Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous[b wrote:]I think I'd say something like "holding Baby can't be good for your arthritis, especially since Baby is growing so much recently[/b]!" Then find a way to seat baby so grandma can interact easily (a high chair?) and make that the default. You didn't say how young the baby is, but I'm guessing only a few months? Soon, Baby can "prefer to lie on a mat" or "want to be free to sit on the floor."

I'll also point out that kids don't need to be babysat by their grandparents to feel close to them. Heck, they don't even need physical contact! You are not damaging their relationship if you set reasonable boundaries based on your MIL's physical limits. (Of course, you don't have to say why she's not babysitting unless you want to. You can just choose not to have her babysit.)

NO, I would not start off like that. MIL would deny and dismiss it. Take the lead of 21:48 and be as direct and calm as possible. This has to be about a decision that you and DH have made. It's not a conversation or a debate. You are simply stating information about what will and what will not happen regarding the handling of the baby.

I agree. An indirect, or a passive-aggressive approach will not work here.

Yeah - OP here, thanks everyone. I think the suggestions about deflection are good, some people would take that kind of hint - but we've tried it for several months now. She always snaps back and pushes back so I end up having to say firmly, "no, we're not doing that [having MIL hold her while try to spoon feed her sweet potatoes backwards - something DH and I wouldn't try either just because it would be ridiculous and messy]." And then she gets all eye-roll-y and says in this really sarcastic and side tone "OH, well I guess mommy has spoken then!" It drives me absolutely insane. I can't do this anymore.

Last night DH actually talked to his brother and SIL about this - they have a young baby but live farther away, and their baby is a bit older and heavier so MIL has kind of (either consciously or subconsciously) accepted she can't take care of that one (without them having to say anything) and has fixated on our smaller baby. DH is going to be the one to speak directly with her about it. If it doesn't work and she still is acting the same next time, I will definitely try to channel the calm but direct "this is what is going to happen with our baby" style.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous[b wrote:]I think I'd say something like "holding Baby can't be good for your arthritis, especially since Baby is growing so much recently[/b]!" Then find a way to seat baby so grandma can interact easily (a high chair?) and make that the default. You didn't say how young the baby is, but I'm guessing only a few months? Soon, Baby can "prefer to lie on a mat" or "want to be free to sit on the floor."

I'll also point out that kids don't need to be babysat by their grandparents to feel close to them. Heck, they don't even need physical contact! You are not damaging their relationship if you set reasonable boundaries based on your MIL's physical limits. (Of course, you don't have to say why she's not babysitting unless you want to. You can just choose not to have her babysit.)

NO, I would not start off like that. MIL would deny and dismiss it. Take the lead of 21:48 and be as direct and calm as possible. This has to be about a decision that you and DH have made. It's not a conversation or a debate. You are simply stating information about what will and what will not happen regarding the handling of the baby.

I agree. An indirect, or a passive-aggressive approach will not work here.

Anonymous[b wrote:]I think I'd say something like "holding Baby can't be good for your arthritis, especially since Baby is growing so much recently[/b]!" Then find a way to seat baby so grandma can interact easily (a high chair?) and make that the default. You didn't say how young the baby is, but I'm guessing only a few months? Soon, Baby can "prefer to lie on a mat" or "want to be free to sit on the floor."

I'll also point out that kids don't need to be babysat by their grandparents to feel close to them. Heck, they don't even need physical contact! You are not damaging their relationship if you set reasonable boundaries based on your MIL's physical limits. (Of course, you don't have to say why she's not babysitting unless you want to. You can just choose not to have her babysit.)

NO, I would not start off like that. MIL would deny and dismiss it. Take the lead of 21:48 and be as direct and calm as possible. This has to be about a decision that you and DH have made. It's not a conversation or a debate. You are simply stating information about what will and what will not happen regarding the handling of the baby.

Can you "sandwich" the conversation in some way? What is she good at still? Lullabyes? Advice of any kind whatsoever? Dig for anything she is good at and then sandwich it with the negative.

