. “Going private” in actual parlance with your DMV neighbor does not include “going to St. Bernadette parish school k-8.”

They have an entirely different mission than independent private schools. A different funding structure aided in most cases by a diocese.

But yes, technically catholic schools are a subset of “private” schools in that there is no by-right attendance like a public school. Technically. But the not-religious crowd doesn’t think of them that way.

So is a Quaker school with Quaker values/mission a private school? An Episcopal school situated on the grounds of a cathedral? How about a Catholic school that does not receive diocesan support?

If there’s a distinguishing factor, it’s the question of how independent a given school is from a central authority that can call the shots and assign revenue.

Stone Ridge and GP and I think Visi have been argued on DCUM to be independent. Blessed Sacrament is parochial.

The PP’s distinguishing factor is that a school is Catholic, and if it is, it isn’t private. Because…?

I am the PP. i have already said that a Catholic school in the DMV is technically “private.” Of course it is, you pay money and a gatekeeper decides if you are admitted or not.

But. Catholic schools in the DMV are not what the general public thinks of when they say “Joe sends his kids to private schools.” They just aren’t. They’d say “joe sends his kids to Catholic school” or “to Gonzaga.”

Why? I don’t know but I suspect the distinction has something to do with the amount of religious education and mandatory religious observance one finds inside the various schools. It’s not “bigoted” to point out that these features are more prominent in a Catholic school than a Quaker school. Or STA.

Some, many, parents dont view these schools as interchangeable.

You are ridiculous. Truly.

Quality of education in public has deteriorated. Our HS zoning is one of the best in MD, but only b/c it is a magnet. If you are not in the magnet, your kid is a second class citizen. Also, more kids struggle with attention (diagnosed and undiagnosed) so those who can, go to private for the smaller classes = fewer distractions. But private schools have so many kids with attention issues that it is really a moot point.

We send our kids to private because we do not think MCPS can provide the type of educational experience we want for our children. They started in MCPS, but we left after elementary. It’s a stretch for us but we believe it’s worth it—kids are being challenged, they are playing sports, there’s a school wide culture of service, there’s discipline, the calendar makes sense, communication is good, teachers are excellent, the school responds to parent issues, and socially DCs have made great friends. No regrets

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Anonymous wrote:Public school parent here - sorry to intrude. I just saw this under "recent topics."

I beg your indulgence. FWIW, I can definitely afford private school for my kids! For better or worse, I choose not to.

If OP's facts are correct, I find the increasing demand for privates school curious, too. I'm not certain the college outcomes are that much better when you account for family wealth and education. In fact, private school outcomes might be worse when you make those accounts.

It's true that class sizes are too big in public school. There are also some unpleasant and weird kids. But tough situations teach resilience that can be useful later in life.

Just saying I'm surprised we're not at an equilibrium, and instead we are in an era of dramatically increasing demand for private school. I guess I would chalk it up to the wealthy getting wealthier.

It is all very interesting and as someone said it’s all anecdotal - but my anecdote is a good friend of mine is a teacher at a top private and said she would never send her kids there because it’s such a bubble that when they get out into the real world they don’t know how to deal with anything. To your point about the benefit of exposing your kids to tougher situations or situations where they have to navigate them and figure them out without too much hand holding.

What a crazy claim to make. I can assure you that kids that go to private schools do just fine in life. There are thousands of adults in the DMV who went to private school who are successful in the “real world.”

Let me help you with this, your teacher friend would "never send her kid to private" because your friend could never afford it. Those who can, do, send their kids to private.

Well actually her husband is very wealthy so they can afford to send their 3 kids to private if they wanted. This was her opinion that she told me privately and I’m sharing but people get very defensive over one person’s opinion.

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Anonymous wrote:Because public school class sizes are huge, there's a range of abilities that is impossible for even the most seasoned teacher to accommodate, and well behaved kids who are on or above grade level are ignored. The established private schools aren't stupid and have done a good job advertising to UMC families of solid students who are increasingly fed up. Throw in a modest merit scholarship for the ones with top grades and test scores and it's not a hard sell.

