Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the advice everyone, he does pay rent and he does work, he has a great job in fact. He was helping with household chores until he started working, DH and I clean every Sunday unless we have preplanned something else like being out of town but he doesn't contribute to the chores anymore despite my efforts to remind him he's a part of our home now and everyone has chores to do. I feel like he was stunted at teenage years. Our mother passed away when he was 12 and I was in college. I have always taken care of him so to speak, back to school clothes, extracurricular activities, he stayed with me every summer and DH and I have always lived places with extra room "just in case" he wanted to live with us. I blame this entirely on my father. My mother kept a beautiful home. Father did nothing, except sit on his butt all day in and out of jobs and I swear couldn't operate even a vacuum if you held a gun to his head. I don't want to kick brother out, I feel like he's not ready to live with anyone else, he has to be retaught everything. Maybe he has ADHD, DH does and they are very close. That could explain why DH gives him a pass, he is always saying he reminds him of himself.

OK, OP, it's all your father's fault. Your father enabled him. But now you are enabling him. He's not your "little brother" --- he's a 24 year old man with a job. He needs his own place where he will be taking care of his own space. You are not his mom and can't be. And he's not a teenager, even if he lives like one.

Why do you think he "needs" to be living with you?

+1

Most folks stumble through figuring out household management in their 20s.

Yup. My mom was a hoarder and I new zilch about housekeeping when I went to college. You learn as you go, as you need to. And people's standards are different. But OP, you're not helping your brother. He's a grown man. He ought to be in his own space, not leaning on you as his almost-mommy-but-not. It's sad that he lost his mom early but you can't fix that. You're not helping him now.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the advice everyone, he does pay rent and he does work, he has a great job in fact. He was helping with household chores until he started working, DH and I clean every Sunday unless we have preplanned something else like being out of town but he doesn't contribute to the chores anymore despite my efforts to remind him he's a part of our home now and everyone has chores to do. I feel like he was stunted at teenage years. Our mother passed away when he was 12 and I was in college. I have always taken care of him so to speak, back to school clothes, extracurricular activities, he stayed with me every summer and DH and I have always lived places with extra room "just in case" he wanted to live with us. I blame this entirely on my father. My mother kept a beautiful home. Father did nothing, except sit on his butt all day in and out of jobs and I swear couldn't operate even a vacuum if you held a gun to his head. I don't want to kick brother out, I feel like he's not ready to live with anyone else, he has to be retaught everything. Maybe he has ADHD, DH does and they are very close. That could explain why DH gives him a pass, he is always saying he reminds him of himself.

OK, OP, it's all your father's fault. Your father enabled him. But now you are enabling him. He's not your "little brother" --- he's a 24 year old man with a job. He needs his own place where he will be taking care of his own space. You are not his mom and can't be. And he's not a teenager, even if he lives like one.

Why do you think he "needs" to be living with you?

+1

Most folks stumble through figuring out household management in their 20s.

I went through this two years ago. He didn't help, didn't pay rent/utilities/anything.

It'll end in tears/fights/resentments that will last for years.

You have to talk now. There's no time when there isn't a crisis because his presence IS the crisis. With a dysfunctional brother/BIL, there is NO HAPPY END ... just an end.

An adult brother who has to live with a sibling needs therapy, not an enabler. He has to go off and face his own problems. He needs a life of his own and possiby a therapist, neither of which you can provide.

End it now!

Sometime when there isn't a crisis or issue going on, you need to sit down and have a household discussion with your brother. You need to establish the rules of the household. Let him know that if he can't adhere to the household rules then it will be time for him to find alternative room and board.

Also identify ways to compensate when he doesn't adhere. For example, he can help with household chores or he will contribute $X to hire a cleaning service to clean. He will not overload the w/d. If the appliances break because he overloaded them, he will be responsible for paying the service fee to have the units serviced. Since he's hiding out in his room to avoid interacting with you and your husband, I would tell him, no dishes in the bedroom. If he wants to eat in there, he can buy paper plates and dishes to eat, but that he needs to empty the garbage in his room daily so that it doesn't attract bugs. If bugs start showing up in his room, you'll hire an exterminator and he'll pay for the service. Tell him that if he does not wipe down the bathroom that you'll start taking his clothes wipe down the bathroom. After you clean the bathroom with some of his clean tee shirts and he has to do more laundry, he'll get the picture.

Alternatively, you can just treat him like a renter and tell him that there is a $X monthly cleaning fee to take care of all of those cleaning chores that he doesn't and then apply his money towards a weekly cleaning service that comes through and cleans especially his room and public spaces.

Maybe you should use his rent money for a cleaning service who could help with his laundry? I realize that is probably enabling as well, but it might make things easier so you get along better although I'm sure the daily chores like the dishwasher would continue. You are very kind to take care of him. I also agree that he might have ADHD and signs might help.

Once he has a real paying job, it is time to launch. Where did you live when you were 24?

Anonymous wrote:You haven't asked, but what your father does or doesn't do is irelevant. Your issue is with your brother alone. I can imagine his future wife blaming you for things, when really, he's responsible for his own actions.

