Anonymous
12/12/2015 21:15
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
People lie and do despicable things all the time and get away with it. What a wonderful society we live in. There are no consequences for most so the risk vs benefit is always leaning toward the benefit.
Anonymous
12/12/2015 20:47
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Not enough facts, too muddled IMO.
I can tell you that one bedrock guideline is that lack of candor or provable (key element) material lying in an official proceeding is often worse and leads to harsher penalty than the underlying incident under investigation.
My clients for 20+ yrs were federal criminal investigators and I always told them that lack of candor was as much or more their worry than the substance of many inquiries.
6:11 here. Quite true. Lying in an investigation (Lack of candor in fedspeak) often becomes much more serious than the substance of the investigation -- absence without leave, outside work without permission, whatever it was. This is because IGs and Special Counsels go apeshit about being lied to.
What if the special counsel report says attorney had to have lied and nothing else? In the clear?
Anonymous
12/12/2015 07:02
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Anonymous wrote:Not enough facts, too muddled IMO.
I can tell you that one bedrock guideline is that lack of candor or provable (key element) material lying in an official proceeding is often worse and leads to harsher penalty than the underlying incident under investigation.
My clients for 20+ yrs were federal criminal investigators and I always told them that lack of candor was as much or more their worry than the substance of many inquiries.
6:11 here. Quite true. Lying in an investigation (Lack of candor in fedspeak) often becomes much more serious than the substance of the investigation -- absence without leave, outside work without permission, whatever it was. This is because IGs and Special Counsels go apeshit about being lied to.
Anonymous
12/11/2015 22:38
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Not enough facts, too muddled IMO.
I can tell you that one bedrock guideline is that lack of candor or provable (key element) material lying in an official proceeding is often worse and leads to harsher penalty than the underlying incident under investigation.
My clients for 20+ yrs were federal criminal investigators and I always told them that lack of candor was as much or more their worry than the substance of many inquiries.
I can tell you that one bedrock guideline is that lack of candor or provable (key element) material lying in an official proceeding is often worse and leads to harsher penalty than the underlying incident under investigation.
My clients for 20+ yrs were federal criminal investigators and I always told them that lack of candor was as much or more their worry than the substance of many inquiries.
Anonymous
12/11/2015 21:03
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Anonymous wrote:What type of investigation is this? The outcome of most investigations by Office of Special Counsel are presented as recommendations to your Agency. Sometimes they just send a letter closing the case. Sometimes they recommend discipline if the Merit Systems Principles were violated.
Does OSC know you lied? If so, they will probably recommend that your Agency discipline you, probably for "Lack of Candor during an investigation," which could mean removal from the federal service, or it could mean a reprimand or suspension, but since we have no idea what this investigation is about, and how serious your lie was, and how the disciplinary action would play out at your agency, it's hard to say.
As for Bar actions, it's up to your Agency ethics counsel to decide whether a Lack of Candor charges violates your state ethics rules where you are barred. At my agency, we don't do bar referral for something like this. When we do, the bars tell us to handle it administratively. We only do bar referral for crimes.
What if special counsel doesn't do anything? Just advise agency of candor and nothing else.
Anonymous
12/10/2015 08:34
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
I hope you aren't covering for anyone. Remember, your agency will have no problem hanging you out to dry. You sound young... the perfect scapegoat.
Anonymous
12/10/2015 06:11
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
What type of investigation is this? The outcome of most investigations by Office of Special Counsel are presented as recommendations to your Agency. Sometimes they just send a letter closing the case. Sometimes they recommend discipline if the Merit Systems Principles were violated.
Does OSC know you lied? If so, they will probably recommend that your Agency discipline you, probably for "Lack of Candor during an investigation," which could mean removal from the federal service, or it could mean a reprimand or suspension, but since we have no idea what this investigation is about, and how serious your lie was, and how the disciplinary action would play out at your agency, it's hard to say.
As for Bar actions, it's up to your Agency ethics counsel to decide whether a Lack of Candor charges violates your state ethics rules where you are barred. At my agency, we don't do bar referral for something like this. When we do, the bars tell us to handle it administratively. We only do bar referral for crimes.
Does OSC know you lied? If so, they will probably recommend that your Agency discipline you, probably for "Lack of Candor during an investigation," which could mean removal from the federal service, or it could mean a reprimand or suspension, but since we have no idea what this investigation is about, and how serious your lie was, and how the disciplinary action would play out at your agency, it's hard to say.
As for Bar actions, it's up to your Agency ethics counsel to decide whether a Lack of Candor charges violates your state ethics rules where you are barred. At my agency, we don't do bar referral for something like this. When we do, the bars tell us to handle it administratively. We only do bar referral for crimes.
Anonymous
12/09/2015 20:18
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Lied about a perception? Did they make an emphatic statement when the situation calls for caution? Or, undersell a point on an urgent matter?
The details matter here.
Anonymous
12/09/2015 20:14
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Can you prove that they lied? That they purposefully gave false testimony? If not, nothing will happen at all.
Anonymous
12/09/2015 20:08
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Is the lie material to the investigation? We need to know more.
+1. For all we know from the OP, the lie was about their favorite flavor of ice cream.
Yes it was very material
Anonymous
12/09/2015 17:23
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Anonymous wrote:Is the lie material to the investigation? We need to know more.
+1. For all we know from the OP, the lie was about their favorite flavor of ice cream.
Anonymous
12/09/2015 17:17
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
No, the federal attorney must resign.
Anonymous
12/09/2015 14:52
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
Is the lie material to the investigation? We need to know more.
Anonymous
12/09/2015 12:56
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
What did you lie about?
Anonymous
12/09/2015 12:31
Subject: Lying federal lawyer
If a federal attorney lies to Special Counsel can they keep their job? What about the Bar?