Mildred, we love the way you sing to Larla. I'm really hoping you do more of that. I'm going to put a soft chair next to her crib just for Grandma's special songs. Now, for right now, I don't think it's such a good idea for your to be alone with Larla. She's just too needy and too small. The pediatrician says no. But I want your advice on how to bathe her.

21:48 posting again. She tried to interrupt me and cut me off, but I just stood my ground and pressed on. I thought my speech was long enough without her few interjections so I did leave them out of my post. I gave her a couple of opportunities to settle down and when she didn't I told her she could listen to what I had to tell her or not, but if she wasn't willing to follow the rules set out by her grandchild's parents, she would not be seeing her grandchild with any regularity. Since I was calm and focused and direct rather than being emotionally overwrought, she paid attention and understood that I was dead serious. Obviously, ymmv, but I prefer being direct rather than allowing her to interpret suggestion or hints.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I said something like, "Mary Ellen, I know you would like to have us leave the baby with you for the day or overnight. That is not going to happen. You have had x episodes where you have collapsed in public and have ended up in the hospital with serious injury. You may have collapsed at home as well and not told us about it. Right now there is no medical explanation for these episodes so there is no treatment protocol that you can follow to eliminate, minimize, or predict these episodes. We cannot allow you to be responsible for our infant when she may not be safe with you. If you collapsed while holding her and hurt her or if you collapsed and left her unattended for a lengthy period of time, I know you would never forgive yourself. I would have a hard time forgiving you too. So you can respect this decision and we will make every effort to see you regularly. If you can't respect this decision and continue to complain about us to other family members and make passive-aggressive and openly hostile comments directly to us, we will not make time in our schedule for you to see her beyond major holidays."

It took some hardball, but she got it.

Assuming this is true, you're my new hero. Well done.

Unless your MIL is also deaf, I can not imaging you having time to complete this spiel.
My MIL would interrupt after "Mary Ellen" and proceed with a rebuttal of sorts.

Yeah... actually, the couple of times I have actually stood up to her she has backed off. It's just pretty rare that I'm willing to do this because we all kind of feel sorry for her and don't want to hurt her feelings.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I said something like, "Mary Ellen, I know you would like to have us leave the baby with you for the day or overnight. That is not going to happen. You have had x episodes where you have collapsed in public and have ended up in the hospital with serious injury. You may have collapsed at home as well and not told us about it. Right now there is no medical explanation for these episodes so there is no treatment protocol that you can follow to eliminate, minimize, or predict these episodes. We cannot allow you to be responsible for our infant when she may not be safe with you. If you collapsed while holding her and hurt her or if you collapsed and left her unattended for a lengthy period of time, I know you would never forgive yourself. I would have a hard time forgiving you too. So you can respect this decision and we will make every effort to see you regularly. If you can't respect this decision and continue to complain about us to other family members and make passive-aggressive and openly hostile comments directly to us, we will not make time in our schedule for you to see her beyond major holidays."

It took some hardball, but she got it.

Assuming this is true, you're my new hero. Well done.

Unless your MIL is also deaf, I can not imaging you having time to complete this spiel.
My MIL would interrupt after "Mary Ellen" and proceed with a rebuttal of sorts.

Anonymous wrote:This is 21:48. My MIL brought up her plans to babysit and have overnights with our newborn regularly through the first weeks at home. My mother said something to her initially like, "the baby is breastfeeding so she can't spend the night away from home." A normal person would have responded acknowledging this and maybe saying when she is older I can't wait to have her for a sleepover. My MIL responded by saying something like, "there are ways around that," and that just set me off and made me mad. I did not say anything at that time because I did not want to sound angry. I am a lawyer and I give people the worst news of their lives for a living so I knew I needed to be very dispassionate in my delivery. I thought about what I wanted to say and the next time we were together, when the subject came up, I just told her off in a very matter-of-fact manner. I did not display any anger. My attitude was simply, this is the way it is and you can take it or leave it. I also took her by surprise which helped so she did not have much ability to formulate a practiced comeback.

