I think I've posted here before about the same thing.

A very close friend of mine had his parents separate and and divorce shortly after the youngest of the siblings left for university.

By all accounts, this was a very loving and normal household. All the kids went to private elementary school, well paced public high schools, and on to successful post secondary education.

I was a frequent visitor in the house and always wished this "perfect" family was mine.

Well,then he'll broke loose when the divorce happened. All three children were left wondering if their entire happy childhoods were a lie. They felt they had to take one parents side, or another. All three ended up having problems developing normal, trusting adult relationships because their whole perception was shattered, but shattered AS ADULTS.

In essence, they were left wondering that if that happy childhood was actually misery, could eh ever trust their own instincts on happiness?

Conversely, one of my friends divorced her husband when their child was just a young whipper. They co-parent beautifully. Their relationship is kind, warm, and cooperative. They have both gone n to other relationships, and new spouses are welcome within the bugger circle and idea of family. Their son sees that somethimes things don't work out, but that his parents LOVEim to the end of the earth. And he's gone on to a healthy, normal adult relationship.


So no, I don't think it's the best to stay together for the children. T

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is one person's perspective. There's a wealth of research on this topic for anyone actually considering such a decision.

And the research overwhelmingly supports the bottom line of this person's perspective. Miserable people are just that - miserable, and they're modeling that somehow the "bond of marriage" or the importance of one household for their kids is somehow more important than standing up to awful behavior, getting mental health services or leaving, stopping the cheating or deciding you will not tolerate cheating, or just plain demanding to be treated with respect and without hostility. These are some of the common tensions miserable parents are dealing with (with one or both parents contributing to the underlying problems), and the research supports overwhelmingly that modeling respectful communication & humane treatment or, if that is not possible, modeling using your ability to control what you can and getting the hell out are much much healthier role models for children and much better for their wellbeing.

If you disagree, please link to research studies from a reliable source (i.e. not some shady organization well-known to be pushing an anti-divorce agenda). There are shady pro-divorce studies too, but a huge number of studies from legitimate science sources that are also pro-separation when the relationship has become toxic (in terms of the impacts on kids).

Sorry. I'm not going to argue with you about the value of decades of academic research vs. a column in the Huffington Post.

This is very dependent on the individual circumstance. Research cannot cover this properly.

Anonymous wrote:This is one area of life that defies most generalizations. Shitty parents are shitty parents whether divorced or together. Kids will be adversely affected by a bad environment whether the parents are married or divorced.

Most people would agree that a healthy two parent household is the best environment for kids. But that isn't always the case and sometimes divorce has to be considered or is the only option.

Parents that can manage a civil divorce and work together to create a parenting plan that keeps the needs of the kids first and foremost will have a better chance at raising healthy kids. The adverse effects of a divorce will be minimized for these kids.

The impact of divorce on children is dependent on so many factors, it is impossible to say whether staying married or divorcing is the right answer for everyone. In reality, we are discussing not just divorce, but the overall impact of bad parenting. Bad parents can be married and living together, living apart or divorced.

I'm OP, and while I completely agree with you that bad parenting is bad parenting, I am very very specifically sending this post out to the people struggling with whether to leave a clearly toxic relationship and who feel obligated to stay because they think it will traumatize their kids to separate more than to go. A lot of the time, even though this is the reason put out, the real reason is more the fear of the unknown on the parent's part, worry that they won't be able to make it, basically understandable concerns. But since the conversation is often about "staying together for the kids", and it comes up in some gnarly nasty relationships that it's hard to understand how the person is considering staying, it is important to point out that it's better to figure out what is going to find you the most happiness, stability, and wellbeing. Modeling sanity and health and leaving toxicity and pursuing stability are also undeniably healthy, whether that leads to staying together or divorce. It's a complex balance of course, but the main point is that it's a fallacy that staying in a toxic relationship is better for kids. That is always a fallacy.

How parents handle the separation of course matters too, and that leads more to your point: the parents who would manage it by trying to turn the kids against each other or threats or violence or whatever, are still clearly traumatizing their kids. But the parents who are acrimonious together and healthier apart... that split is the right thing.

Anonymous wrote:This is one person's perspective. There's a wealth of research on this topic for anyone actually considering such a decision.

