Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One could look at Singapore or Switzerland, but they are very small countries.

I don't know about Singapore, but why would you look at Switzerland to support reduced government services? They have a much strong social safety net than the U.S., and spend a lot more of their GDP on it than the U.S. does.

Obamacare is very similar to the Swiss model of healthcare. There is no single-payer healthcare in Switzerland and voters recently struck down a referendum on having national single-payer coverage.

However, in the US we did not adopt the part of the Swiss model that allow it to work effectively (price controls):

Like Obamacare, Santésuisse mandates that all citizens purchase insurance from private insurance companies; establishes by law a minimum package of acceptable benefits to satisfy that mandate; subsidizes health-insurance premiums for lower-income people, with a goal of keeping their insurance premiums to less than 10 percent of their incomes; mandates coverage of preexisting conditions and imposes “community rating,” which means that low-risk insurance buyers pay higher premiums to allow for high-risk buyers to pay lower premiums, though the Swiss do make some adjustments for age and sex (!); it imposes controls on procedure costs and reimbursement for providers.

The Swiss model also does a few things that ACA does not: It requires that insurance companies offer their minimal policies on a nonprofit basis; it is structured around relatively high out-of-pocket expenses (high copays and deductibles) in order to encourage consumers to spend soberly; and, perhaps most important, it does this in the context of a health-insurance market that is entirely individual: There are no employer-based health-insurance plans in Switzerland. Everybody buys his own health insurance, the same way people buy everything from tacos to mobile-phone service. Swiss regulations also mandate that prices be made public, which helps consumer markets to function.

https://fee.org/articles/why-the-swiss-health-care-model-will-never-work-in-america/

As I mentioned in my previous post about trash bags, the U.S. seems to have an enforcement issue when it comes to its laws. We don't like to establish meaningful penalties for middle and upper-class citizens; they feel that it is OK to blatantly violate rules and laws. Whereas the Swiss government really does go after people who break norms. The Swiss government will garnish your wages if you don't buy a healthcare plan, there is no token penalty. Eventually, they will force a plan upon you.

Americans prefer that our government not be so heavy-handed. Yet, at the end of the day, your decision to not purchase health insurance ends up costing me more money in the way of higher premiums.

America's biggest problem is that we have lawlessness masquerading as "freedom;" and we have people/companies wanting to impose the costs of externalities on others. I don't know how to solve this issue, as it seems to be a central part of our national and cultural DNA. Donald Trump is the perfect embodiment of this elite entitlement.

Singapore? You mean the country where you have to buy a Certificate of Entitlement to drive a car for ten years? The COE can easily cost more than the full price of a car.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Certificate_of_Entitlement

Anonymous wrote:Switzerland is a model for what the government can do to facilitate excellent and dependable public transportation.

Right but presumably the hard-core austerity folks in the US would be against that too .. my question is, is there any model economy where the government spends a minimum on social services?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One could look at Singapore or Switzerland, but they are very small countries.

They are also countries with very strong Nanny States that regulate nearly every part of your day to day life. You get fined for EVERYTHING in Switzerland and Singapore.

Here’s a good example: trash bags. In Switzerland, the only trash bags you are allowed to buy are those with a tax-paid tag. Each trash bag costs you around $5 USD in order to ensure that you personally incur the costs for your waste. If you accidentally place a recyclable item in the waste trash bag, that is also a fine (around $50 USD). Public wastebaskets are also pretty rare in Switzerland. I’ve carried around my garbage (eg, an empty side can) for the better part of a day because there is a real cost ($5 garbage bags) for businesses to provide garbage service to the public.

Americans would be shocked at how well certain counties enforce their rules and laws. That’s the biggest inconsistency with America: we claim to love freedom and capitalism, but we throw a hissy fit when someone tries to make us pay for the externalities we impose upon others. That doesn’t happen in Switzerland or Singapore. You pay for ANY resource you use.

Fascinating. More global insight, please!

Switzerland is a model for what the government can do to facilitate excellent and dependable public transportation.

Anonymous wrote:One could look at Singapore or Switzerland, but they are very small countries.

They are also countries with very strong Nanny States that regulate nearly every part of your day to day life. You get fined for EVERYTHING in Switzerland and Singapore.

Here’s a good example: trash bags. In Switzerland, the only trash bags you are allowed to buy are those with a tax-paid tag. Each trash bag costs you around $5 USD in order to ensure that you personally incur the costs for your waste. If you accidentally place a recyclable item in the waste trash bag, that is also a fine (around $50 USD). Public wastebaskets are also pretty rare in Switzerland. I’ve carried around my garbage (eg, an empty side can) for the better part of a day because there is a real cost ($5 garbage bags) for businesses to provide garbage service to the public.

Americans would be shocked at how well certain counties enforce their rules and laws. That’s the biggest inconsistency with America: we claim to love freedom and capitalism, but we throw a hissy fit when someone tries to make us pay for the externalities we impose upon others. That doesn’t happen in Switzerland or Singapore. You pay for ANY resource you use.

Anonymous wrote:Question for people who don't believe government should provide a safety net, health care, etc. What nation is your model for this? Is there a country (or even a U.S. state) where reducing basic services and the social safety net has produced a thriving populace and healthy economy?

The US. We just continue two tier system we now have. The only thing we should adopt from socialist countries is their brutal lack of sentimentality for damaged babies and extending lives at great costs.

Anonymous wrote:One could look at Singapore or Switzerland, but they are very small countries.

That would require reducing the military by 90%.

Anonymous wrote:One could look at Singapore or Switzerland, but they are very small countries.

I don't know about Singapore, but why would you look at Switzerland to support reduced government services? They have a much strong social safety net than the U.S., and spend a lot more of their GDP on it than the U.S. does.

Anonymous wrote:One could look at Singapore or Switzerland, but they are very small countries.

Sure, I'd be interested to know more about how those countries work and what kind of social supports they provide. Even if they can't be a national model, they could be a city or state model, right?

One could look at Singapore or Switzerland, but they are very small countries.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No country. Why mimic other countries? The US is in a league of its own.

So you have no theory or model of such policies being successful? that's ... interesting.

And lets point to the US. In general, the deepest of the Red States dominant the top 10 of every list on which a state does not want to be. Moreover, the Red States, in general, survive only thru the generosity of the Blue States via Federal tax dollars. Being a Blue State Democrat, I say f____ the deplorables.

Anonymous wrote:No country. Why mimic other countries? The US is in a league of its own.

So you have no theory or model of such policies being successful? that's ... interesting.

No country. Why mimic other countries? The US is in a league of its own.

Question for people who don't believe government should provide a safety net, health care, etc. What nation is your model for this? Is there a country (or even a U.S. state) where reducing basic services and the social safety net has produced a thriving populace and healthy economy?