Wow, that is truly crazy. I guess I should feel lucky that MIL is not demanding overnights. I am a lawyer too... there are sensitive family dynamics at play though, and I think I have to let DH do this. If he botches it though, I will keep your speech in my back pocket.

This is 21:48. My MIL brought up her plans to babysit and have overnights with our newborn regularly through the first weeks at home. My mother said something to her initially like, "the baby is breastfeeding so she can't spend the night away from home." A normal person would have responded acknowledging this and maybe saying when she is older I can't wait to have her for a sleepover. My MIL responded by saying something like, "there are ways around that," and that just set me off and made me mad. I did not say anything at that time because I did not want to sound angry. I am a lawyer and I give people the worst news of their lives for a living so I knew I needed to be very dispassionate in my delivery. I thought about what I wanted to say and the next time we were together, when the subject came up, I just told her off in a very matter-of-fact manner. I did not display any anger. My attitude was simply, this is the way it is and you can take it or leave it. I also took her by surprise which helped so she did not have much ability to formulate a practiced comeback.

Anonymous wrote:I think I'd say something like "holding Baby can't be good for your arthritis, especially since Baby is growing so much recently!" Then find a way to seat baby so grandma can interact easily (a high chair?) and make that the default. You didn't say how young the baby is, but I'm guessing only a few months? Soon, Baby can "prefer to lie on a mat" or "want to be free to sit on the floor."

I'll also point out that kids don't need to be babysat by their grandparents to feel close to them. Heck, they don't even need physical contact! You are not damaging their relationship if you set reasonable boundaries based on your MIL's physical limits. (Of course, you don't have to say why she's not babysitting unless you want to. You can just choose not to have her babysit.)

If I made a comment about her arthritis I can only imagine the quickness with which she would snap at me that her arthritis is fine. She also makes these comments talking about how light DD is, her intended implication being "I have no problem holding her" even though it's really obvious that she does.

Thank you for reminding me about not needing to be babysat! Especially when this young, right? I can see wanting some alone time when DD is like, 5 or 6... but she isn't going to remember any of this. We have staved off her requests to babysit for a long time, and at some point we will either need to be straight with her or do what DH's brother does, which is have her "co babysit" with the other grandma.

I think I'd say something like "holding Baby can't be good for your arthritis, especially since Baby is growing so much recently!" Then find a way to seat baby so grandma can interact easily (a high chair?) and make that the default. You didn't say how young the baby is, but I'm guessing only a few months? Soon, Baby can "prefer to lie on a mat" or "want to be free to sit on the floor."

I'll also point out that kids don't need to be babysat by their grandparents to feel close to them. Heck, they don't even need physical contact! You are not damaging their relationship if you set reasonable boundaries based on your MIL's physical limits. (Of course, you don't have to say why she's not babysitting unless you want to. You can just choose not to have her babysit.)

Anonymous wrote:Yup. I simply told my MIL straight out that I was the boss and she could accept my terms and have all the access I could provide or buck my rules and have only limited supervised visitation. Call me mean, but my MIL has collapsed in public parking lots on multiple occasions with no explanation causing herself serious injury. No effing way I was going to permit her to wander around holding my defenseless infant waiting for her next episode.

I said something like, "Mary Ellen, I know you would like to have us leave the baby with you for the day or overnight. That is not going to happen. You have had x episodes where you have collapsed in public and have ended up in the hospital with serious injury. You may have collapsed at home as well and not told us about it. Right now there is no medical explanation for these episodes so there is no treatment protocol that you can follow to eliminate, minimize, or predict these episodes. We cannot allow you to be responsible for our infant when she may not be safe with you. If you collapsed while holding her and hurt her or if you collapsed and left her unattended for a lengthy period of time, I know you would never forgive yourself. I would have a hard time forgiving you too. So you can respect this decision and we will make every effort to see you regularly. If you can't respect this decision and continue to complain about us to other family members and make passive-aggressive and openly hostile comments directly to us, we will not make time in our schedule for you to see her beyond major holidays."

It took some hardball, but she got it.