Absolutely. Treat him like your renter, or a housemate. Regardless of why he doesn't clean up after himself, he needs to clean up after himself if he is living in your house, period.

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the advice everyone, he does pay rent and he does work, he has a great job in fact. He was helping with household chores until he started working, DH and I clean every Sunday unless we have preplanned something else like being out of town but he doesn't contribute to the chores anymore despite my efforts to remind him he's a part of our home now and everyone has chores to do. I feel like he was stunted at teenage years. Our mother passed away when he was 12 and I was in college. I have always taken care of him so to speak, back to school clothes, extracurricular activities, he stayed with me every summer and DH and I have always lived places with extra room "just in case" he wanted to live with us. I blame this entirely on my father. My mother kept a beautiful home. Father did nothing, except sit on his butt all day in and out of jobs and I swear couldn't operate even a vacuum if you held a gun to his head. I don't want to kick brother out, I feel like he's not ready to live with anyone else, he has to be retaught everything. Maybe he has ADHD, DH does and they are very close. That could explain why DH gives him a pass, he is always saying he reminds him of himself.

OK, OP, it's all your father's fault. Your father enabled him. But now you are enabling him. He's not your "little brother" --- he's a 24 year old man with a job. He needs his own place where he will be taking care of his own space. You are not his mom and can't be. And he's not a teenager, even if he lives like one.

Why do you think he "needs" to be living with you?

Start with one thing at a time. Tell him if he overloads the washer again, he'll lose privledge to use it and will need to go to a laundromat. Then make sure he know how much is one load and how much soap to use. Make it clear you will show him once and that's it.

You haven't asked, but what your father does or doesn't do is irelevant. Your issue is with your brother alone. I can imagine his future wife blaming you for things, when really, he's responsible for his own actions.

Thanks for the advice everyone, he does pay rent and he does work, he has a great job in fact. He was helping with household chores until he started working, DH and I clean every Sunday unless we have preplanned something else like being out of town but he doesn't contribute to the chores anymore despite my efforts to remind him he's a part of our home now and everyone has chores to do. I feel like he was stunted at teenage years. Our mother passed away when he was 12 and I was in college. I have always taken care of him so to speak, back to school clothes, extracurricular activities, he stayed with me every summer and DH and I have always lived places with extra room "just in case" he wanted to live with us. I blame this entirely on my father. My mother kept a beautiful home. Father did nothing, except sit on his butt all day in and out of jobs and I swear couldn't operate even a vacuum if you held a gun to his head. I don't want to kick brother out, I feel like he's not ready to live with anyone else, he has to be retaught everything. Maybe he has ADHD, DH does and they are very close. That could explain why DH gives him a pass, he is always saying he reminds him of himself.

Sounds like you need to explicitly teach him how things are done properly.

Well, he sounds like my teenage ADHD son. What I do for my son is that I make signs and tape them places. If the dryer were an issue in my house, I would tape a note to the door that says "1 load only". I would also be very specific when I am teaching a skill, like you only put 6 pairs of jeans in a load of laundry. Only x number of shirts . . .

Are you charging him rent? Is he helping with basic chores? Does he work?

He needs to be doing all three.

But honestly, it's probably better if he moves out. I'd try one Come to Jesus talk with him. Sit him down when you are NOT annoyed and lay out a few random things he's done in the last week. Ask him why he thinks it's your responsibility to wipe up the OJ off the floor when he spills it. See what he says. He most likely doesn't even notice he did it, but he needs to be taught how to live with others.

Does he have or want a girlfriend? Explain no woman wants to put up with this shit, so if he wants to have sex he needs to learn how to not live like a slob.

It's time for him to leave. Really. It's been a whole year.

DH and I have let my little (24 y/o) brother live with us, its been a year, its mostly a great arrangement. He lived with my father previously and my father is quite the mess and didn't teach brother anything about cleaning, laundry, cooking,etc.

All the things I fight with brother about are mostly common sense, and I am constantly repeating myself. Don't overload the washer and dryer. Put the lids on things you open. Put your dinner dish in the dishwasher. Don't eat food in your bedroom. Wipe the bathroom counters down when you splash water everywhere. It goes on and on.

I am not overly anal about housecleaning either. It's just I'm sick of my dryer breaking every 3 weeks, I'm sick of puddles of water all over my bathroom and kitchen and I'm sick of nagging him over and over again.

He is absolutely miserable and spends most of his time hiding in his room. We just had it out again because the dryer was making a god awful noise and I opened it and it had a good 2-3 loads shoved inside. obviously my tactics are not working, or I wouldn't sound like a broken record everyday. I don't want him to not live here. DH is annoyed with his behaviors too but is staying out of it for now.

He grew up with my father who never cleaned or did laundry and I am not joking let dishes sit in the sink for months and just bought plastic plates to use. This is completely my fathers fault. My brother was never taught how to properly maintain a home. And had no one telling him its not okay to leave ketchup out on the table for days at a time. Or to pick up wet towels. Or if you spill oj on the floor, wipe it the f up.

Help! I hate myself when I'm telling at him, he is starting to hate me. What are some tricks you guys have to get your kids and/or DH to absorb what your saying? Or is this hopeless?