There are not merit scholarships for top grades at local independent schools

Huh? There are definitely merit scholarships for local private high schools.

Below the high school level, it's not called a merit scholarship but the FA decision is often not *solely* about need, which makes a segment of DCUM crazy but is true nonetheless. Schools use FA to keep students they want to keep, including those who boost test scores or fill out the advanced track classes.

PP. Only the Catholic schools. Which is not what most of us think of when we say the words “private school”.

You cannot name an independent school in DC/MD that hands out true merit money to smart applicants as an enticement. It’s flat out not allowed in AISGW.

Really?

Why is that?

Because most of the public would label these “catholic schools” or “parochial schools.” In the DMV. “Going private” in actual parlance with your DMV neighbor does not include “going to St. Bernadette parish school k-8.”

They have an entirely different mission than independent private schools. A different funding structure aided in most cases by a diocese.

But yes, technically catholic schools are a subset of “private” schools in that there is no by-right attendance like a public school. Technically. But the not-religious crowd doesn’t think of them that way.

So is a Quaker school with Quaker values/mission a private school? An Episcopal school situated on the grounds of a cathedral? How about a Catholic school that does not receive diocesan support?

If there’s a distinguishing factor, it’s the question of how independent a given school is from a central authority that can call the shots and assign revenue.

Stone Ridge and GP and I think Visi have been argued on DCUM to be independent. Blessed Sacrament is parochial.

The PP’s distinguishing factor is that a school is Catholic, and if it is, it isn’t private. Because…?

I am the PP. i have already said that a Catholic school in the DMV is technically “private.” Of course it is, you pay money and a gatekeeper decides if you are admitted or not.

But. Catholic schools in the DMV are not what the general public thinks of when they say “Joe sends his kids to private schools.” They just aren’t. They’d say “joe sends his kids to Catholic school” or “to Gonzaga.”

Why? I don’t know but I suspect the distinction has something to do with the amount of religious education and mandatory religious observance one finds inside the various schools. It’s not “bigoted” to point out that these features are more prominent in a Catholic school than a Quaker school. Or STA.

Some, many, parents dont view these schools as interchangeable.

So, “schools i would consider vs schools I would never consider.” That doesn’t make them public just because you look down on them.

Anonymous wrote:When I think public vs. private, Catholic schools are in the private bucket. Then I might subdivide into religious and secular, then further divide the religious into different religions or denominations, such as Episcopal, Quaker, Catholic. And I am the general public.

This is what it means. That PP is just making up their own rule. It’s public vs private and some privates are independent and some aren’t, like parochial schools.

When I think public vs. private, Catholic schools are in the private bucket. Then I might subdivide into religious and secular, then further divide the religious into different religions or denominations, such as Episcopal, Quaker, Catholic. And I am the general public.

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Anonymous wrote:Public school parent here - sorry to intrude. I just saw this under "recent topics."

I beg your indulgence. FWIW, I can definitely afford private school for my kids! For better or worse, I choose not to.

If OP's facts are correct, I find the increasing demand for privates school curious, too. I'm not certain the college outcomes are that much better when you account for family wealth and education. In fact, private school outcomes might be worse when you make those accounts.

It's true that class sizes are too big in public school. There are also some unpleasant and weird kids. But tough situations teach resilience that can be useful later in life.

Just saying I'm surprised we're not at an equilibrium, and instead we are in an era of dramatically increasing demand for private school. I guess I would chalk it up to the wealthy getting wealthier.

It is all very interesting and as someone said it’s all anecdotal - but my anecdote is a good friend of mine is a teacher at a top private and said she would never send her kids there because it’s such a bubble that when they get out into the real world they don’t know how to deal with anything. To your point about the benefit of exposing your kids to tougher situations or situations where they have to navigate them and figure them out without too much hand holding.

What a crazy claim to make. I can assure you that kids that go to private schools do just fine in life. There are thousands of adults in the DMV who went to private school who are successful in the “real world.”

Let me help you with this, your teacher friend would "never send her kid to private" because your friend could never afford it. Those who can, do, send their kids to private.

