Anonymous wrote:OP: I'm PP with DS with similar scores, though he tests very high. What I was told is that relative areas of weakness and places to get support/help need to be considered relative to child's ability. So, GT kid can't be denied just because he is so high academically. We thought we were dealing with slow processing/perfectionism for many, many years, but testing ended up showing mild ASD.

Still in early stages of getting school support, so we'll see how this goes in reality.

Do you mind sharing how your son presented. What made you think you were dealing with slow processing/perfectionism. In our case that is what a Dr. told us. Should we get a second opinion? Could the Dr. be wrong?

OP: I'm PP with DS with similar scores, though he tests very high. What I was told is that relative areas of weakness and places to get support/help need to be considered relative to child's ability. So, GT kid can't be denied just because he is so high academically. We thought we were dealing with slow processing/perfectionism for many, many years, but testing ended up showing mild ASD.

Still in early stages of getting school support, so we'll see how this goes in reality.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here, the Dr. told me he doesn't have ADHD or any LDs, but perfectionism, I'm assuming I can't get a 504 for perfectionism. Am I wrong? What can I do to help him when his processing speed is so low comparatively (2 std dev)?? He tests poorly when compared to his IQ. The only time he tests well is when he can take his time and is not in a group setting. I dread the though of him taking the SAT/ACT one day. He's young so we have years to worry about it or better yet correct it.

You can get a 504 for an anxiety disorder. Perfectionism is related to anxiety.

Thanks! I will talk to the Dr. who diagnosed her. The issue I have is he's a smart boy but bombed NNAT and CogAT (only timed tests I've known him to take). I don't mean did poorly, I mean bombed them for any kid let alone a kid with his IQ who does well in school. There will be plenty of exams he will take in life under pressure and he is just not fast. Same with writing assignments. He's meticulously slow at getting ideas onto paper.

Anonymous wrote:OP here, the Dr. told me he doesn't have ADHD or any LDs, but perfectionism, I'm assuming I can't get a 504 for perfectionism. Am I wrong? What can I do to help him when his processing speed is so low comparatively (2 std dev)?? He tests poorly when compared to his IQ. The only time he tests well is when he can take his time and is not in a group setting. I dread the though of him taking the SAT/ACT one day. He's young so we have years to worry about it or better yet correct it.

You can get a 504 for an anxiety disorder. Perfectionism is related to anxiety.

Anonymous wrote:OP here, the Dr. told me he doesn't have ADHD or any LDs, but perfectionism, I'm assuming I can't get a 504 for perfectionism. Am I wrong? What can I do to help him when his processing speed is so low comparatively (2 std dev)?? He tests poorly when compared to his IQ. The only time he tests well is when he can take his time and is not in a group setting. I dread the though of him taking the SAT/ACT one day. He's young so we have years to worry about it or better yet correct it.

No, you can't get a 504 for perfectionism. That would be ridiculous.

Don't worry too much about it. In real life what matters is the quality of the product (within reason), not doing it a lightening speed. Timed testing is generally a pretty artificial environment that does not correspond to how people actually work. Of course some jobs (eg trial attorney) are going to require thinking on your feet more quickly -- but most jobs won't force you to come up with answers on the spot. By way of example, I test *extremely* well under timed conditions - I have very fast processing speed - I would regularly be the very top of the class or 99%. But on papers and take home exams, well, I'm much more average. And guess what? Other than getting me excellent grades and honors that help get my foot in the door, my above-average processing speed really hasn't done much for me in life outside the classroom.

In our case, it was apparent because DS would take an hour to eat, 30 minutes to get dressed, 8 hours to write a short essay in 4th grade, etc... His processing speed has been measure at the 4% and 16% percentile (he's been tested twice in his life), meaning that he's slower than 96% or 84% of his peers. That is LOW.

OP here, the Dr. told me he doesn't have ADHD or any LDs, but perfectionism, I'm assuming I can't get a 504 for perfectionism. Am I wrong? What can I do to help him when his processing speed is so low comparatively (2 std dev)?? He tests poorly when compared to his IQ. The only time he tests well is when he can take his time and is not in a group setting. I dread the though of him taking the SAT/ACT one day. He's young so we have years to worry about it or better yet correct it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Any difference in WISC sub-scores that is greater than 15 points (aka 1 standard deviation) is considered "significant". So your child has a sub-scores that are 2 standard deviations apart, which is quite significant.

