Anonymous wrote:No. You are wrong. Just because they acknowledge and apologize for the past it does NOT mean they are less likely to do it again. The pattern will continue.

You get the award for LEAST helpful post! Or, "person who loves to tell people they are wrong". Why must you always emerge on this forum???

No. You are wrong. Just because they acknowledge and apologize for the past it does NOT mean they are less likely to do it again. The pattern will continue.

Mental illness runs in my family.

My sister has been in 30 day residential stays in the past.

98% of the time she is normal but the other 2% of the
time she is clearly revved up bipolar in a manic state.

My take on it is that I don't believe she has any comprehension on how bad it is when she is in that state.

I ended up getting professional counseling on how to handle. Counselor gave me some scripts to say to her
when she needs help.

I now limit contact and I never ride in a car with her.
After one blow up I had a 2 hour car ride and thought
afterwards that I could have been killed.

Now I minimize stressors. For me it is I don't expect apology. One part of mental illness is that the person
that is mental ill does not think they are mentally ill.

I give a lot of space. I've only seen 2 incidences first hand
I think my parents saw a third. After the first the Marines (her employer) put her in a 30 day residential unit.
The second was a meeting with Mom's lawyers after
Dad's death. Two of the lawyers are over 80 years
old so she was threatening senior citizens. It was really
bad. She did not have guns but it was a level of
threats just shy of having guns. It was really weird,
came out of nowhere and very severe mental illness.

Sometimes after these blowups we don't talk for 2-3 years.
I'm ok with it.

I'll never get an apology from her. She never thinks she
is sick. In her case it is part of the mental illness.

Many times we are okay for decades.

God Bless.

Substitute substance abuse and resulting chaos/neediness/crisis/verbal abuse for the specifics in your post OP and you have my situation. I totally get it.

I think you are doing a great job w/ framing this appropriately, setting boundaries, and protecting yourself and your family. REally - a great job.

I have found talking this through w/ a professional to be extremely useful in figuring out how to set my boundaries without guilt, how to free myself from the entanglements of the abusive family I grew up in, etc... Maybe that would be helpful for you also.

But I think you're absolutely on the right track. Good luck.

Anonymous wrote:This describes my older brother. Sister suspects he may be bipolar - I suspect some level of functioning borderline personality.

Regardless, one word: boundaries.

Do not respond when they have an episode. Grey rock. Ignore. Do not feed their hyper emotions.

And you have to do the same during the "nice" phases as well. Do not respond. Ignore. Do not feed their need.

You keep your relationship like business. Factual, not personal. It's sad and you might have to mourn the person they were or the "good" days that person has, but it's the best way to take care of yourself. You can't take the good without taking in the bad - so you have to ignore both.

This. Dispassionate interest. No money. No help. No excitement.

Boundaries.

OP I am so, so sorry you have that horrible past & current situation. It is absolutely NOT okay. You pushing them away will hopefully signal that you and your family need to be treated with respect and you won't just be there no matter what. You are not their scapegoat.
I have a situation with a difficult family member although not as severe as yours, and I have had to push back and create boundaries. It sucks because I still love them. It sucks because every time I think it will get better it still doesn't. It sucks because it would be so nice to have a nice relationship but I can't and won't ignore how I'm treated.
I've learned to find strength and love in others overtime. Wishing you the best OP.

This describes my older brother. Sister suspects he may be bipolar - I suspect some level of functioning borderline personality.

Regardless, one word: boundaries.

Do not respond when they have an episode. Grey rock. Ignore. Do not feed their hyper emotions.

And you have to do the same during the "nice" phases as well. Do not respond. Ignore. Do not feed their need.

You keep your relationship like business. Factual, not personal. It's sad and you might have to mourn the person they were or the "good" days that person has, but it's the best way to take care of yourself. You can't take the good without taking in the bad - so you have to ignore both.

Anonymous wrote:We’re in that situation with my SIL. She’s been hospitalized from time to time, but I’m not aware of any clear diagnosis. Sometimes her symptoms seem to be similar to borderline personality disorder, especially when she creates blow-ups to push us away and then “test” if we’ll still love her. I have a child now so we don’t take her back the way we used to because it’s too hard to expose our kid to these cycles. We keep SIL at arm’s length/low contact. It sucks and I wish we could be close, but it’s too hard on our nuclear family and my MIL to weather the storms that come when we don’t stay low-contact.

Everyone has to find their own tolerance for this kind of situation. Our personal rule is that nothing is permanent and we’re willing to change how we approach SIL as our child becomes older and more things can be explained. I hope you give yourself the flexibility to do that, too. You have at least my permission to step back when it’s too much.

This sounds VERY familiar. I do feel guilty for not passing "the test", and to make things worse it can be tremendously difficult to gage when help is actually needed versus when its just self-inflicted drama. Boundaries are considered "rude" and I am made out to be a cold person somehow because I don't want to accept abuse. The good thing is, is that somehow as time goes one, I care less. But that is sad in its own way.