Huh? You really think all of the families at Churchill Langley etc just can’t afford private and that’s why the kids are there..laughable

Reading is fundamental. PP’s friend is a teacher, at a private school where salaries are even lower than public school teacher salaries. SHE could not afford to spend $50-$60k a year after taxes on each kid. No one is talking about rando Langley tech execs

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Because public school class sizes are huge, there's a range of abilities that is impossible for even the most seasoned teacher to accommodate, and well behaved kids who are on or above grade level are ignored. The established private schools aren't stupid and have done a good job advertising to UMC families of solid students who are increasingly fed up. Throw in a modest merit scholarship for the ones with top grades and test scores and it's not a hard sell.

There are not merit scholarships for top grades at local independent schools

Huh? There are definitely merit scholarships for local private high schools.

Below the high school level, it's not called a merit scholarship but the FA decision is often not *solely* about need, which makes a segment of DCUM crazy but is true nonetheless. Schools use FA to keep students they want to keep, including those who boost test scores or fill out the advanced track classes.

PP. Only the Catholic schools. Which is not what most of us think of when we say the words “private school”.

You cannot name an independent school in DC/MD that hands out true merit money to smart applicants as an enticement. It’s flat out not allowed in AISGW.

Really?

Why is that?

Because most of the public would label these “catholic schools” or “parochial schools.” In the DMV. “Going private” in actual parlance with your DMV neighbor does not include “going to St. Bernadette parish school k-8.”

They have an entirely different mission than independent private schools. A different funding structure aided in most cases by a diocese.

But yes, technically catholic schools are a subset of “private” schools in that there is no by-right attendance like a public school. Technically. But the not-religious crowd doesn’t think of them that way.

So is a Quaker school with Quaker values/mission a private school? An Episcopal school situated on the grounds of a cathedral? How about a Catholic school that does not receive diocesan support?

If there’s a distinguishing factor, it’s the question of how independent a given school is from a central authority that can call the shots and assign revenue.

Stone Ridge and GP and I think Visi have been argued on DCUM to be independent. Blessed Sacrament is parochial.

The PP’s distinguishing factor is that a school is Catholic, and if it is, it isn’t private. Because…?

I am the PP. i have already said that a Catholic school in the DMV is technically “private.” Of course it is, you pay money and a gatekeeper decides if you are admitted or not.

But. Catholic schools in the DMV are not what the general public thinks of when they say “Joe sends his kids to private schools.” They just aren’t. They’d say “joe sends his kids to Catholic school” or “to Gonzaga.”

Why? I don’t know but I suspect the distinction has something to do with the amount of religious education and mandatory religious observance one finds inside the various schools. It’s not “bigoted” to point out that these features are more prominent in a Catholic school than a Quaker school. Or STA.

Some, many, parents dont view these schools as interchangeable.

If you cannot imagine why private schools are in demand, I say this with all love, you must be living under a rock. I'm trying very hard not to be mean.

It's no secret over years, in general, mainstream K-12 public education has hit huge road blocks. Some neighborhoods will have schools who fare better for certain but unless you have perfect kids, it will be hard no matter what school. Also, culturally, I think a lot of families esp UMC are seeking the "safety" academically of private v. public schools. It's really hard to justify going to public unless your public is heads and shoulders above and even then, unless your kid is taking all AP/honors and a terrific kid all around, be assured that they won't fall through the cracks somehow, somewhere along the way.

I would love my kids to go to public, unfortunately, I just don't trust public. And I say this with lifelong close friends who teach public HS.

I 100% believe that private is the way to go and more and more, we will all see a decay in public across the board regardless of community because more and more "good" families will opt for private. I'm not suggesting this is right or wrong but as a parent, it can be a hard choice to not go private, esp if you can afford it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Public school parent here - sorry to intrude. I just saw this under "recent topics."

I beg your indulgence. FWIW, I can definitely afford private school for my kids! For better or worse, I choose not to.

If OP's facts are correct, I find the increasing demand for privates school curious, too. I'm not certain the college outcomes are that much better when you account for family wealth and education. In fact, private school outcomes might be worse when you make those accounts.

