Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sigh. I have a very similar situation. My approach is to outsource as much as possible and have him do the things he can actually handle that are not time sensitive. Eg he does a ton of childcare on the weekends. He can do some childcare in the evenings but only when I make him do pickup otherwise he just wouldn't come home before bedtime. Basically you have to pick the things you know he will actually do and not screw up. Sorry, I know what it is like!

I am sure this varies person to person, but can you give me some examples of what he does? When he stays with the children and I say, go on a run, the entire house gets trashed top to bottom, things get ruined (marker all over a shirt of mine or couch or something) and there is literally no contribution to the household, like a meal cooked for later or an errand run, a house project finished, just a major deficit. We were outsourcing a ton for the past year, but the truth is we really cannot afford that. We had a short term cushion where we could throw money at the problem, and we did. It was fairly effective, but it was nothing other than a bandaid, and now that is gone. Back to square one, and I am hating life.

Not PP, but my DH's job is to clean up the kitchen while I put the kids to bed. It works because he is distraction-free, and he has a discrete list of tasks that we agreed on in advance. Put food away. Load and start dishwasher. Wash all other dishes. Wipe countertops and stove. Clear and wipe table. Take out trash if more than half full. Sweep floor. And he has a deadline-- 8:30 PM. I know this makes me sound like kind of a jerk, but it has worked really well-- other than when he is truly ill or not physically present, he has done it every night for about 5 years. I praise him to our friends and to his parents.

Of course, it only works because he actually wants to pull his weight. It won't work if your DH is lazy, sexist, and selfish.

OP, you mentioned something critical but in passing -- your DH has ADD although referred to today as ADHD. All his behaviors are characteristic of people with ADHD. Is he taking medication for his ADHD? That can greatly increase his ability to concentrate and stay on task. Why don't you consider helping him get treated for the ADHD before you consider a separation or divorce. He is not going to improve until he gets some help. He can't help being the way he is and expecting more is unfair to him unless you become part of the solution.

Anonymous wrote:A few things, OP. One is that people are different, and not everyone is a multitasker. You say above that if he stays with the children he makes literally no contribution to the household, like a meal cooked or a house project finished. Well, I am like that. If I am watching kids, I am probably not going to get anything else done - my brain just can't manage all that happening at once. That just may be the way your DH's brain works.

Second, when you describe your morning that was so frustrating, while your DH was feeding the kids eggs and toast, you were upstairs cleaning?!? Cleaning is what needs to be done when you all are in a rush? That sounds crazy to me. As you say, you get depressed when your standards are not met, so maybe it's depressing to you to leave a house when bedrooms aren't tidy or whatever. But that doesn't mean that your DH's approach is WRONG. I'd certainly prioritize a breakfast of eggs and a messy house over a breakfast of granola bars and a tidy house. You make it seem like there's one right way of doing things, and his is wrong.

I'd suggest the book, "Is it you, me, or adult ADD?" and maybe working with a couple's counselor who is very familiar with ADD and can actually coach you guys.

No, I wasn't cleaning, I was getting ready, which I normally do in a horribly haphazard fashion, makeup in the car, no hairbrushing, etc. While I was getting ready, yes, I did about three minutes of tidying to make the bed, put away his clothes, pick up his socks, put my pajamas away, wipe down the sink and put the toothbrushes back. What I would consider a basic adult routine.

I understand that not everyone can multitask, but I don't think that gives him a free pass to contribute nothing. I feel it is his duty to figure out what his best contribution can be and do that. I feel the way he treats our children is not only harmful to them personally, but very passive aggressive towards me and harmful to our marriage.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sigh. I have a very similar situation. My approach is to outsource as much as possible and have him do the things he can actually handle that are not time sensitive. Eg he does a ton of childcare on the weekends. He can do some childcare in the evenings but only when I make him do pickup otherwise he just wouldn't come home before bedtime. Basically you have to pick the things you know he will actually do and not screw up. Sorry, I know what it is like!