And the research overwhelmingly supports the bottom line of this person's perspective. Miserable people are just that - miserable, and they're modeling that somehow the "bond of marriage" or the importance of one household for their kids is somehow more important than standing up to awful behavior, getting mental health services or leaving, stopping the cheating or deciding you will not tolerate cheating, or just plain demanding to be treated with respect and without hostility. These are some of the common tensions miserable parents are dealing with (with one or both parents contributing to the underlying problems), and the research supports overwhelmingly that modeling respectful communication & humane treatment or, if that is not possible, modeling using your ability to control what you can and getting the hell out are much much healthier role models for children and much better for their wellbeing.

If you disagree, please link to research studies from a reliable source (i.e. not some shady organization well-known to be pushing an anti-divorce agenda). There are shady pro-divorce studies too, but a huge number of studies from legitimate science sources that are also pro-separation when the relationship has become toxic (in terms of the impacts on kids).

Anonymous wrote:This is one area of life that defies most generalizations. Shitty parents are shitty parents whether divorced or together. Kids will be adversely affected by a bad environment whether the parents are married or divorced.

Most people would agree that a healthy two parent household is the best environment for kids. But that isn't always the case and sometimes divorce has to be considered or is the only option.

Parents that can manage a civil divorce and work together to create a parenting plan that keeps the needs of the kids first and foremost will have a better chance at raising healthy kids. The adverse effects of a divorce will be minimized for these kids.

The impact of divorce on children is dependent on so many factors, it is impossible to say whether staying married or divorcing is the right answer for everyone. In reality, we are discussing not just divorce, but the overall impact of bad parenting. Bad parents can be married and living together, living apart or divorced.

So much truth here.

Great post!!!

This is one area of life that defies most generalizations. Shitty parents are shitty parents whether divorced or together. Kids will be adversely affected by a bad environment whether the parents are married or divorced.

Most people would agree that a healthy two parent household is the best environment for kids. But that isn't always the case and sometimes divorce has to be considered or is the only option.

Parents that can manage a civil divorce and work together to create a parenting plan that keeps the needs of the kids first and foremost will have a better chance at raising healthy kids. The adverse effects of a divorce will be minimized for these kids.

The impact of divorce on children is dependent on so many factors, it is impossible to say whether staying married or divorcing is the right answer for everyone. In reality, we are discussing not just divorce, but the overall impact of bad parenting. Bad parents can be married and living together, living apart or divorced.

I just wish people wouldn't pretend divorce = happiness. My parents were miserable married, and now they are miserable divorced. It would have been a lot less hassle to stay married.

This is one person's perspective. There's a wealth of research on this topic for anyone actually considering such a decision.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Cue all the posters who claim that kids growing up in a hostile environment with unhappy parents modeling unhealthy relationship patterns is better for the kids...because they're together.

I don't "think" anyone's really saying that. But if a couple just doesn't feel the spark and wonder if there's something better out there, while everything is still kind and considerate at home, then I do think it's better for the kids if the parents muddle through that and stay together..

I have read many times from poster's here who claim that even miserable parents together are better than happy parents apart, because when you split, there is too much financial strain with supporting 2 households, and shuffling the kids back and forth is too much for kids to handle, as is having to share holidays.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Cue all the posters who claim that kids growing up in a hostile environment with unhappy parents modeling unhealthy relationship patterns is better for the kids...because they're together.

I don't "think" anyone's really saying that. But if a couple just doesn't feel the spark and wonder if there's something better out there, while everything is still kind and considerate at home, then I do think it's better for the kids if the parents muddle through that and stay together..

Yeah, I think most people believe the adults in a family should be adults about it. And that means to not be hostile, not just pretend not to be hostile.

Anonymous wrote:Cue all the posters who claim that kids growing up in a hostile environment with unhappy parents modeling unhealthy relationship patterns is better for the kids...because they're together.

I don't "think" anyone's really saying that. But if a couple just doesn't feel the spark and wonder if there's something better out there, while everything is still kind and considerate at home, then I do think it's better for the kids if the parents muddle through that and stay together..

Cue all the posters who claim that kids growing up in a hostile environment with unhappy parents modeling unhealthy relationship patterns is better for the kids...because they're together.

zzzzzzzzzzzzz

Good article

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/yourtango/5-reasons-i-wish-my-paren_b_6502948.html?ncid=fcbklnkushpmg00000063