So what you’re saying is that Kimball is allocated $5.5M and X number of teacher slots.
And when Kimball fills those X slots, they actually spend less than allocated.
So their actual budget is more like $4.7M.


But I thought principals could move money around — cutting a teacher here to replace with two aides there. Is that not true?

Anonymous wrote: You are conflating budget and salaries. The school's budget does not reflect the salaries of the employees. At all.

PP here, again. My explanation of the problem with average teacher salaries was in response to the person who (incorrectly) stated that DCPS "budgeted this way so schools can’t hire cheaper, less experienced staff to save money." That's just wrong. What happens in reality is that all schools get an "initial allocation" for a certain number of teachers, regardless of how much they actually cost. But higher paid, more experienced teachers end up at schools like Janney, while lower-paid, less experienced teachers end up at schools like Kimball. So when DCPS actually pays the salaries, Janney's school-level expenditures are much higher than Kimball's school-level expenditures. But Kimball doesn't get to keep the difference. So, in the end, when taking into account all funds flowing to schools (including the single biggest cost, labor), Janney gets a lot more money than Kimball.

Believe me, I would LOVE for you to explain how this isn't actually happening.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The amount on the budget reflects the average cost to DCPS of a teacher across the district. Some make more, most make less. It’s budgeted this way so schools can’t hire cheaper, less experienced staff to save money.

It's actually the single biggest explanation for why high-poverty schools get less money than schools serving wealthier families -- more experienced (read: more expensive) teachers tend to go to schools that have fewer at-risk students, whereas schools serving high numbers of at-risk students tend to have high turnover and less experienced teachers. But because DCPS budgets based on average salary and not actual salary, the schools serving the neediest students actually get the least amount of money. For example, Kimball ES gets 5 teachers and Janney gets 5 teachers. But the teachers going to Kimball each cost $50k, while the teachers going to Janney each cost $100k. Doesn't matter -- each school gets 5 teachers. In reality, Janney gets twice as much money as Kimball does, even though it serves a wealthier population. It's terrible.

Wrong. The teachers all cost the same in terms of budgets. A teacher is $X on the school budget - regardless if that teacher actually makes $60K or $100K a year.

PP here. Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. Do you think, using the previous example, that Kimball gets to keep the $250k difference? I promise you they don't.

You are conflating budget and salaries. The school's budget does not reflect the salaries of the employees. At all.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The amount on the budget reflects the average cost to DCPS of a teacher across the district. Some make more, most make less. It’s budgeted this way so schools can’t hire cheaper, less experienced staff to save money.

It's actually the single biggest explanation for why high-poverty schools get less money than schools serving wealthier families -- more experienced (read: more expensive) teachers tend to go to schools that have fewer at-risk students, whereas schools serving high numbers of at-risk students tend to have high turnover and less experienced teachers. But because DCPS budgets based on average salary and not actual salary, the schools serving the neediest students actually get the least amount of money. For example, Kimball ES gets 5 teachers and Janney gets 5 teachers. But the teachers going to Kimball each cost $50k, while the teachers going to Janney each cost $100k. Doesn't matter -- each school gets 5 teachers. In reality, Janney gets twice as much money as Kimball does, even though it serves a wealthier population. It's terrible.

Wrong. The teachers all cost the same in terms of budgets. A teacher is $X on the school budget - regardless if that teacher actually makes $60K or $100K a year.

PP here. Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. Do you think, using the previous example, that Kimball gets to keep the $250k difference? I promise you they don't.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The amount on the budget reflects the average cost to DCPS of a teacher across the district. Some make more, most make less. It’s budgeted this way so schools can’t hire cheaper, less experienced staff to save money.

It's actually the single biggest explanation for why high-poverty schools get less money than schools serving wealthier families -- more experienced (read: more expensive) teachers tend to go to schools that have fewer at-risk students, whereas schools serving high numbers of at-risk students tend to have high turnover and less experienced teachers. But because DCPS budgets based on average salary and not actual salary, the schools serving the neediest students actually get the least amount of money. For example, Kimball ES gets 5 teachers and Janney gets 5 teachers. But the teachers going to Kimball each cost $50k, while the teachers going to Janney each cost $100k. Doesn't matter -- each school gets 5 teachers. In reality, Janney gets twice as much money as Kimball does, even though it serves a wealthier population. It's terrible.

Wrong. The teachers all cost the same in terms of budgets. A teacher is $X on the school budget - regardless if that teacher actually makes $60K or $100K a year.

Anonymous wrote:The amount on the budget reflects the average cost to DCPS of a teacher across the district. Some make more, most make less. It’s budgeted this way so schools can’t hire cheaper, less experienced staff to save money.

It's actually the single biggest explanation for why high-poverty schools get less money than schools serving wealthier families -- more experienced (read: more expensive) teachers tend to go to schools that have fewer at-risk students, whereas schools serving high numbers of at-risk students tend to have high turnover and less experienced teachers. But because DCPS budgets based on average salary and not actual salary, the schools serving the neediest students actually get the least amount of money. For example, Kimball ES gets 5 teachers and Janney gets 5 teachers. But the teachers going to Kimball each cost $50k, while the teachers going to Janney each cost $100k. Doesn't matter -- each school gets 5 teachers. In reality, Janney gets twice as much money as Kimball does, even though it serves a wealthier population. It's terrible.

4% raise in per-child allotment.

DCPS estimates 5% rise this year in costs, mostly labor costs, much due to the rising cost of healthcare.

This is a wealthy city and we rightfully pay our teachers well. Which makes the city a more desirable place to live for families. Which increases the tax base. These things become self-reinforcing.

A 5% rise would have been good. But 4% is fine, I think.

Anonymous wrote:The amount on the budget reflects the average cost to DCPS of a teacher across the district. Some make more, most make less. It’s budgeted this way so schools can’t hire cheaper, less experienced staff to save money.

And includes benefits etc, so not teachers actual salary.

The amount on the budget reflects the average cost to DCPS of a teacher across the district. Some make more, most make less. It’s budgeted this way so schools can’t hire cheaper, less experienced staff to save money.

Anonymous wrote:When I saw it, I assumed it included benefits too. Either way, teachers seem to get paid pretty well in DC!

When you consider the cost of living in this area, DC teachers rank close to the bottom:
https://money.com/best-worst-states-teachers-pay-turnover-ratio/

Anonymous wrote:When I saw it, I assumed it included benefits too. Either way, teachers seem to get paid pretty well in DC!

Yes they do. And IMO they earn every penny.

The cost in the individual school budget for every teacher / admin and staff member is the same placeholder amount. That was done so that a principal wouldn't have an incentive to only hire less experienced teachers or staff members just to save money.

When I saw it, I assumed it included benefits too. Either way, teachers seem to get paid pretty well in DC!

Here are the pay scales for every school position in DCPS -

https://dcps.dc.gov/page/compensation

It is approximate, that is why it is the same for all teachers. I am not sure how it works with paying employer side taxes and benefits, that may come out of this too?

The initial DCPS budget for 2021 is out:
https://www.dcpsdatacenter.com/fy21_initial.html

Does budget reflect the exact salary? for example our principal budget is about 190K, assistant principal about 150k.
Last year principal budget was about 170K and AP 140K. Most teachers are about 120k. Does this include their benefits? what is the actual salary?
It seems like they make good money. I am just curious.

Thanks