I picked an asshole as a teenager and turned him into a respectful guy who I then married. Had I not been able to change him I wouldn't have married him.

Being smart is sexy. I have a college-age daughter and while yes, hot jocks turn her head, she actually talks with and forms relationships with smart, kind guys.

I have always gone for a great sense of humor. Usually also intellectual & witty.

Anonymous wrote:Sure, women would love a guy whose athletic and fit, just as men want women who are built like Barbies. If you can get the whole package, who wouldn't go after it.

But push comes to shove, different women look for different things in long term relationships. Some women put more importance on physical characteristics, and others don't. What's the ratio? I have no idea. But most of my friends look for stability and matching personalities in their long-term relationships. If the guy is not the best looking, that's fine, but there does need to be some physical attraction.

There are some women I know who only go for the alpha male jerks, and those women usually suffer the consequence of it. Some women are willing to put up with that sh!t. Others aren't, me included.

Breeding stock vs long-term partner

Sure, women would love a guy whose athletic and fit, just as men want women who are built like Barbies. If you can get the whole package, who wouldn't go after it.

But push comes to shove, different women look for different things in long term relationships. Some women put more importance on physical characteristics, and others don't. What's the ratio? I have no idea. But most of my friends look for stability and matching personalities in their long-term relationships. If the guy is not the best looking, that's fine, but there does need to be some physical attraction.

There are some women I know who only go for the alpha male jerks, and those women usually suffer the consequence of it. Some women are willing to put up with that sh!t. Others aren't, me included.

It's all about evolutionary psychology. Women are attracted to jocks and bad boys because they appear manly and confident. Take the girl who slept with half the Duke lacrosse and baseball teams. She was not looking for guys in the chem lab.

But ultimately it becomes revenge of the nerds. While Rico the hot guy peaks at 21, the nerd is going to the gym, working on his wardrobe, and building his career. Then the women who would not give him the time of day in high school are very interested and he lives happily ever after with all his fantasies fulfilled.

Sincerely,

an ex-HS semi nerd now happily married.

Depends on what you want to do with them.

I never dated a jock or an asshole. I dated funny, kind boys or men who were nice to me. Married one too!

Chess nerds are more successful later in life.

A-hole Jocks have always made me wary, even when I was young and impressionable. My whole life I've stayed away from them. But then, I've always been a bit of a nerd myself. Not being drawn to the jock type doesn't mean that, on occasion, I haven't flirted with one, especially before the full extent of their "bro-ness" is revealed. But a bit of flirting doesn't mean I'm interested in anything more.

Respectful "chess nerds" can be sexy. I had a LTR with one when I was younger and have platonic crushes on a couple of them at work (I work in a nerd-heavy environment). And the man I married, though fit and athletic, is far from a jock or an alpha.

Although I'm really into sports, I prefer the nerdy guys. Intelligence is way sexier. Plus, I had a few guys treat me like sh!t in college and it's just not worth it.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I married a respectful chess "nerd" who also takes care of his body. Sexy doesn't equate to a$$ho!e!

Of course, if you go by this forum, many posters think that being an a$$h8!e means alpha male. Those posters can keep those guys. My DH helps the kids with HW, so he wins in my book.

What kinds of guys did you date and/or seek out before marriage was a consideration? Guys like your husband?

Pretty much: artsy, introverted, romantic, almost Byronic Hero type, the kind of guy who'd be happy on the June DuPont Circle Museum Walk: http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/articles/37201/26th-annual-museum-walk-weekend

PP here: note that my kind of guy also has an artist's bank account, so both parties have to contribute.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I married a respectful chess "nerd" who also takes care of his body. Sexy doesn't equate to a$$ho!e!

Of course, if you go by this forum, many posters think that being an a$$h8!e means alpha male. Those posters can keep those guys. My DH helps the kids with HW, so he wins in my book.

What kinds of guys did you date and/or seek out before marriage was a consideration? Guys like your husband?

Pretty much: artsy, introverted, romantic, almost Byronic Hero type, the kind of guy who'd be happy on the June DuPont Circle Museum Walk: http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/articles/37201/26th-annual-museum-walk-weekend

Anonymous wrote:I married a respectful chess "nerd" who also takes care of his body. Sexy doesn't equate to a$$ho!e!

Of course, if you go by this forum, many posters think that being an a$$h8!e means alpha male. Those posters can keep those guys. My DH helps the kids with HW, so he wins in my book.

What kinds of guys did you date and/or seek out before marriage was a consideration? Guys like your husband?

I married a respectful chess "nerd" who also takes care of his body. Sexy doesn't equate to a$$ho!e!

Of course, if you go by this forum, many posters think that being an a$$h8!e means alpha male. Those posters can keep those guys. My DH helps the kids with HW, so he wins in my book.

Guys get mixed messages about what women want. And when I say what they want, I mean "what they want in a guy with whom they'd like to have sex."

For example, in high school and college, I was peppered with messages about treating women with respect and as equals. But my observation was that they'd primarily seek out, dote on, and flirt with the jocks, regardless of whether those guys treated them respectfully and as equals. Now, I know, ideally, a woman is probably going to want a confident, athletic guy who treats them with respect and as an equal. But, when push came to shove, the women I knew would pick the confident, athletic guy who did not treat them with respect over, say, the shy chess nerd who did treat them with respect and as equals.

It's been a long time since I was in high school or college, so my observations would be so much ancient history. I am happily married and not looking to attract anyone but my wife. However, I've seen the debates heating up lately with feminists on one side and Mens Rights Activists on the other side. Feminists are pro-equality and respect. MRAs are saying, "bullshit, women are attracted to assholes." It's of some importance because when guys like myself are taking sides in the culture wars and on decisions of politics and policy, we (or at least I) think that feminists have the better rational position. But, on an emotional level, think that women aren't really being fully honest about how they want to be treated by men. And so, the MRAs have some resonance when they suggest that, while women say they want to be treated as equals, what they really respond to is strength.

So, what's the deal with picking the bad boys and the asshole jocks over the nice guys? I'm convinced that the MRAs are primarily misogynists and assholes. I would like to also be convinced that they are wrong about what women truly desire and find sexually attractive.