Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that a matriarch mindset exists whether or not it is articulated as such.

I believe that most conflicts between MILs and DILs are actually battles for matriarchal control of the family culture and values.

Culture and values? Such as what?

NP I'd agree with this. I have big differences of opinion as to how I want holidays celebrated. I want sit down dinners. I want screaming children at 6am opening presents while we all drink hot cocoa. I want it joyous and happy. MIL wants appetizers on paper plates. Kids have to stay in our room until everyone is done showering (10 am last time). She's extremely informal, no alcohol. Our two ways just can't coexist. I don't have the same issues with how my mom celebrates. My mom asks for our opinions and we don't have to spend the night at her house, she comes to ours.

PP here. Yes, exactly. Battle for the family culture. Son gets married to a woman who was raised a certain way. By and large, women set the cultural tone for family life. New family the couple forms is more heavily influenced by wife's culture than by the husband's. MIL, the matriarch, feels threatened or otherwise distressed about this. Conflict ensues.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that a matriarch mindset exists whether or not it is articulated as such.

I believe that most conflicts between MILs and DILs are actually battles for matriarchal control of the family culture and values.

Culture and values? Such as what?

Family culture: Parenting practices, breastfeeding, childcare, egalitarian parenting or traditional gender roles, parenting girls vs. boys and how that is done, views re: screen time, how to spend holidays (formal, informal, when to open gifts, what kind of gifts are given), food, music, religion. The list goes on.

Values: Private school, public school, religious education and practice, various areas of ethics, political views.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think that a matriarch mindset exists whether or not it is articulated as such.

I believe that most conflicts between MILs and DILs are actually battles for matriarchal control of the family culture and values.

Culture and values? Such as what?

NP I'd agree with this. I have big differences of opinion as to how I want holidays celebrated. I want sit down dinners. I want screaming children at 6am opening presents while we all drink hot cocoa. I want it joyous and happy. MIL wants appetizers on paper plates. Kids have to stay in our room until everyone is done showering (10 am last time). She's extremely informal, no alcohol. Our two ways just can't coexist. I don't have the same issues with how my mom celebrates. My mom asks for our opinions and we don't have to spend the night at her house, she comes to ours.

Anonymous wrote:I think that a matriarch mindset exists whether or not it is articulated as such.

I believe that most conflicts between MILs and DILs are actually battles for matriarchal control of the family culture and values.

Culture and values? Such as what?

I think that a matriarch mindset exists whether or not it is articulated as such.

I believe that most conflicts between MILs and DILs are actually battles for matriarchal control of the family culture and values.

Matriarch?!?! I believe in our families that the adult women are in charge of it all. In DH's family only his mom hosts holidays, but I've started only going every other year and inviting my family and his on the other year.

In my family I'm an only child. I host all holidays for my parents, but my mom really does most of the cooking. She uses my house because it's bigger and the kids can nap while we cook.

Men are very helpful (DH is our usual cook) but holidays are a female show in our families. Mostly because the women all enjoy it so much

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In my family, the last three matriarchs all WOH when they had small children. Same for DH’s family and nearly all of my friends. It might be an ethnic thing: we’re AA.

I have Latinx friends in which the matriarch SAH or only WOH PT.

The concept does seem less prevalent among my friends of other ethnicities, but I suspect this is because the matriarch often lives on another continent. A friend traveled with her baby to India this summer because her great-grandmother is too frail to make that journey.

We are AA also and we don't have any kind of matriarch. Are you from the south? I wonder if it may be a regional concept. My and my husband's immediate and extended family operate more as OP describes.

I’m from Baltimore, which is kind of Southern. DH is from Louisiana. But I have AA friends from old NY and NE roots who have matriarchs. And those women DO have money often.

In my family, the matriarch structure ended with deaths of my grandmothers. On one side of my family, the presumed next matriarch decided she didn’t want the role after a few years. No one else has stepped up so family gatherings are few and far between. On the other side, the role is loosely played by a few aunts - they rotate hosting. Cousins host sometimes too. It varies a lot.

My DH’s family is too messed up to have family gatherings.

Our family rotates. Irish heritage. But I still hear the stories of my great grandmothers that ruled with iron fists. They had a ton of kids stayed at home. I’m pretty sure that greatly impacted at least my grandmother’s live and let live approach. Once her kids (my aunts and uncles) had kids she encouraged them to do what’s right for their families. Surprisingly, she fostered a great family bond doing this and we just celebrated our 40th family reunion in what was once her beach house. She passed away in 1993.

My mother might be the default matriarch in her family, but probably because she’s the oldest and always liked to entertain

I consider my mother the matriarch of our family. She hosts a good number of get togethers, but not always the holidays. If my sister or I (both local) want to host, she's fine with that. And she she's super helpful! More often than not she's offering to host these days not because of some monopoly on hosting, but because my sister and I both work and she remembers how hard pulling together Thanksgiving was when she worked full time with three little kids.

My mother considers herself the matriarch. I think it’s because she’s been rather powerless her whole life and now she thinks it’s “her turn.” There is a lot of conflict because I don’t buy into it. She’s very toxic.

We still have a matriarch. It’s my mother, and before that, it was her mother (my mom has three other sisters, and she sort of bosses them around too). There are definitely power struggles about hosting now that my sister and I have families of our own, and it’s more convenient not to travel on Thanksgiving and Christmas.

My mom worked FT, but recently retired. My grandma didn’t work outside the home. My sister and I both work FT outside the home.

My dad isn’t really a patriarch: my mom definitely is (and always has been) in charge.

And to answer PP, yes, we are from the south. It might be a southern thing.

Anonymous wrote:In my family, the last three matriarchs all WOH when they had small children. Same for DH’s family and nearly all of my friends. It might be an ethnic thing: we’re AA.

I have Latinx friends in which the matriarch SAH or only WOH PT.

The concept does seem less prevalent among my friends of other ethnicities, but I suspect this is because the matriarch often lives on another continent. A friend traveled with her baby to India this summer because her great-grandmother is too frail to make that journey.

We are AA also and we don't have any kind of matriarch. Are you from the south? I wonder if it may be a regional concept. My and my husband's immediate and extended family operate more as OP describes.

In my family, the last three matriarchs all WOH when they had small children. Same for DH’s family and nearly all of my friends. It might be an ethnic thing: we’re AA.

I have Latinx friends in which the matriarch SAH or only WOH PT.

The concept does seem less prevalent among my friends of other ethnicities, but I suspect this is because the matriarch often lives on another continent. A friend traveled with her baby to India this summer because her great-grandmother is too frail to make that journey.

The "now or never Thanksgiving hosting" thread got me thinking: is the concept of a family matriarch totally passe and out of touch with current social realities? If so, why is that/how did it happen?

Of the families and friends I know well enough to know what their holidays look like, there are very few where the MIL (or grandma or great-aunt) hosts EVERY holiday, for example. Most people seem to have a hosting rotation, some travel with their families, sometimes they go out to eat for the holiday meal, etc. There don't seem to be many "rules" or inescapable traditions; it seems that most people keep what they LIKE about family traditions, add in their own from married-in folks' traditions/desires, and are kind of flexible about holiday hosting overall.

-Are there fewer "matriarchs and patriarchs" because more women work now, so families are in a better position not to be "controlled" by family money?
-Are there fewer "matriarchs and patriarchs" now because while most grown adults like and respect their elders, they don't feel compelled to "obey" them?
Just kind of wondering what happened that changed family dynamics of this sort.

The only time you ever hear the work "matriarch" in my family is in a totally joking tone.