Anonymous wrote:After somewhat disastrous middle level ISEE/SSAT math scores, we now use a tutor for upcoming upper level tests. You may also want to try http://www.mathantics.com ... videos and tutorials/explanations by concept. $20 membership fee for a year (videos are free). Totally worth it and the videos are very engaging/fun. It's what we used to figure out where to focus effort.

I only saw discussion about 6th grade admission and how hard it is for 5th graders. What about a young 4th grader taking the lower level ISEE for 5th grade admission? It is incredibly difficult to even score 50% as most of the math concepts and vocabulary are not all covered at school. What do you think the school would think of the score? I would imagine most of their own 4th grader will not score more than 50%.

After somewhat disastrous middle level ISEE/SSAT math scores, we now use a tutor for upcoming upper level tests. You may also want to try http://www.mathantics.com ... videos and tutorials/explanations by concept. $20 membership fee for a year (videos are free). Totally worth it and the videos are very engaging/fun. It's what we used to figure out where to focus effort.

Anonymous wrote:What is considered a score strong enough for top schools, 6th grade entry? DD took the test this summer. She received a 7 in reading comp, 7 in math (which I don't understand because she only got two problems wrong and was in the 84th percentile), 5 in quantitative reasoning, and 5 in verbal. For verbal, almost all points were off on vocab, which seems really hard to prep for. I'm trying to decide whether she needs to take it again.

These scores are only one part of the process. If you follow all these private school testing threads you will see it all: kids with very low scores who get into top schools, kids with very high scores who get shut out everywhere, and everything in between. The schools suggest, and so you should believe, that there is a basic threshold overall above which you are fine, box checked, and then they look at everything else, and below it they also look at everything else, which may be enough for them to ignore the score. It truly seems to e the least important of the admissions factors.

Vocab can be taught. Has she learned Latin and Greek roots? If not, start there. Does she take a foreign language? French and Spanish share a lot with English. She should also ready a lot.

What is considered a score strong enough for top schools, 6th grade entry? DD took the test this summer. She received a 7 in reading comp, 7 in math (which I don't understand because she only got two problems wrong and was in the 84th percentile), 5 in quantitative reasoning, and 5 in verbal. For verbal, almost all points were off on vocab, which seems really hard to prep for. I'm trying to decide whether she needs to take it again.

It might be more efficient for you to go to a tutor who specializes in test prep to find out what you really need to learn. The tests are created to cover several grades and make sure even those at the top are sufficiently challenged. Kids are scored based on their grade in school though so your child won’t need to know concepts considered past his grade in school to do well. There is also strategy involved in guessing, etc. Good luck!

I don’t know how much schools expect kids to know above their grade level.

I asked a consultant friend who told me that the schools compare scores only against applicants from the same grade. So while higher is generally better, when it comes to test scores, the scores of rising sixth graders aren’t being compared to those of rising eighth graders.

Additionally, you’re not expected to know what hasn’t been taught in school, and while that can vary, most admissions teams have a good sense of what is grade appropriate as far as scores go.

Our 5th grader loved math and did really well I’m school but also didn’t know half of what was on the SSAT. He got so upset and frustrated on the practice tests that we actually delayed applying until 6th grade when it was all familiar. We tried to teach him but the pressure just felt like too much.

Anonymous wrote:DC just finished 4th grade an underwhelming school. We’re planning to apply to new schools for 6th. I’ve been looking at the ISEE and SSAT, and I’m pretty sure DC has never seen many of the more advanced the math concepts, despite being a strong math student - I think the school just doesnt push good students ahead (they get 3 digit multiplication instead of 2, but dont move into pre-algebra/geometry).

I’m looking for advice on whether to get DC a tutor to try to teach the new concepts, which I think DC wont find that hard but may panic a little at being forced to learn a bunch of new stuff for a standardized test, or just try to get DC comfortable with not answering those questions. Anyone BTDT?

My son was at Landon ... the school wasn’t a good fit. We hired an SSAT tutor and the tutor thought him a few concepts that he was sure would be on the test. It really paid off. My son is a strong math student... he liked learning new things. It wasn’t hard and not stressful. I’d hire a tutor and talk to him/her about trying new concepts but not pushing too hard. It’s a balance.

Anonymous wrote:Thanks PP. I’m dreading having to teach them a bunch of math for a stupid test, esp. over the summer, but you’re probably right. I’m really surprised that new 5th graders (when they take the test) are supposed to know pre-algebra but I guess some do.

Yes, I don't understand why they're expected to know almost all pre-Algebra concepts on a test that is taken by 5th graders for 6th admission.
I'm the poster with the DCPS kid. My kid took the lower level ISEE in 5th. Got a 50% cold. So we took the time and taught him all the lower level ISEE concepts he had never learned in school.
He scored a 90%.
Ended up not going to private school and went to Deal Middle School and took 7th grade math in 6th grade. FINALLY was taught the lower level ISEE concepts in class in a 7th grade math class!!
It made for a ridiculous year of 6th grade math in school too because it was all a review from the ISEE studying. The Deal kids take a math Iready test for math placement and he was among the top 10 kids out of close to 600 due to his ISEE studying.

