Anonymous wrote:Just tell them that it's very rude to talk about plans in front of another person when that person is not included in the plans (especially when they know the person would like to be included).

If someone is especially pushy (directly asking about plans even when they aren't divulged) then just say that they're still figuring out what they want to do and then change the subject.

Kids don't need to be friends with everyone, or to include everyone, but there's no reason to be nasty and rub it in.

+1

It is rude to talk about or make plans in front of someone you aren't including in those plans. This is remedial etiquette, and no, 12-year-olds are not too young to learn this. It doesn't matter if it's in person or on social media. If these girls don't want to include this particular friend in some outing, then they shouldn't talk about it in front of her, or publicly on Facebook or whatever they use, or make a big deal talking about it in front of her after the fact.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just tell them that it's very rude to talk about plans in front of another person when that person is not included in the plans (especially when they know the person would like to be included).

If someone is especially pushy (directly asking about plans even when they aren't divulged) then just say that they're still figuring out what they want to do and then change the subject.

Kids don't need to be friends with everyone, or to include everyone, but there's no reason to be nasty and rub it in.

+1

if your child doesn't like this girl and/or doesn't want her to come to something - the respectful/kind thing to do is to not mention it until after the fact.

If your child does like her and want her around, then I fail to see what the problem is (other than she has a weird way of inviting herself).

Agree. OP, it's mean and rude to be talking about plans in front of a person you intend to exclude from the plans. I agree there may be some manipulation and mean girl behavior going on but I think you're blaming the wrong party here.

If your DD wants to go with one or two friends, she just needs to call or text them right before she goes.

Like "I'm going I the mall at 3:00 today, do you want to go with me?"

If this other girl is always finding out, then it seems to me that someone in the group is either insensitive, mean, or likes to cause drama. And they shouldn't talk in front of the girl about it before or after and they shouldn't post photos.

OP your kid and her friends are definitely being insensitive if they are mentioning plans without openly inviting the 3rd girl. Good for her for getting herself included. Your kid is a chump.

Tey to point out "drama" with girls, just not in an accusatory way. Talk more about the situation and ask questions, how did you feel when the plans were changed? Oh, so you wanted to spend time with just Y, but X invited herself? What could you say next time? Make sure you have a polite but firm response ready to model. Give your children strategies to stand up for their wants and needs, and not become people pleasers. It isn't rude for two friends to go to a movie and not invite another one.

In the grand scheme of things this one kid is very small and it seems like she's not toxic or a bad influence, just a manipulator. This is annoying and will eventually get her excluded from activities because now that the kids are in MS, parents for the most part aren't forcing their children's social groups.

Anonymous wrote:Just tell them that it's very rude to talk about plans in front of another person when that person is not included in the plans (especially when they know the person would like to be included).

If someone is especially pushy (directly asking about plans even when they aren't divulged) then just say that they're still figuring out what they want to do and then change the subject.

Kids don't need to be friends with everyone, or to include everyone, but there's no reason to be nasty and rub it in.

+1

if your child doesn't like this girl and/or doesn't want her to come to something - the respectful/kind thing to do is to not mention it until after the fact.

If your child does like her and want her around, then I fail to see what the problem is (other than she has a weird way of inviting herself).

Just tell them that it's very rude to talk about plans in front of another person when that person is not included in the plans (especially when they know the person would like to be included).

If someone is especially pushy (directly asking about plans even when they aren't divulged) then just say that they're still figuring out what they want to do and then change the subject.

Kids don't need to be friends with everyone, or to include everyone, but there's no reason to be nasty and rub it in.

Overthinking

Anonymous wrote:Sounds to me like the parents don't like the girl and so are looking up excuses to encourage their kids to exclude her. Dollars to donuts says this kid is poorer or more physically developed than the others.

OP here - I will speak for myself. I really like the girl and the family, and neither of your suggestions is applicable. But I do see how the girl acts - and how she tries to push people's buttons. I don't know that I would be so patient, as a friend. But then again, I think that age is probably not sophisticated enough to see the manipulation. I also do not want to speak my mind, because I want the tweens to figure it out for themselves. At the same time, I don't want anyone to be left out, but the way this is going (they are planning the next thing) - I don't want the same old hurt feelings with any of them (I have known them all a long time). They are all good kids, but some of them don't always mesh. I feel like there is only so much influence I can have (I don't want to micromanage), but if there is anything I can do to prevent issues, I want to help.

Sounds to me like the parents don't like the girl and so are looking up excuses to encourage their kids to exclude her. Dollars to donuts says this kid is poorer or more physically developed than the others.

Anonymous wrote:I am not clear on what is happening. Two girls say they are going to the movies and the "friend" says I am going to also go? Who is telling the "friend" what is happening? Use a better example.

OP here. Yes, this. Thank you for being succinct - more succinct than I was. The exact problem is that the girls divulge their plans. Do you think they are too young to learn not to do this (especially with the prevalence of social media)?

I think I understand and I agree that you should leave them all to work it out themselves. If nothing else, its a valuable life lesson in not tolerating too much manipulative BS from people. Its a good lesson to learn in MS and carry with you thereafter, I'd say.

I am not clear on what is happening. Two girls say they are going to the movies and the "friend" says I am going to also go? Who is telling the "friend" what is happening? Use a better example.

Does everyone need to get somewhere?

Not looking to micromanage here, just looking for some input. I really like the children to handle their own issues - but there is one MS girl who tends to insert herself into plans, while challenging others not to let her. I don't know how else to explain it, but it is really manipulative behavior. Other parents pointed it out to me, I didn't want to see it for a long time, but I finally have to admit, it is the same pattern over and over again. We do not want anyone left out, but whenever this person is included, there is inevitably drama - a conscientious challenge, to the group as a whole: "I'm doing this (with you), who says I can't?" without using those words. If someone speaks up, because they would rather be with a smaller group, then that person is made the fall guy. From my standpoint, it would be easier to include the person sometimes (which is difficult, because trouble always ensues, one way or another) - and for other times, when it is a smaller group, for that person to maybe consider going with anyone else - there is always someone available. Disclaimer: this is what I did sometimes, at that age, so I am thinking it works, but maybe not.

I don't want anyone to feel excluded, so like I said, I tend to stay out of it - but there is always something. Is there something I am missing here? I don't want anyone to feel badly.