Anonymous wrote:I'm a bright woman with academic credentials who sabotaged my career to take care of my kids. Why does that make you bang your head against the wall?

Your academic credentials apparently don't extend to reading comprehension. Note that my post said women who "preemptively sabotaging their careers even before there's a zygote in the air" makes me want to bang my head against the wall.

I leaned out (turned down a promotion within my company that would have been high travel) right when my DH and I were starting to TTC. We ended up not being able to conceive and deciding we were okay with being child-free.

I don't regret leaning out. I learned a LOT about my priorities and preferences during that time. I'm glad I didn't take the promotion, my life is better because I'm not in a ridiculously demanding job.

BUT - I was in a place in my career where I was very in demand and leaning out didn't hurt me. I've retained my flexibility and pay level.

I am not sure what I'm trying to say about leaning out, other than to be a bit of a balancing voice to say... I did it and don't regret it, even though I didn't end up with kids. It helped me think more about what I wanted my life to look like. Whether I have kids or not, I realized that my ideal life is NOT an 80-hour a week, platinum-diamond-frequent-flyer job.

I'm a bright woman with academic credentials who sabotaged my career to take care of my kids. Why does that make you bang your head against the wall?

Stupid. Get as much experience and seniority as you can stuff under your belt before having kids. Then, see what your circumstances demand and what your family needs/preferences/style supports. I'm not actually a Lean In fan, but when I think of bright women who are preemptively sabotaging their careers even before there's a zygote in the air, I want to bang my head against a wall (and retroactively revoke their acceptances to all those fine graduate programs their parents paid for.)

Anonymous wrote:Another vote for stupid...err shortsighted. It has taken me three years to get pregnant with second. Granted I have extreme fertility issues (not at an old age). But throughout this time, having work has helped me having something else to focus on. NEVER make career choices about perceived events in the future, especially something like getting pregnant. You will never know what the moment will bring or what you will need in the moment. And you can make it work in the moment.

But I would add, if you want to lean out now for reasons in today...like wanting more personal time...go for it.

Another vote for stupid...err shortsighted. It has taken me three years to get pregnant with second. Granted I have extreme fertility issues (not at an old age). But throughout this time, having work has helped me having something else to focus on. NEVER make career choices about perceived events in the future, especially something like getting pregnant. You will never know what the moment will bring or what you will need in the moment. And you can make it work in the moment.

Anonymous wrote:Stupid. I leaned out for what I thought was a flexible job. 7 years later, I'm still trying to get pregnant, and I'm self-imposed "Mommy tracked".

Isn't this all about perspective though? It is only stupid if you value the ladder more than the flexibility, whether you have kids or not. I agree that you might not like it and that you feel it was a mistake, no one can tell you how to live. But to say it is universally stupid? I'm not so sure.

I know plenty of people who valued work/life balance long before kids and marriage. I have a good friend who is still single and no kids at 45 but she has always put an emphasis on work/life balance and she's both professionally successful and happy in her personal life. I've looked to her as a role model even though I am 34 and actually do have kids, but I still learn a lot about balance from her. Could she be even higher professionally? Probably. But some value that balance to be able to take time off, not work until super late, etc. more.

I got a more flexible/mommy track type job 3.5 years ago, so I had been there 3 years when I went on maternity leave with my first. I don't regret it at all, but I also didn't pick it specifically for having kids. I picked it because I don't particularly like working and I wanted a straight 9-5 that left me with plenty of free time and little stress. If you want to get to the top levels of management, it's not a good idea to mommy track yourself. However, if you aren't very ambitious and just want to get paid and go home (like me!), go for it! You will appreciate having put in your time by the time you have babies because your coworkers will know you and be more forgiving!

I haven't read the book so I don't know how it would apply here. But I can tell you that the moms I know with elementary age kids who are best able to juggle things with flexible schedules are teachers, nurses, physical therapists, and dental hygienists. The moms who are most UNable to juggle things with flexible schedules are lawyers, junior faculty, and executives. It seems to me that planning ahead for a flexible job can work, and it often involves less prestigious jobs.

Besides kids there are other things to think about...

taking care of aging parents, being happy, living a long, healthy life.

I am sure there are others.

Planning is not a bad thing, it is actually prudent.

it all depends on how you look for the job, and what sacrifices you are making.

I'm "leaning out" of a stressful job into a government job that won't call me at 3am weeks on end. My current job is contributing to bad sleep, high blood pressure, and general stress, which likely contributed to my miscarriage earlier this year. I'm trading an ok salary and some stock options for regular hours, a nice boss, a fantastic commute, interesting but not stressful work, a 13% raise, and no stock options. Even if I can't successfully get and stay pregnant, the benefits of increase in the quality of my life are more than worth it.

Don't lean out if you're making *sacrifices* in anticipation of something that might not happen. Totally give yourself permission to look for/take advantage of opportunities that increase your general quality of life and happiness. I can't imagine that being ragingly unhappy for half of your waking life helps fertility.

One more vote for stupid. You have no idea how long it will take you to get pregnant, OP. Delay the mommy-track for as long as you can (or find a way to avoid it entirely). Make as much headway as you can with your career NOW. You can always look for a more flexible job later on once you're pregnant or even after you have a child.

have you read the book? I would. the media reports on it don't do it justice. Your situation is exactly what she is talking about. It's one thing to consider benefits when picking a job, but another thing to get on the mommy track before you have your kids.

Stupid. I leaned out for what I thought was a flexible job. 7 years later, I'm still trying to get pregnant, and I'm self-imposed "Mommy tracked".

Hi all,
It seems like the sad death of Sheryl Sandburg's husband has reignited the debate on lean in. One thing that Sheryl says is to not start to lean out when thinking about kids. I.e. looking for a flexible job in anticipation of kids. I have to admit that I am thinking of kids in 2 years and I'm looking for jobs that will allow for a mommy track. What do you guys think about that? Is this wise or stupid?