Again, kids who take a compacted math class in places like Mont. Co. are learning 6th grade math in 5th (so they have a much easier time). And many other kids are going to Kumon, etc. But for kids who just taking on-level classes (from places like DCPS where only on-level classes are offered in elementary) it means the kids need to put in time outside of school to learn the concepts. You can be a brilliant kid but if you've never even seen the concepts you're not going to do well.

Anonymous wrote:DC just finished 4th grade an underwhelming school. We’re planning to apply to new schools for 6th. I’ve been looking at the ISEE and SSAT, and I’m pretty sure DC has never seen many of the more advanced the math concepts, despite being a strong math student - I think the school just doesnt push good students ahead (they get 3 digit multiplication instead of 2, but dont move into pre-algebra/geometry).

I’m looking for advice on whether to get DC a tutor to try to teach the new concepts, which I think DC wont find that hard but may panic a little at being forced to learn a bunch of new stuff for a standardized test, or just try to get DC comfortable with not answering those questions. Anyone BTDT?

My kid went to a Catholic school in NoVA and since they don't do the ISEE, they are on a different timetable with respect to what the kids learn in various grades. So when my DD took a practice ISEE test with no prep, to establish her baseline, in math, she was basically guessing and her score was as low as it could be, as she had never learned geometry or whatever else was on the ISEE's quant sections.

I got her a private tutor and she learned a huge amount of material in a very short time. We started in late August. At first the tutor came 2x a week, then once a week, and she tested in early December. In truth she needed about three more weeks, or, him continuing to come 2x week (but he was too busy with other students).

She scored well enough on the math to get her into a very good school on the west coast (we were moving there, which is why she was applying to that school and needed the ISEE scores). I am sure that with three more weeks she woudl have done even better, but he was still teaching her new formulas the night before the test rather than reviewing. They just ran out of time.

The whole experience was such a mind-blower for me, in that, I see now how if someone has a tutor, they don't need to spend so many hours in school. For instance, I've read about the Roosevelt family, and used to think, how did they have time to learn about so many things, and so many languages and sciences and literature, and still have time to hunt and fish and vacation etc? Now I know. And I understand how home-schooled kids seem to have so much more time. It's just so efficient to teach ONLY to the individual.

So anyways, that's how we did it and it worked for us. It was expensive but I saw it as an investment. HTH, OP.

My dd took the SSAT cold last year. She scored in the 48th percentile for math, but was 99th for both reading and writing, leaving her in the 90th percentile overall. She was accepted to 2 of the 3 so-called "Big Three." I actually considered having her learn some of the math because I was kind of appalled by the math score. But we decided not to because of the overall score. I do think it very odd that the math grade didn't bring down the overall more than it did.

Thanks PP. I’m dreading having to teach them a bunch of math for a stupid test, esp. over the summer, but you’re probably right. I’m really surprised that new 5th graders (when they take the test) are supposed to know pre-algebra but I guess some do.

I think you are going to have to teach the concepts.

The ISEE doesn't mark off for wrong answers so you are only scored for questions you get correct. Leaving questions you don't know blank would be a disaster.

My kid came from DCPS. All As in math and 99% PARCC in math (i.e. total mastery of on-grade level math). However, DCPS didn't teach a hair above grade level at our elementary school. When taking the ISEE in 5th my kid had never seen 1/2 the concepts on the lower level ISEE.
Kids coming from Montgomery Cty (for instance) commonly take compacted math in 5th (which is 5th and 6th grade math). They have a much easier time with the the lower level ISEE when applying to 6th.

My kid took the ISEE cold and scored about 50% in math. We taught the missing concepts and his/her score rose to 90%. However, it took quite a bit of work to teach the math. BTW--that math was finally ALL taught in 6th grade in DCPS in a 7th grade math course (my kid ended up staying in DCPS).
(but was tested on the ISEE on the test given for kids entering 5 and 6th grades). Kind of crazy.

DC just finished 4th grade an underwhelming school. We’re planning to apply to new schools for 6th. I’ve been looking at the ISEE and SSAT, and I’m pretty sure DC has never seen many of the more advanced the math concepts, despite being a strong math student - I think the school just doesnt push good students ahead (they get 3 digit multiplication instead of 2, but dont move into pre-algebra/geometry).

I’m looking for advice on whether to get DC a tutor to try to teach the new concepts, which I think DC wont find that hard but may panic a little at being forced to learn a bunch of new stuff for a standardized test, or just try to get DC comfortable with not answering those questions. Anyone BTDT?