OP here. Thank you, guys, these are all great suggestions, and I plan to use them. (Except for one, you know who you are).

I feel bad for her, and I worry that I will become the same way. I feel like it is genetic in a way. Her whole side seems to be very "woe is me"/"I have the hardest life ever. " I do love her and she was/is a good mom in many ways, which is why I want her to feel ok. But I feel that she places her happiness in the hands of others, mainly myself, and it's a very heavy burden to bear, especially since I am myself trying to just keep my head above water with small children, a full time job and health issues. And of course, I am the type of person who is affected very easily by others' moods (is there a scientific classification for that?), so it's all just a perfect, crappy storm.

I love 18:05's strategy -- because a lot of times my conflict with my mother (in hindsight) is really a communication issue. My mom, like 18:05's, hears any "no" and it triggers her anxiety (even if it's that she's literally just visited and I can't accommodate a visit again the next day/week). So, it's important for her to hear, "I love you! We had a great visit with you!" Then I practice being firm and vague: "That next visit won't work with our schedules but we will see you again soon. I love you." Similarly, I try with my mom to find ways for her to shine. I think of situations that will naturally suit my mom's strengths and those are the moments I choose to engage. I fade out of the picture, whenever possible, in the moments I know she is unduly stressing out about something -- if it's something I don't plan to change, or can't, for whatever reason. I also sometimes try to calmly name the emotions I see playing out to help her make more conscious decisions: "It seems to be giving you a lot of stress to decide about whether or not to visit your cousin. Your cousin loves you and will love you whether you visit or not. Maybe if you separate your desire to visit or not visit from fear that your cousin will be angry you can make the choice you feel best about." One thing I have realized through a lot of therapy and time as an adult, is that my mom's needs are bigger than what I can fill. 17:59 is so quotable: "You can't spackle the hole in her heart." However, as a mom myself, although I think it's unhealthy to take on my mother's entire sense of well-being, I try to go for the low-hanging fruit, so to speak. When I have an idea for a very neutral conversation that I know will make my mom happy? I pick up the phone in a heartbeat. It makes us both happier to have a casual, positive connection, so I do this as often as easy, natural scenarios occur to me. And then that positivity builds. Sounds like your mom is in a hard place. Transitions can be very difficult so my empathy to you both. I think constructive, gentle reminders of retaining a positive outlook (as in - make sure you're being kind to yourself because transitions are hard - are you eating/sleeping/exercising well? have you thought through activities you might enjoy? could you go for a walk/explore a new neighborhood? what's your plan for changing your activities so you are not bored?). That way, you are not taking responsibility for her happiness, but serving as a coach of sorts. That helps for me when I am down (having my husband gently ask if I would feel better if I went and exercised)....

OP, you can tell mom to get therapy and/or medication, but unless she's a danger to self or others, that's all you can or need to do. Sometimes, elderly and infirm housebound people get home health aides, but it sounds like she's just fin e physically.

So here's what I suggest: disengage for a while. I know it sounds hard, selfish, etc., but you have to protect your own sanity. She's your mom, not vice versa. Since she has no room to nurture you, make space to nurture yourself. When she calls, set a mental time limit to the conversation and stick to it. Tell her that you have other things to do, hang up politely and do them.

Treat yourself to something special because you deserve it, and as for any residual guilt you may feel, forgive yourself because you DON'T deserve the guilt. You're doing your best to support and encourage your mom, and you're getting very little in return. So take time and space to appreciate yourself. She's been this way for a while and will most likely stay this way, but you've got to give yourself a respite.

One more idea.

Once I had this sort of fight w/my mom who said I had no time for her.

I printed a calendar (3 months) and highlighted opportunities for us to get together and mailed it to her.
I blocked out times I could NOT change my plans (a wedding, for example).

She said that seeing the dates in front of her helped her to see that I was not ALWAYS busy, but when we spoke on the phone, she heard "no" all the time.
It was just using a different medium that helped.

I used that at work sometimes when I needed to show a boss how close a deadline was, or how many projects we have going on at one time.

Some people are not great verbal communicators and process auditory info in a different way. I even send my mom paper invites to obvious event (Baptisms, or my kid's birthday party) because she doesn't feel invited. It doesn't always work, but it fails less often that talking.

YMMV.

OP. ignore PP.

You are human.

This person choses to be in a situation where things could be better, and sees the glass as half empty, no matter what.
It also feels like the task of making her happy has been cast for you.

I really agree with the person who said some therapy for you would be time/$ well-spent.
I did this. My mom (who moved 1000 miles away so she could argue with the same snow birds in another setting) often does the "if only you would...." and "everyone else has their grandkids visiting all the time, and here I am with nothing to look forward to..." as if I am supposed to be the organ grinder's monkey. When I DO try to make plans, I hear that she's been invited here or there (and then I hear how bad it was).

You can't spackle the hole in her heart.

You CAN have some kind of relationship and you should try, but try with some guidance from someone who both understands depression/isolation and is rooting for YOU to be in a healthy emotional state.

Good luck and I am sorry you are frustrated. It sucks to have someone blame you for their "stuff," and it is hard not to take the bait.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I don't see you turning this around. You have too little patience for your mother's misery (whatever the reason). You will not be able to empathize, before you experience a profound (likely negative) life event. She would definitely not turn around, because old age goes hand in hand with depression.

I am sorry, what? I have been talking her out of funks for years, this is not new. How exactly am I supposed to empathize here? And I have experienced a major life-threatening life event, so what was that supposed to do to me that it didn't? If anything, it taught me to appreciate how precious and imperfect life is and that I should embrace it. Please tell me what I can do for her to help her see that as well.