OP here... I think some directness is in order here as well, and I am totally cribbing from you. How did you initiate this conversation?

Anonymous wrote:
I said something like, "Mary Ellen, I know you would like to have us leave the baby with you for the day or overnight. That is not going to happen. You have had x episodes where you have collapsed in public and have ended up in the hospital with serious injury. You may have collapsed at home as well and not told us about it. Right now there is no medical explanation for these episodes so there is no treatment protocol that you can follow to eliminate, minimize, or predict these episodes. We cannot allow you to be responsible for our infant when she may not be safe with you. If you collapsed while holding her and hurt her or if you collapsed and left her unattended for a lengthy period of time, I know you would never forgive yourself. I would have a hard time forgiving you too. So you can respect this decision and we will make every effort to see you regularly. If you can't respect this decision and continue to complain about us to other family members and make passive-aggressive and openly hostile comments directly to us, we will not make time in our schedule for you to see her beyond major holidays."

It took some hardball, but she got it.

Assuming this is true, you're my new hero. Well done.

Yup. I simply told my MIL straight out that I was the boss and she could accept my terms and have all the access I could provide or buck my rules and have only limited supervised visitation. Call me mean, but my MIL has collapsed in public parking lots on multiple occasions with no explanation causing herself serious injury. No effing way I was going to permit her to wander around holding my defenseless infant waiting for her next episode.

I said something like, "Mary Ellen, I know you would like to have us leave the baby with you for the day or overnight. That is not going to happen. You have had x episodes where you have collapsed in public and have ended up in the hospital with serious injury. You may have collapsed at home as well and not told us about it. Right now there is no medical explanation for these episodes so there is no treatment protocol that you can follow to eliminate, minimize, or predict these episodes. We cannot allow you to be responsible for our infant when she may not be safe with you. If you collapsed while holding her and hurt her or if you collapsed and left her unattended for a lengthy period of time, I know you would never forgive yourself. I would have a hard time forgiving you too. So you can respect this decision and we will make every effort to see you regularly. If you can't respect this decision and continue to complain about us to other family members and make passive-aggressive and openly hostile comments directly to us, we will not make time in our schedule for you to see her beyond major holidays."

It took some hardball, but she got it.

I am having some anxiety about how MIL is around the baby. She is almost 70 years old and in poor health - bad arthritis, walks very slowly, cannot stand up from a sitting position without pulling up on something. When she holds the baby she basically balances her in between her arms while holding her own wrists and not really grasping the actual baby. Baby slips down and/or lops over, and MIL has to basically toss the baby to readjust. I know I'm not describing this well but trust me, it is harrowing to watch and I have shown pictures of this to many people to make sure I'm not being an overreactive new mom. DH agrees with me as well, and neither of us is comfortable leaving the baby with MIL unsupervised.

The problem is that MIL is in complete denial about her physical limitations. She is ALWAYS trying to contrive situations where she is alone with the baby, offers to babysit even in situations where it would be strange (e.g., we come in for only a day trip, and presumably we would want to spend it all together as a family), tries to shoo everybody out of the room. She is also crazy defensive about everything. Like if we hand her the baby and say "you got her?" (which is something DH and I would say to each other when passing each other the baby), she will snap at us and say "of course I have her!" or if we are reluctant about leaving the room in one of the aforementioned shooing situations she will be like, "I'm not going to hurt the baby!" And if we ever try to take the baby back for any reason she will bark at us and insist that she can handle it - e.g. when we wanted to put her in a bumbo while we all ate lunch instead of letting MIL eat a giant sandwich while awkwardly balancing the baby in the other hand. On the other hand, the second the baby cries, she shoves her at the closest person. Has no interest in trying to comfort the baby.

We really want the baby to have a close relationship with her but the way she's behaving I am just really anxious around her. And we thought maybe once she gets older and doesn't need to be carried everywhere MIL can babysit... but I feel like she repeatedly exhibits poor judgment and hasn't indicated she can take care of the baby... so as it stands right now, I am not real keen on ever leaving her alone with my kid. Which makes me sad.

Anyone deal with this situation?