Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought that this was important: "GMU researchers examining 2012 job-application data for the school system found that black applicants had slightly lower pass rates on a screening test but somewhat more extensive academic credentials and work experience than their white counterparts. On paper, the researchers said, the black and white candidates seemed to have comparable qualifications."

The WaPo article and the study didn't seem to focus on the screening test, which may be intentionally or unintentionally biased, or may tend to disfavor black applicants, but not Asian or Hispanic applicants, for some other reason. It seemed significant to me.

This. People want to "raise teacher standards" (via test) but they also want "more diversity". You can't have both. AAs as a group tend to do about one full standard deviation worse than Euro-Americans as a group on any given standardized test. Want more AA teachers? Get rid of the test. Want the test? Don't expect more AA teachers.

They're not talking about a standardized test. FX does not used standardized tests as part of the application process. Ha!

Read the thread. FX is talking about some BS personality type test.

Anonymous wrote:One thing I have not seen is this: Ebonics

That is the problem.

Lol! You have got to be kidding or crazy if you think the majority of black TEACHER applicants in FAIRFAX show up speaking Ebonics!!! LOL

This is what happens when Whites aren't exposed to black teachers. They grow up leaning on stereotypes! Lol

Anonymous wrote:I thought that this was important: "GMU researchers examining 2012 job-application data for the school system found that black applicants had slightly lower pass rates on a screening test but somewhat more extensive academic credentials and work experience than their white counterparts. On paper, the researchers said, the black and white candidates seemed to have comparable qualifications."

The WaPo article and the study didn't seem to focus on the screening test, which may be intentionally or unintentionally biased, or may tend to disfavor black applicants, but not Asian or Hispanic applicants, for some other reason. It seemed significant to me.

This. People want to "raise teacher standards" (via test) but they also want "more diversity". You can't have both. AAs as a group tend to do about one full standard deviation worse than Euro-Americans as a group on any given standardized test. Want more AA teachers? Get rid of the test. Want the test? Don't expect more AA teachers.

One thing I have not seen is this: Ebonics

That is the problem.

These two items struck me as contrary:

* Other researchers have found that black students from low-income families are more likely to graduate if they have at least one black teacher and that black teachers are more likely to identify gifted students of color.

* The researchers also found that when black applicants did get job offers, they were more likely to end up in schools with large populations of minority students and high levels of poverty. They said it was evidence of “workforce segregation.”

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just cause they have more degrees doesn't mean they are better.

What a dumb study

On it's face, I'd agree with you.

But when it comes to education, advanced degrees DO matter. They show specialized learning--unlike the undergraduate degree that's all over the place until your last 2-4 semesters of college.

In addition to the advanced degrees, there's that issue of those teachers having more experience.

Again, in the field of education (as in most fields), more degrees AND more experience matter a great deal. In any field that combination makes you a more appealing candidate.

Do we know what kind of advanced degree and schools? Is it a crap school like udc?

Do you really believe that the majority of AA applicants in Fairfax have degrees from UDC????

And I guess all the white applicants graduated from Harvard?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just cause they have more degrees doesn't mean they are better.

What a dumb study

On it's face, I'd agree with you.

But when it comes to education, advanced degrees DO matter. They show specialized learning--unlike the undergraduate degree that's all over the place until your last 2-4 semesters of college.

In addition to the advanced degrees, there's that issue of those teachers having more experience.

Again, in the field of education (as in most fields), more degrees AND more experience matter a great deal. In any field that combination makes you a more appealing candidate.

Do we know what kind of advanced degree and schools? Is it a crap school like udc?

Anonymous wrote:Just cause they have more degrees doesn't mean they are better.

What a dumb study

On it's face, I'd agree with you.

But when it comes to education, advanced degrees DO matter. They show specialized learning--unlike the undergraduate degree that's all over the place until your last 2-4 semesters of college.

In addition to the advanced degrees, there's that issue of those teachers having more experience.

Again, in the field of education (as in most fields), more degrees AND more experience matter a great deal. In any field that combination makes you a more appealing candidate.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought that this was important: "GMU researchers examining 2012 job-application data for the school system found that black applicants had slightly lower pass rates on a screening test but somewhat more extensive academic credentials and work experience than their white counterparts. On paper, the researchers said, the black and white candidates seemed to have comparable qualifications."

The WaPo article and the study didn't seem to focus on the screening test, which may be intentionally or unintentionally biased, or may tend to disfavor black applicants, but not Asian or Hispanic applicants, for some other reason. It seemed significant to me.

It seemed significant to me as well. And as an applicant who took the test, I can tell you that it in no way tests intelligence or knowledge (as the article may lead you to believe).

It's been awhile but from what I remember it's a series of questions along the line of "What is your opinion on...I dunno...meeting with teachers in a team?" A. It should be done often. B. It should be done everyday. C. It should be done as needed. D. Teachers should never meet.

How in the world black applicants can "score lower" on a test that is not testing any real knowledge or skill is beyond me. The test doesn't take into account that schools have different needs. So one FCPS school may have teachers meet once a week when another has them meet every day.