Anonymous wrote:No experience with this OP. Sorry. A question though: How often do these outbursts happen? Can you see them coming on? I would never allow him in my house--be somewhere where YOU can leave when things escalate,if necessary. I would be hesitant to allow my children (depending on their ages) to witness these explosions.

Sometimes it is in person, sometimes it is over the phone or online. As of yet, it has not happened in front of my children.

Anonymous wrote:We’re in that situation with my SIL. She’s been hospitalized from time to time, but I’m not aware of any clear diagnosis. Sometimes her symptoms seem to be similar to borderline personality disorder, especially when she creates blow-ups to push us away and then “test” if we’ll still love her. I have a child now so we don’t take her back the way we used to because it’s too hard to expose our kid to these cycles. We keep SIL at arm’s length/low contact. It sucks and I wish we could be close, but it’s too hard on our nuclear family and my MIL to weather the storms that come when we don’t stay low-contact.

Everyone has to find their own tolerance for this kind of situation. Our personal rule is that nothing is permanent and we’re willing to change how we approach SIL as our child becomes older and more things can be explained. I hope you give yourself the flexibility to do that, too. You have at least my permission to step back when it’s too much.

Very helpful, thank you.

Anonymous wrote:
Their behavior is not acceptable. There is no right or wrong answer about how to respond to their behavior - do what you think is best. However, I will point out the medical aspect of this: clearly there is a heritable, genetic component to this. Is this bipolar disorder? Is this something that's diagnosable? Is there medication for whatever it is? Can your siblings agree to be evaluated by a psychiatrist (if a clinical disorder is suspected), or psychologist/therapist (if anger management classes would be helpful)?

Sibling is on medication and, from what I understand, has a team working with them on it. Glad to know you also think its not acceptable.

We’re in that situation with my SIL. She’s been hospitalized from time to time, but I’m not aware of any clear diagnosis. Sometimes her symptoms seem to be similar to borderline personality disorder, especially when she creates blow-ups to push us away and then “test” if we’ll still love her. I have a child now so we don’t take her back the way we used to because it’s too hard to expose our kid to these cycles. We keep SIL at arm’s length/low contact. It sucks and I wish we could be close, but it’s too hard on our nuclear family and my MIL to weather the storms that come when we don’t stay low-contact.

Everyone has to find their own tolerance for this kind of situation. Our personal rule is that nothing is permanent and we’re willing to change how we approach SIL as our child becomes older and more things can be explained. I hope you give yourself the flexibility to do that, too. You have at least my permission to step back when it’s too much.

Their behavior is not acceptable. There is no right or wrong answer about how to respond to their behavior - do what you think is best. However, I will point out the medical aspect of this: clearly there is a heritable, genetic component to this. Is this bipolar disorder? Is this something that's diagnosable? Is there medication for whatever it is? Can your siblings agree to be evaluated by a psychiatrist (if a clinical disorder is suspected), or psychologist/therapist (if anger management classes would be helpful)?

No experience with this OP. Sorry. A question though: How often do these outbursts happen? Can you see them coming on? I would never allow him in my house--be somewhere where YOU can leave when things escalate,if necessary. I would be hesitant to allow my children (depending on their ages) to witness these explosions.

I grew up in an abusive household (father very physically abusive). So, there some issues among me and my brother and sister with depression, anxiety, PTSD etc. In particular, one sibling targeted me nonstop with physical and verbal abuse growing up. One of the two has been treated extensively, and can act normal for long stretches of time, and then out of the blue, due to some life stressor, acts insanely and verbally abusive to me- we are talking screaming, yelling curse words, acting like a psycho. I'm close with this sibling, but this type of behavior is not acceptable to me. For a long time, they expected me to "forget" it happened or "accept" that I am also to blame (i.e. will make up a story of what happened that somehow put some blame on me- since the behavior is unprovoked, its usually a sadly laughable twist). In the past, after they blow up, they will try to make up for it by being "extra nice". It reminds me a lot of my father's behavior and cycle of abuse.

Its very very damaging to me to have to deal with this, so I no longer do, and its very very hard for the sibling to accept that if they want to be in my life, they must acknowledge what they have done and apologize. I can forgive them, but now that I am an adult with my own nuclear family responsibilities, I refuse to be gas-lighted and pretend like we are okay.

I feel that by requiring that they acknowledge their bad behavior to me, and apologize directly to me, it is less likely for them to repeat that behavior. Is that correct?

I'd like to maintain a relationship, but I can't seem to do that because of this crazy behavior. Its sad, because our kids are and should be close, but my siblings behavior limits interactions that require coordination (because I can't speak with a sibling who thinks its okay to go completely crazy, and then expect me to be okay with it). I do like my sibling a lot when they aren't acting insane.

Anyone else deal with this situation? Over the long term did it ever get better?