Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you involved in a teen's homework?

You've provided supports and resources and tools -- and it sounds like he/she is not failing, just not doing as well as they could.

Grades are not everything. In this case I think you may want to consider backing off.

Do you have a child with severe ADHD?

Yes. Two of them; one had a bad habit of lying / hiding bad grades because he was embarrassed and didn't want to tell us. I care more about my kid being honest with me than I do about their grades, and he knows it.

Once he knew that, he was open to help and the grades improved.

10:51 here. How nice for you. My experience was different. I let my DS fail in 8th grade. He learned very little from the experience.

9:53 poster here. I just want to say to the OP that I understand your frustration and that I'm sorry that the lying is creating a stressful time for your family.

When a behavioral intervention fails, it can be because it's the wrong intervention, because it's not applied consistently enough, or because the reward or consequence is not sufficiently motivating. Yes, it's a ton of effort, especially with other children at home, but I'd look at consistency and consequences first. Failing that, ask a mental health professional for his or her advice on how to make adjustments. The upfront investment of time and energy is a lot, but you're trying to help your child make a lifelong change in work habits and in honest interactions. That's worthwhile. Wishing you all the best as you work through it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you involved in a teen's homework?

You've provided supports and resources and tools -- and it sounds like he/she is not failing, just not doing as well as they could.

Grades are not everything. In this case I think you may want to consider backing off.

Do you have a child with severe ADHD?

Yes. Two of them; one had a bad habit of lying / hiding bad grades because he was embarrassed and didn't want to tell us. I care more about my kid being honest with me than I do about their grades, and he knows it.

Once he knew that, he was open to help and the grades improved.

OP: don't back off.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are you involved in a teen's homework?

You've provided supports and resources and tools -- and it sounds like he/she is not failing, just not doing as well as they could.

Grades are not everything. In this case I think you may want to consider backing off.

Do you have a child with severe ADHD?

Yes. Two of them; one had a bad habit of lying / hiding bad grades because he was embarrassed and didn't want to tell us. I care more about my kid being honest with me than I do about their grades, and he knows it.

Once he knew that, he was open to help and the grades improved.

Anonymous wrote:Why are you involved in a teen's homework?

You've provided supports and resources and tools -- and it sounds like he/she is not failing, just not doing as well as they could.

Grades are not everything. In this case I think you may want to consider backing off.

Do you have a child with severe ADHD?

If end of year grades are acceptable your answer is, its ok. It's ok-enough. I don't mean the lying but the end-result, his school work. If final grades do not fall into an acceptable range than the school environment is too challenging. He can't manage it in it's entirety. That's that to say that he can't do well in every class, or well enough. It is saying that taken together, all classes, his schedule demands too much from him. More than he can do.

Anonymous wrote:Can you go back the drawing board to further reduce "opportunities to lie?" That really does seem to be the highest yield intervention in these situations.

Pp again, I read your second post again. For things like hair washing you are checking but are you asking then checking or checking then saying "I see you haven't washed your hair yet?"

Can you go back the drawing board to further reduce "opportunities to lie?" That really does seem to be the highest yield intervention in these situations.

Anonymous wrote:OP Here: I do everything the latter two posters describe. Check every morning and evening. Make him show me work. check for toothbrushing. check for hair washing. try to tailor consequences. But I am just burning out with two other children with their own sets of needs and a high demand job. DH and I let things go for a few days hoping the EF coach was on it with him as they purported to be and it all fell apart with multiple missed assignments and lies about them until too late to turn in under 504 plan.

I feel like we just need more personal support on this but good to know we are not alone. thanks.

Have you considered that the lying may be connected to anxiety?
My ADHD DD got into a pattern of lying just like you describe. Many times it was to cover up what wasn't done because the anxiety was so overwhelming and the brain couldn't get started no matter how much it "knew" what it HAD to do.

Anonymous wrote:Why are you involved in a teen's homework?

You've provided supports and resources and tools -- and it sounds like he/she is not failing, just not doing as well as they could.

Grades are not everything. In this case I think you may want to consider backing off.

This is nonsense. Please disregard this terrible input.

OP Here: I do everything the latter two posters describe. Check every morning and evening. Make him show me work. check for toothbrushing. check for hair washing. try to tailor consequences. But I am just burning out with two other children with their own sets of needs and a high demand job. DH and I let things go for a few days hoping the EF coach was on it with him as they purported to be and it all fell apart with multiple missed assignments and lies about them until too late to turn in under 504 plan.

I feel like we just need more personal support on this but good to know we are not alone. thanks.

We take an approach similar to 09:53. Trust but verify. My oldest (15 and with ADHD/anxiety) over the last couple of years has been lying more frequently. His father (who also has ADHD/depression) also has issues with the truth at time. In relationship counseling, our therapist helped me to understand that part of it is the legacy of ADHD/depression/anxiety. She wasn't excusing it by any means but that some of it is an attempt to 'avoid' with the expectation that he'll get it done; or that he doesn't want to disappoint; or that he's ashamed. Again, none of this is to excuse the behavior but to understand the underlying issues that make one more prone to lie.

This is why we (mostly "I") try to maintain an environment where lying isn't successful. This extends not just to school work (checking the online assignment/grade site) but taking a shower/washing hair (I feel and smell his hair), brushing teeth (he wears braces so it's easy to see if he's brushed), walking the dog (he's got to be gone at least 30 minutes), etc. Yes, it's a major pain in the ass but, as I explain to him, this is necessary when you can't rely on someone's word. Trust must be earned. What's ironic is this is the kid that couldn't, for the life of him, tell a lie in ES - to his own detriment! He's sure made up for it.

If anyone knows of any TED talks or other brief discussion on the topic, I'd love to be able to watch them with my kid.

I reduce the opportunities to lie wherever possible. Instead of taking teen’s word that work is done, we check the assignments against class websites and the plan book. There has to be evidence that the work is complete for the day. For example, reading needs to be accompanied by some sort of note taking. We do this early enough in the evening that there is a chance to finish up anything that’s missing. If I’m at all unsure about whether an assignment is done on time or correctly, I take 30 seconds to email the teacher. It costs me nothing, and they are usually appreciative that I’m on top of things.

I try to help too with organizing papers and planning for long-term assignments. As soon as we know about assessments, papers, and projects, we write out a schedule to get the work done. Checking on progress against that schedule is part of daily homework checks-ins.

I try to be consistent with logical consequences that are connected to the motivation for the lying or the cause of the lying. For example, if the motivation was to have more free time in the afternoon, then my consequence will be something that limits free time, like more chores. If the cause of the distraction that delayed homework getting started was the smartphone, then I start limiting the hours in which the data plan can be used on the teen’s phone.

It’s a lot of work to stay on top of these things. I find a month is usually enough to reset habits back to a better place. Then we can lighten up a little unless and until the gradebook tells us otherwise.

During this time you should also bring up the lying with the doctor treating the ADHD. Sometimes there’s underlying fear about one’s abilities or shame that contribute to the lying cycle. You’ll get the best results of a mental health counselor helps your teen examine those things as well. Sometimes it’s a sign that a medication adjustment might be helpful.

Why are you involved in a teen's homework?

You've provided supports and resources and tools -- and it sounds like he/she is not failing, just not doing as well as they could.

Grades are not everything. In this case I think you may want to consider backing off.

Very bright teen in one of the magnet programs. Constant lying about completion of assignments. Grades much lower than would be if completed all assignments. Plenty of tutors, executive function coach, therapist, meds, etc. How do you deal?