Anonymous wrote:T14? That seems very specific. Look, you can either go to a top 5 school and go biglaw or got to lesser school and do public sector or marry well.

If you're not familiar with "T14" as a reference (or are making references to "top 5"), I suspect you don't really understand the legal market enough to comment.

With public loan repayment, loans are fine as long as they are federal loans. If a student is looking to public interest jobs - ie govt, then federal loans aren't as much a problem because you won't have to pay them back. I love my govt attorney job! 40 hour work weeks, doing interesting work, no document review, tons of independent work, and my loan payments are on an income based plan. My agency also does loan repayment that is payed out monthly, so they make almost all of my monthly payments. Most of the attorneys in my office went to law schools I've never heard of before working there, certainly not T14

With public loan repayment, loans are fine as long as they are federal loans. If a student is looking to public interest jobs - ie govt, then federal loans aren't as much a problem because you won't have to pay them back. I love my govt attorney job! 40 hour work weeks, doing interesting work, no document review, tons of independent work, and my loan payments are on an income based plan. My agency also does loan repayment that is payed out monthly, so they make almost all of my monthly payments. Most of the attorneys in my office went to law schools I've never heard of before working there, certainly not T14

T14? That seems very specific. Look, you can either go to a top 5 school and go biglaw or got to lesser school and do public sector or marry well.

Anonymous wrote:I'm a counselor at a law school and agree with the above comments about taking a hard look at her reasons for law, understanding what lawyers do and the various career paths, and the financial stresses of paying for law school. I also agree that in the vast majority of cases it's best to take a couple of years off and work between college and law school. I've seen too many people come to law school straight from undergrad and seriously question why they are even there. Law school can be very grueling and fairly joy-less. Not at all like undergrad.

Having said all of the above, let me add that I see plenty of people who are reasonably happy law students and seem to have an excellent plan for what they intend to do with their law degree. I think the problem is just going to law school and taking it for granted that a good job will await you at the end if you just apply yourself. Gone are those days. Still, it's a good fit for some kids. I have a college kid of my own whom I can see as a possible candidate for law school. I'm encouraging him to work for two years and then see how he feels.

I'm a counselor at a law school and agree with the above comments about taking a hard look at her reasons for law, understanding what lawyers do and the various career paths, and the financial stresses of paying for law school. I also agree that in the vast majority of cases it's best to take a couple of years off and work between college and law school. I've seen too many people come to law school straight from undergrad and seriously question why they are even there. Law school can be very grueling and fairly joy-less. Not at all like undergrad.

T-14 with ability to be a top performer should be fine (not always obvious if college competition wasn't extremely stiff). Or a highly motivated kid attending a "good" school who wants to work regionally should be fine.

Either way, scholarships or parent-pay is the only way to go. Paying down loans with any job less than firm-paying job is brutal, and those aren't even anywhere near guaranteed for T-14 students.

Anonymous wrote:I would discourage ANYONE from going straight from undergrad to law school. Go work a "real" job, find out more about the role of lawyers in the economy from an outside perspective, if it still sounds good, start applying.

I absolutely agree with this. Further, I don't think anyone should go to law school these days just because it seems like the law would fit their skill set. After working for a few years, she should be able to identify a specific career goal beyond "being a lawyer" -- a particular specialty she's interested in, whether she wants to work in big law, a small firm, a public interest organization, etc., because the may inform what schools she should be looking at (or whether she should cross law school off the list because she's not going to get into the kids of schools she'd need). These days, I don't think law school should be a goal in itself, you should go because you identify goal X, and law school is your best means of accomplishing that.

Anonymous wrote:is she pretty, she can always marry a lawyer, none of the debt but the same lifestyle

Seriously, there were a few women in my (T14) law school class that were there to do just that. At the time it was very bizzare to me (why put yourself through the hell of 1L if you really don't mean to practice law), but 15+ years later I sometimes wonder whether they weren't the ones who had it right.

Sorry for going off-topic.

is she pretty, she can always marry a lawyer, none of the debt but the same lifestyle

I would discourage ANYONE from going straight from undergrad to law school. Go work a "real" job, find out more about the role of lawyers in the economy from an outside perspective, if it still sounds good, start applying.

your daughter needs to know only one sentence.

"yale or fail"

The money thing would be the main issue - she can likely get into a T20 school, however would need to take on debt.

Your first bullet point describes what appeals to hear about the field. She is very eloquent, people person when she needs to be but would definitely appreciate a job where she can sit in an office and just churn. Excellent written and reading skills.

I graduated from law school less than five years ago, so the economy was not good when I graduated. I offer these points of consideration:

* Does she understand what being a lawyer actually entails? This can seem like a condescending question, but I have friends who got through three years of school and at least two internships and came out still not really understanding what their days as attorneys would be like. At a firm, you are under significant time pressure, churning out written assignments, generally alone, for 10+ hours a day. Not everyone enjoys that kind of solitary work environment. Clerkships are mostly the same thing. Jobs that get new attorneys into the courtroom are relatively rare and usually require the attorneys to juggle huge case loads with minimal guidance. I suggest she work at a law firm or other legal organization, even in an administrative capacity, to get a sense of what the work environment is like. You say that law seems like a fit for her skills and interests, but plenty of other satisfying careers with better job prospects may be too...

* Can she get into a great school, preferably with a scholarship? In this economy, I would not recommend someone go to a law school outside of the top 50. I would not recommend someone take on debt to go to a law school outside of the top 20. The job prospects just aren't there for someone to assume that kind of financial risk. Things are quite grim for new attorneys with six-figure debt from less competitive schools.

* Can you comfortably pay for law school for her? If you have the kind of money where you can pay for her to go to law school and accumulate no debt, the calculus becomes very different. More options will be open to her because she won't need to make money to pay off her loans. She would have the luxury of deciding she doesn't want to practice but finding a career path where a JD is still useful. Lobbying is one example of this.

Would you discourage a current undergraduate student from law school/career in law? My daughter is a current college student (class of '19) and law seems like a natural fit for her skill set and interests. She has always considered law school as a potential, but obviously you don't hear great things about the law market these days.