I am sure this varies person to person, but can you give me some examples of what he does? When he stays with the children and I say, go on a run, the entire house gets trashed top to bottom, things get ruined (marker all over a shirt of mine or couch or something) and there is literally no contribution to the household, like a meal cooked for later or an errand run, a house project finished, just a major deficit. We were outsourcing a ton for the past year, but the truth is we really cannot afford that. We had a short term cushion where we could throw money at the problem, and we did. It was fairly effective, but it was nothing other than a bandaid, and now that is gone. Back to square one, and I am hating life.

If your children are so ill-behaved that the entire house is trashed when you're out running (what is that, like 45 minutes?) then it sounds like there is a big discipline issue that is to be blamed on both of you. I mean why are your shirts somewhere where your kid can color on them?

He surfs when he is with them, completely ignores them while he dives into something he wants to do, they get bored, feel neglected and act out, actually pretty similar to me!

This doesn't happen when I am with the children, they are well-behaved and nothing gets ruined, they help me prepare a meal or work on a house project happily.

A few things, OP. One is that people are different, and not everyone is a multitasker. You say above that if he stays with the children he makes literally no contribution to the household, like a meal cooked or a house project finished. Well, I am like that. If I am watching kids, I am probably not going to get anything else done - my brain just can't manage all that happening at once. That just may be the way your DH's brain works.

Second, when you describe your morning that was so frustrating, while your DH was feeding the kids eggs and toast, you were upstairs cleaning?!? Cleaning is what needs to be done when you all are in a rush? That sounds crazy to me. As you say, you get depressed when your standards are not met, so maybe it's depressing to you to leave a house when bedrooms aren't tidy or whatever. But that doesn't mean that your DH's approach is WRONG. I'd certainly prioritize a breakfast of eggs and a messy house over a breakfast of granola bars and a tidy house. You make it seem like there's one right way of doing things, and his is wrong.

I'd suggest the book, "Is it you, me, or adult ADD?" and maybe working with a couple's counselor who is very familiar with ADD and can actually coach you guys.

Post a list in the kitchen. Get a whiteboard. Have him take complete control of one household chore and either routinize it (sweep on Thursday evenings.), or have it be his ongoing thing (every dish in the sink, he rinses and puts in the dishwasher--everyday, all the time.)

Get your list out of your head. It's not real to him. His eyes are different. Where you see an opportunity to gather all of the scattered laundry into the washing machine, he sees as a chance to make eggs for the kids (or not).

It's not a moral failing or stupidity. Think of it as cross-cultural. He operates from a difference place.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sigh. I have a very similar situation. My approach is to outsource as much as possible and have him do the things he can actually handle that are not time sensitive. Eg he does a ton of childcare on the weekends. He can do some childcare in the evenings but only when I make him do pickup otherwise he just wouldn't come home before bedtime. Basically you have to pick the things you know he will actually do and not screw up. Sorry, I know what it is like!

I am sure this varies person to person, but can you give me some examples of what he does? When he stays with the children and I say, go on a run, the entire house gets trashed top to bottom, things get ruined (marker all over a shirt of mine or couch or something) and there is literally no contribution to the household, like a meal cooked for later or an errand run, a house project finished, just a major deficit. We were outsourcing a ton for the past year, but the truth is we really cannot afford that. We had a short term cushion where we could throw money at the problem, and we did. It was fairly effective, but it was nothing other than a bandaid, and now that is gone. Back to square one, and I am hating life.

If your children are so ill-behaved that the entire house is trashed when you're out running (what is that, like 45 minutes?) then it sounds like there is a big discipline issue that is to be blamed on both of you. I mean why are your shirts somewhere where your kid can color on them?

Anonymous wrote:It does sound like he needs medical help. But it sounds like the household system you are running is too complicated and time-sensitive for him to comprehend and carry out. You are always running around trying to get stuff done on the list you carry in your head, and he's not able to figure out the method to your madness-- instead, it confuses him more, and he gets depressed because you get mad at him in ways that he perceives as unpredictable and unreasonable. (Even though I'm sure you are totally right to feel the way you do. It's just that the problem is too complicated for him to understand.)

