Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:50     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
In addition to an addiction, it is quite possible your brother has a mental illness that likely wasn't addressed when he was young.

Guys whose mental health issues were ignored often turned to substances to self medicate. It sounds like he has struggled with addiction since his teen years. He may also have experienced something traumatic and used substances to cope.

Stealing and lying related to drug use is different from being a bad person. That behavior is part of an addiction as the need to use means people do unethical, or illegal things to feed the need. If they could just choose to not use, then they wouldn't be an addict.

I don't see anything to gain by trying to punish your brother for his addiction. You are punishing your kids as well. have you been to al anon? You might find it helpful to talk to others with family members who are addicts.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:49     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Another person with addiction in the family. What is the value of teaching the kids the uncle is to be snubbed? Yes, teach them not to trust him and teach them he is an addict. But why must they be kept apart?


Because she doesn't want her young kids getting groped by him!


Huh? OP said nothing about her brother being a pedophile?
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:48     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Another person with addiction in the family. What is the value of teaching the kids the uncle is to be snubbed? Yes, teach them not to trust him and teach them he is an addict. But why must they be kept apart?


Because she doesn't want her young kids getting groped by him!


No, OP, didn't say he "groped". That is you projecting. OP said he was touchy-feely. Two totally different things.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:42     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Anonymous wrote:Another person with addiction in the family. What is the value of teaching the kids the uncle is to be snubbed? Yes, teach them not to trust him and teach them he is an addict. But why must they be kept apart?


Because she doesn't want her young kids getting groped by him!
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:42     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Don't go OP. Don't do it. I know it's so hard, but you are doing the right thing. Your parents made their choice, and it has consequences. Don't enable the enablers. I'm sorry. That's so hard.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:38     Subject: Re:Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Excellent opportunity to teach kids in person about charming lying people, especially if kids like him.


These are elementary age kids. They won't get that the charm is fake; they'll only see that uncle is so nice to them, so funny, so sweet. They will not understand at all if their parents later say, "We know uncle seems nice but really he's not...." That will only confuse the kids and possibly make them feel they want to defend him to their parents--not at all what OP wants. OP, have other plans this holiday. Do not let your parents rope you into any discussion or try to convince you. Smile as you repeat, "We committed to see friends" or "We're doing the holiday with just us this year."

OP, ypu and your DH right mow just need to get through these holidays but after that you need to develop a firm plan for how to handle this. Are your parents local, so they expect to see your kids throughout the year? If so, you will have to tell them clearly that you will see them without your kids, or you will bring your kids to see them at outings etc., but not at their house if brother is there. Or you do let the kids see brother but limit it to outings where everyone is focused on the activity and you can leave easily.

It may be possible for him to have some level of relationship with your kids but I would not let hanging out for hours on end at your parents house or your house be part of that. I'd stick clearly to "third places" that involve an activity and a time frame.


Thanks, this makes me feel better -- I was starting to think I was wildly off base. This is exactly the issue -- he is very charming and manipulative and seeks out me and the kids for lots of attention. I don't think they can understand that he's so damaged and has been so for decades. He's not open to rehab, work, or supporting/seeing his own kids.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:38     Subject: Re:Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Excellent opportunity to teach kids in person about charming lying people, especially if kids like him.


How? By saying he's a bad guy and to avoid him when we're in the car on the way home? After he's charmed and monopolized the conversation for the entire visit?


Answering questions (even if those questions are not verbalized) about him and why you don't want to have a relationship with him and how it is not easy to deal with this when it's your family. How take anything the person is saying with the grain of salt and why. How to trust actions and not words. The simpliest start is given: an capable adult moves in with his parents because of drug problems. You will have to explain it all one day anyway.
On a separate note, how one can charming and monopolize at the same time, the latter is annoying?
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:37     Subject: Re:Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Your brother is part of your family. It is okay to love a family member even when the family member is flawed because, honestly, we're all flawed.

Your children look to you to model the behavior of the type of person you want them to be. Do you really want the lesson they learn from you is that if you disapprove of a person's mental or physical illness then you cut them out of your life?
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:31     Subject: Re:Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Anonymous wrote:Excellent opportunity to teach kids in person about charming lying people, especially if kids like him.


These are elementary age kids. They won't get that the charm is fake; they'll only see that uncle is so nice to them, so funny, so sweet. They will not understand at all if their parents later say, "We know uncle seems nice but really he's not...." That will only confuse the kids and possibly make them feel they want to defend him to their parents--not at all what OP wants. OP, have other plans this holiday. Do not let your parents rope you into any discussion or try to convince you. Smile as you repeat, "We committed to see friends" or "We're doing the holiday with just us this year."

OP, ypu and your DH right mow just need to get through these holidays but after that you need to develop a firm plan for how to handle this. Are your parents local, so they expect to see your kids throughout the year? If so, you will have to tell them clearly that you will see them without your kids, or you will bring your kids to see them at outings etc., but not at their house if brother is there. Or you do let the kids see brother but limit it to outings where everyone is focused on the activity and you can leave easily.

It may be possible for him to have some level of relationship with your kids but I would not let hanging out for hours on end at your parents house or your house be part of that. I'd stick clearly to "third places" that involve an activity and a time frame.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:03     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
By avoid do you mean that you expect your parents to put him out for the day so you and your kids can visit? Because if that's what you mean then no, you aren't doing the right thing.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:03     Subject: Re:Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Anonymous wrote:Excellent opportunity to teach kids in person about charming lying people, especially if kids like him.


How? By saying he's a bad guy and to avoid him when we're in the car on the way home? After he's charmed and monopolized the conversation for the entire visit?
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:02     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
I’m so sick of the word cruel being tossed around on here. No it is not cruel to avoid him. It would be cruel to chain him in the basement, best him with a bat and not feed him. Avoiding someone is not cruelty.

That said I think it’s dumb to avoid him. Your kids need to learn how NOT to be as much as they need to learn how to be.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 12:01     Subject: Re:Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Excellent opportunity to teach kids in person about charming lying people, especially if kids like him.
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 11:56     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Another person with addiction in the family. What is the value of teaching the kids the uncle is to be snubbed? Yes, teach them not to trust him and teach them he is an addict. But why must they be kept apart?
Anonymous
Post 12/23/2017 11:54     Subject: Difficult situation - am I doing the right thing?
Parents have taken in my mid-40s brother. He has been an addict for 30 years and continues to lie and steal (including from them - money, meds, etc.). He is unable to keep even a menial job and is no longer looking. His personality is very charming, glib, and touchy-feely - exactly what I would teach my elementary-school age children to avoid.

Is it cruel of me to avoid him at the holidays? Parents are devastated. I do not want to watch him snuggling on the couch with my kids. They will not ask him to leave the house for a few hours so we can visit.