It's true that class sizes are too big in public school. There are also some unpleasant and weird kids. But tough situations teach resilience that can be useful later in life.

Just saying I'm surprised we're not at an equilibrium, and instead we are in an era of dramatically increasing demand for private school. I guess I would chalk it up to the wealthy getting wealthier.

It is all very interesting and as someone said it’s all anecdotal - but my anecdote is a good friend of mine is a teacher at a top private and said she would never send her kids there because it’s such a bubble that when they get out into the real world they don’t know how to deal with anything. To your point about the benefit of exposing your kids to tougher situations or situations where they have to navigate them and figure them out without too much hand holding.

What a crazy claim to make. I can assure you that kids that go to private schools do just fine in life. There are thousands of adults in the DMV who went to private school who are successful in the “real world.”

Let me help you with this, your teacher friend would "never send her kid to private" because your friend could never afford it. Those who can, do, send their kids to private.

Huh? You really think all of the families at Churchill Langley etc just can’t afford private and that’s why the kids are there..laughable

Yes I do actually think that. Or couldn't get a good student aid package.

Anonymous wrote:I just read an article that staff at Alice Deal in DC chose to eliminate reading full novels from the 8th grade curriculum.

That was an opinion piece and the Deal teachers are saying it was incorrect.

Anonymous wrote:When they stopped tracking and did honors for all, people who have $ are leaving. I went to public schools in Moco and believe in public education but I'm seeing it degraded so much from my time. Too many kids; too many discipline problems and not high enough expectations. We are not in MS yet but seriously considering going private. My kids aren't super duper gifted, but they are good, call and hardworking students who like school but would do so much better with smaller glasses and a peer group that's focused on learning.

This is why we left, plus teachers being stripped of all input on curriculum and how it is taught. Private school is a desirable product.

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Public school parent here - sorry to intrude. I just saw this under "recent topics."

I beg your indulgence. FWIW, I can definitely afford private school for my kids! For better or worse, I choose not to.

If OP's facts are correct, I find the increasing demand for privates school curious, too. I'm not certain the college outcomes are that much better when you account for family wealth and education. In fact, private school outcomes might be worse when you make those accounts.

It's true that class sizes are too big in public school. There are also some unpleasant and weird kids. But tough situations teach resilience that can be useful later in life.

Just saying I'm surprised we're not at an equilibrium, and instead we are in an era of dramatically increasing demand for private school. I guess I would chalk it up to the wealthy getting wealthier.

It is all very interesting and as someone said it’s all anecdotal - but my anecdote is a good friend of mine is a teacher at a top private and said she would never send her kids there because it’s such a bubble that when they get out into the real world they don’t know how to deal with anything. To your point about the benefit of exposing your kids to tougher situations or situations where they have to navigate them and figure them out without too much hand holding.

What a crazy claim to make. I can assure you that kids that go to private schools do just fine in life. There are thousands of adults in the DMV who went to private school who are successful in the “real world.”

Let me help you with this, your teacher friend would "never send her kid to private" because your friend could never afford it. Those who can, do, send their kids to private.

This is often repeated but not always true. I know plenty of people, myself included who can afford to send their kids to private or could with a bit of financial aide and yet don’t. People prioritize other things, like being able to pay for college, or providing outside experiences and extra curricular to go alongside regular education, or setup greater future nest eggs.

Sure.

But the people who can truly afford private school can also afford all those other things you listed. It truly is a subset of the very privileged.

My two cents: it’s sad that public schools can’t raise the bar and operate more like privates. The reality is that those of us who grew up in Montgomery County a million years ago (think: 70s/80s/early 90s) remember when MCPS managed to properly educate the masses. While I went to area privates, I had cousins and neighbors and friends in other parts of the county who went to area publics and they went on to good colleges and grad schools, etc.

Something changed.

And the reality is that we aren’t talking about what changed and how to address it.

Rather, we have families who are fed up with mcps who are now scrambling to jump ship and get their kids into private school…whatever it takes.