You need to select a category of clearly defined responsibilities that are super-simple and obvious, such as taking out the trash. If you are going to do all the managing and thinking, then that makes him the pack mule of the operation.

He takes out the trash and changes the water bottle, when he is home, when he remembers. This means I end up doing it at least 50% of the time.

Anonymous wrote:Sigh. I have a very similar situation. My approach is to outsource as much as possible and have him do the things he can actually handle that are not time sensitive. Eg he does a ton of childcare on the weekends. He can do some childcare in the evenings but only when I make him do pickup otherwise he just wouldn't come home before bedtime. Basically you have to pick the things you know he will actually do and not screw up. Sorry, I know what it is like!

I am sure this varies person to person, but can you give me some examples of what he does? When he stays with the children and I say, go on a run, the entire house gets trashed top to bottom, things get ruined (marker all over a shirt of mine or couch or something) and there is literally no contribution to the household, like a meal cooked for later or an errand run, a house project finished, just a major deficit. We were outsourcing a ton for the past year, but the truth is we really cannot afford that. We had a short term cushion where we could throw money at the problem, and we did. It was fairly effective, but it was nothing other than a bandaid, and now that is gone. Back to square one, and I am hating life.

It does sound like he needs medical help. But it sounds like the household system you are running is too complicated and time-sensitive for him to comprehend and carry out. You are always running around trying to get stuff done on the list you carry in your head, and he's not able to figure out the method to your madness-- instead, it confuses him more, and he gets depressed because you get mad at him in ways that he perceives as unpredictable and unreasonable. (Even though I'm sure you are totally right to feel the way you do. It's just that the problem is too complicated for him to understand.)

You need to select a category of clearly defined responsibilities that are super-simple and obvious, such as taking out the trash. If you are going to do all the managing and thinking, then that makes him the pack mule of the operation.

Sigh. I have a very similar situation. My approach is to outsource as much as possible and have him do the things he can actually handle that are not time sensitive. Eg he does a ton of childcare on the weekends. He can do some childcare in the evenings but only when I make him do pickup otherwise he just wouldn't come home before bedtime. Basically you have to pick the things you know he will actually do and not screw up. Sorry, I know what it is like!

I don't even know why you're married to him since you're so obviously vastly superior in every way.

I would focus back in on what seems to be a medical issue for him, his ADD. Is he seeing a doctor or therapist regarding these issues, has he tried medication, or other organizing short cuts. Does he realize how frustrated you really are? Can he get his sh&t together for work? And lastly, is he getting worse or has he always been this way.

You need to figure out what you can do to help your DH.

We read the book Spouseonomics. But it requires someone who is more motivated than your husband sounds.

Yes, another thread here by a woman who feels like domestic help.

My husband was raised in a 1950's household, where the mom literally does everything, (but has pretty low standards) and so my husband kind of comes home as though that alone is his contribution. He consistently overschedules himself and is also spacey - high ADD. Forgets about basic things like what time we have to leave the house in the morning, what time the children need to go to bed, etc. Between those two traits / tendencies, there are perpetual reasons why he's never around / available / participating, or when he is participating, he is in a fog, and not actually helping. For example, he made a huge deal about "helping" this morning by feeding the children an eggs and toast breakfast when we didnt have time, instead of helping put shoes on and get out the door, eat granola bars in the car. I was harriedly trying to get ready for the day myself, for 15 minutes, while cleaning our upstairs, while this happened. We were 20 minutes late, when I came downstairs, there were still 20 things to do before getting out of the door.

I do 90% of everything, he might putter here and there, but the majority of what he does beyond that is because I am demanding it of him. I'm tired of being a nag and a bi*&@#. We are not a team, and we don't seem to be on the same page at all. Its been seven years, and I can't deal anymore.

I have higher standards and as such, have been pretty screwed by both of our expectations. Dropping those standards just makes me feel really depressed. I also have a higher sex drive, more motivation overall, more social, more engaged with life, etc.

Are there any resources out there for creating a more harmonious household in this type of scenario?

Thinking of initiating a separation because life is just too damn short.