If the "test" they are referring to is the Gallop Interview that every applicant must go through, then I can tell you that it is completely bogus. The Gallop Interview is searching for how much education school rhetoric you can spout, how politically correct you are, and if you've bought into the "all students are perfect so anything that goes wrong is the teachers fault" way of thinking. If an experienced teacher applicant says something like "of course all students can learn, even if they're knuckleheads," they are given a bad rating on the Gallop because they used a disparaging term. An experienced teacher, as the article says many black applicants are, will be further removed from the ed school brain washing and more likely to be more candid about teaching.

I do believe it's Gallup. If not, it's along those lines.

And I absolutely agree with you. But I cannot understand how FCPS can quote the pass rate on that test as some type of justification--as if blacks are doing poorly on a test assessing their content knowledge.

Just cause they have more degrees doesn't mean they are better.

What a dumb study

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought that this was important: "GMU researchers examining 2012 job-application data for the school system found that black applicants had slightly lower pass rates on a screening test but somewhat more extensive academic credentials and work experience than their white counterparts. On paper, the researchers said, the black and white candidates seemed to have comparable qualifications."

The WaPo article and the study didn't seem to focus on the screening test, which may be intentionally or unintentionally biased, or may tend to disfavor black applicants, but not Asian or Hispanic applicants, for some other reason. It seemed significant to me.

It seemed significant to me as well. And as an applicant who took the test, I can tell you that it in no way tests intelligence or knowledge (as the article may lead you to believe).

It's been awhile but from what I remember it's a series of questions along the line of "What is your opinion on...I dunno...meeting with teachers in a team?" A. It should be done often. B. It should be done everyday. C. It should be done as needed. D. Teachers should never meet.

How in the world black applicants can "score lower" on a test that is not testing any real knowledge or skill is beyond me. The test doesn't take into account that schools have different needs. So one FCPS school may have teachers meet once a week when another has them meet every day.

If the "test" they are referring to is the Gallop Interview that every applicant must go through, then I can tell you that it is completely bogus. The Gallop Interview is searching for how much education school rhetoric you can spout, how politically correct you are, and if you've bought into the "all students are perfect so anything that goes wrong is the teachers fault" way of thinking. If an experienced teacher applicant says something like "of course all students can learn, even if they're knuckleheads," they are given a bad rating on the Gallop because they used a disparaging term. An experienced teacher, as the article says many black applicants are, will be further removed from the ed school brain washing and more likely to be more candid about teaching.

Anonymous wrote:I thought that this was important: "GMU researchers examining 2012 job-application data for the school system found that black applicants had slightly lower pass rates on a screening test but somewhat more extensive academic credentials and work experience than their white counterparts. On paper, the researchers said, the black and white candidates seemed to have comparable qualifications."

The WaPo article and the study didn't seem to focus on the screening test, which may be intentionally or unintentionally biased, or may tend to disfavor black applicants, but not Asian or Hispanic applicants, for some other reason. It seemed significant to me.

It seemed significant to me as well. And as an applicant who took the test, I can tell you that it in no way tests intelligence or knowledge (as the article may lead you to believe).

It's been awhile but from what I remember it's a series of questions along the line of "What is your opinion on...I dunno...meeting with teachers in a team?" A. It should be done often. B. It should be done everyday. C. It should be done as needed. D. Teachers should never meet.

How in the world black applicants can "score lower" on a test that is not testing any real knowledge or skill is beyond me. The test doesn't take into account that schools have different needs. So one FCPS school may have teachers meet once a week when another has them meet every day.

Very interesting article.

Why does this happen? Could be any #of different reasons depending on who's interviewing:

1. Some school leaders may be intimidated by AAs with advanced credentials and teaching experience.

2. Some may feel blacks are not representative of the student population, so their absence is not an issue. (If my school is 90% white I may not be too pressed to have minority representation.) However, smart people know that we ALL benefit from being in diverse settings. White kids benefit from being exposed to educated AAs--helps to combat stereotypes and making the AAs they see on the news their only exposure to blacks.

We also tend to forget about the 2 or 3 black kids in the school who feel out of place and would benefit from a friendly black adult face.

3. A fear/feeling that black applicants may not be a good "fit". In other words, because of a lack of exposure to AAs (which they perpetuate with this biased hiring practice), they assume that the black teacher may be loud, late, obnoxious, unprofessional, prone to fighting--and every other negative stereotype of black people they see on TV.

4. Just plain ol' racism and fear of the colureds takin' o'va

I thought that this was important: "GMU researchers examining 2012 job-application data for the school system found that black applicants had slightly lower pass rates on a screening test but somewhat more extensive academic credentials and work experience than their white counterparts. On paper, the researchers said, the black and white candidates seemed to have comparable qualifications."

The WaPo article and the study didn't seem to focus on the screening test, which may be intentionally or unintentionally biased, or may tend to disfavor black applicants, but not Asian or Hispanic applicants, for some other reason. It seemed significant to me.

Black teacher applicants face
discrimination

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/education/black-teacher-applicants-face-discrimination-in-a-wealthy-school-district-study-finds/2017/05/04/ea192b50-2a90-11e7-a616-d7c8a68c1a66_story.html?utm_term=.53e91da1fec2&wpisrc=nl_buzz&wpmm=1


DS attend a FCPS graduated in 2012. Beside Gym class he didn't have an AA teacher till Freshman year in High School. Why is FCPS doing this?