This means that the FSIQ is not an accurate representation of intelligence. The person who did the testing should have considered whether to compute a GAI instead.

Basically, the significant difference between the subscores means that the IQ is an artificially low representation of intelligence (maybe only by a few points in your case since the processing speed is still above average and the IQ is quite high anyway).

If you take these results to a 504 or IEP committee, they may try to tell you that this isn't a problem, because the child is still above the average. Ask direct questions of the psychologist at the table about the significant difference. Basically these differences can be a flag for looking ADHD, LD's, executive dysfunction or impacts in other academic areas -- processing speed significantly lower than IQ can make it difficult for kids to do the physical and organizational work to keep up with their brain.

Is it 1 standard deviation or 2? I thought it was 2.

1 standard deviation is statistically significant. 1.5 standard deviations is the borderline of beginning to get help (meaning "light" help like accommodations) a great standard deviation may be necessary to get an IEP, together with other evidence like adverse impact, etc.

Anonymous wrote:It's 2 SDs.

But isn't OP's difference between processing speed 109 and the subtest score of 139, 2 standard deviations. So there you have it! Or do they just compare processing speed against FSIQ?

Anonymous wrote:Don't understand why FSIQ would not be considered an accurate representation. In our test, neuropsych felt that FSIQ could be considered accurate measure. My child's processing speed is a bit lower than OP with FSIQ one point higher.

What was explained to me is that the deviation between ability and scores is what matters. That's what we are discussing with school.

Can you explain this to me please or elaborate more on what this means?

Don't understand why FSIQ would not be considered an accurate representation. In our test, neuropsych felt that FSIQ could be considered accurate measure. My child's processing speed is a bit lower than OP with FSIQ one point higher.

What was explained to me is that the deviation between ability and scores is what matters. That's what we are discussing with school.

It's 2 SDs.

Anonymous wrote:Any difference in WISC sub-scores that is greater than 15 points (aka 1 standard deviation) is considered "significant". So your child has a sub-scores that are 2 standard deviations apart, which is quite significant.

This means that the FSIQ is not an accurate representation of intelligence. The person who did the testing should have considered whether to compute a GAI instead.

Basically, the significant difference between the subscores means that the IQ is an artificially low representation of intelligence (maybe only by a few points in your case since the processing speed is still above average and the IQ is quite high anyway).

If you take these results to a 504 or IEP committee, they may try to tell you that this isn't a problem, because the child is still above the average. Ask direct questions of the psychologist at the table about the significant difference. Basically these differences can be a flag for looking ADHD, LD's, executive dysfunction or impacts in other academic areas -- processing speed significantly lower than IQ can make it difficult for kids to do the physical and organizational work to keep up with their brain.

Is it 1 standard deviation or 2? I thought it was 2.

Any difference in WISC sub-scores that is greater than 15 points (aka 1 standard deviation) is considered "significant". So your child has a sub-scores that are 2 standard deviations apart, which is quite significant.

This means that the FSIQ is not an accurate representation of intelligence. The person who did the testing should have considered whether to compute a GAI instead.

Basically, the significant difference between the subscores means that the IQ is an artificially low representation of intelligence (maybe only by a few points in your case since the processing speed is still above average and the IQ is quite high anyway).

If you take these results to a 504 or IEP committee, they may try to tell you that this isn't a problem, because the child is still above the average. Ask direct questions of the psychologist at the table about the significant difference. Basically these differences can be a flag for looking ADHD, LD's, executive dysfunction or impacts in other academic areas -- processing speed significantly lower than IQ can make it difficult for kids to do the physical and organizational work to keep up with their brain.

Is it a number or a number in relation to other numbers? My DD has a processing speed in 73%. Doesn't seem low to me but I guess in relation to her other scores it is. Is a 109 processing speed low (even though it's above average) when subtests are 139 and FSIQ is 132?