You misunderstood me. It is not your job to help your mother. You can't help a depressed person without her consent anyway. It is your job to be more accepting and less annoyed with her. It is not a difficult job.

Life-threatening event? Your life? Who gives a fuck? Try profound personal loss, maybe you'll get it.

If it's not a difficult job why are you having so much trouble modeling it for OP right now?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I don't see you turning this around. You have too little patience for your mother's misery (whatever the reason). You will not be able to empathize, before you experience a profound (likely negative) life event. She would definitely not turn around, because old age goes hand in hand with depression.

I am sorry, what? I have been talking her out of funks for years, this is not new. How exactly am I supposed to empathize here? And I have experienced a major life-threatening life event, so what was that supposed to do to me that it didn't? If anything, it taught me to appreciate how precious and imperfect life is and that I should embrace it. Please tell me what I can do for her to help her see that as well.

You misunderstood me. It is not your job to help your mother. You can't help a depressed person without her consent anyway. It is your job to be more accepting and less annoyed with her. It is not a difficult job.

Life-threatening event? Your life? Who gives a fuck? Try profound personal loss, maybe you'll get it.

Wow.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I don't see you turning this around. You have too little patience for your mother's misery (whatever the reason). You will not be able to empathize, before you experience a profound (likely negative) life event. She would definitely not turn around, because old age goes hand in hand with depression.

I am sorry, what? I have been talking her out of funks for years, this is not new. How exactly am I supposed to empathize here? And I have experienced a major life-threatening life event, so what was that supposed to do to me that it didn't? If anything, it taught me to appreciate how precious and imperfect life is and that I should embrace it. Please tell me what I can do for her to help her see that as well.

You misunderstood me. It is not your job to help your mother. You can't help a depressed person without her consent anyway. It is your job to be more accepting and less annoyed with her. It is not a difficult job.

Life-threatening event? Your life? Who gives a fuck? Try profound personal loss, maybe you'll get it.

Anonymous wrote:It seems no matter what, this woman will just never be happy. Before, it was too much work stress. Now she's retired, and moved across country and she is lonely and bored. The subtext is that she expects us (her child, her grandchildren, her husband) to somehow make her happy. I told her to give it time, because it's only been a couple of months and this is normal. There is a language barrier and I don't think counseling would really help. In her mind, everyone else has it better and is happier, and she just had a shitty life (she didn't). I tried laying it out there for her how lucky she really is and what a good life she has. I am at a loss. She was/is a good mother, but honestly, I don't want to be around her anymore. Always wants to be reassured that she is loved, and needs to be praised. It's exhausting. And I feel guilty, because I have to force myself to be around her. And myself being an introvert (and only child) does not help.

I would love to hear some success stories in turning this around.

Medication and a counselor who speaks her native language.

Op sorry you're getting such negative responses. People with parents who act like parents and not children simply cannot relate.

I have a mom like yours, only more severely mentally ill, but the debbie downer stuff is similar and exhausting. You're not going to be able to change her mind, and any effort you expend to "make her happy" will only work short term. I don't have great advice, but one thing that has helped me in therapy (like I mentioned, my mom is really bad, so I work on this stuff a lot in therapy) is my mantra: "she's an adult."

Your mom is an adult who has free agency. She can find something in life to make her happy, she can seek therapy, she can be miserable. But you can't do any of those things for her. Next time she starts complaining, instead of starting to try to fix it or "make her happy," say "I know you'll figure this out. If you need help brainstorming I'm always here for you." It's not an abandonment - you're still here for her, but not in the role of the fixer.

Good luck! I know it's exhausting.

Introvert only child with a similar mother here. No advice, just hugs. It sucks. At least she lives far away!

OP, have you tried therapy yourself? Growing up with a depressed parent is really, really hard. One thing you have to internalize is that you are NOT responsible for your mother's emotional well being. You cannot make her happy. You cannot fix her.

It sounds like you are as empathetic and kind as possible, but that you need to draw more emotional boundaries with her. A therapist can help with that.

I really do empathize. I spent decades trying to make my parents happy. Can't be done. You can't change her or control her or force her to get help. You can only change yourself. You can't make her see what you see.

Anonymous wrote:OP, I don't see you turning this around. You have too little patience for your mother's misery (whatever the reason). You will not be able to empathize, before you experience a profound (likely negative) life event. She would definitely not turn around, because old age goes hand in hand with depression.

I am sorry, what? I have been talking her out of funks for years, this is not new. How exactly am I supposed to empathize here? And I have experienced a major life-threatening life event, so what was that supposed to do to me that it didn't? If anything, it taught me to appreciate how precious and imperfect life is and that I should embrace it. Please tell me what I can do for her to help her see that as well.

OP, I don't see you turning this around. You have too little patience for your mother's misery (whatever the reason). You will not be able to empathize, before you experience a profound (likely negative) life event. She would definitely not turn around, because old age goes hand in hand with depression.

It seems no matter what, this woman will just never be happy. Before, it was too much work stress. Now she's retired, and moved across country and she is lonely and bored. The subtext is that she expects us (her child, her grandchildren, her husband) to somehow make her happy. I told her to give it time, because it's only been a couple of months and this is normal. There is a language barrier and I don't think counseling would really help. In her mind, everyone else has it better and is happier, and she just had a shitty life (she didn't). I tried laying it out there for her how lucky she really is and what a good life she has. I am at a loss. She was/is a good mother, but honestly, I don't want to be around her anymore. Always wants to be reassured that she is loved, and needs to be praised. It's exhausting. And I feel guilty, because I have to force myself to be around her. And myself being an introvert (and only child) does not help.

I would love to hear some success stories in turning this around.