Anonymous wrote:

My point is that the bad ones fulfill the worst assumptions that the public has of professors because they are SO bitter, and it is blindingly obvious. I am a fundraiser and I have to refute this stuff from alumni every day while I get treated as one of those evil "administrators.". It gets tiring having these people bitch about having no money when they are the most difficult and obnoxious people to work with. The difficult ones and the most difficult departments get no money because they alienate donors. I've had alumni parents bitch about some of these people to me, not that it matters. They are untouchable because of tenure. So what happens? The department loses money when that alumni parent pulls or withholds donations. I work with tons of great profs, but the ones who are bad are truly horrid.

And to the PP who pointed out that they make less than other professions with similar levels of education.....so what? It's not like that isn't a well known fact. If that's not the life you want, get a JD or an MBA instead of a PhD in English.

Aha ha ha. I get it now, you're in development for a university.

The rest is clear as mud, though. In some places it sounds like you're fundraising from the profs ("these people bitch about having no money"). But your real beef seems to be with "alumni parents" because you mention them twice .... So reading between the lines, it sounds like some prof gave an alum's kid a bad grade yet and the snowflake's alumni parents stopped the spigot. Yes, we all love it when daddy and mommy get mad at the prof instead of at their underachieving kid. Yet it sounds like you're siding with the alum parents of the underachieving snowflake because, apparently, the bad grade makes your fundraising job harder. Do I have this right?

OP, you sound like a dick.

I don't know how many professors you know, but even if it's 10 you could hardly know exactly what their employment/tenure/salary status is. I guarantee you most people that students refer to as "professor" ARE underpaid, constantly being asked to fulfill roles and attend things that aren't compensated and conflict with their other obligations, and don't deserve the odd one-dimensional assessment you gave in your rant.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Re: "A good number of you make much more than than the median salary"

I'm going to assume the OP is doing way more better in stats than most students.

I was typing fast...I meant median HHI in the country, I.e. $50k. Even the lowest paid professors start out there and salaries continue to rise as they make tenure and rise in the ranks.

NP. So spending years in school earning that PhD shouldn't count for anything, salarywise? You're saying that PhDs should make the same wages as Walmart clerks?

Help me understand your sense of outraged injustice. Now if you had ranted about how we pay elementary school teachers less than BAs in Finance, I'd be right with you.

Anonymous wrote:The public looks down on professors?

+1 I am a professor. I did not know that the "public" looked down on me. Most people are very interested in talking to me when they find out that I am a scholar.

Anonymous wrote:Re: "A good number of you make much more than than the median salary"

I'm going to assume the OP is doing way more better in stats than most students.

I was typing fast...I meant median HHI in the country, I.e. $50k. Even the lowest paid professors start out there and salaries continue to rise as they make tenure and rise in the ranks.

Anonymous wrote:Oh OP, you keep qualifying your statement as if you don't mean all professors and then you go on a rant as if every professor were responsible for the bad ones. This reminds me of the criticisms I see on DCUM of the black community as if every black person had to account for the shooting at the zoo on Easter Monday.

I'd give my left arm to be an underpaid professor again. I don't care if you think I'm selfish and want to make me responsible for the few profs who phone it in. You seem to want to hate us all despite your attempts to qualify your assertions.

But it is true that anyone who is interested in the profession should really think carefully about it. And talk to people newly in the field rather than people who have been out awhile. My advisor couldn't understand why I was applying to so many schools. He was sure I'd get 12 offers. Moron.

My point is that the bad ones fulfill the worst assumptions that the public has of professors because they are SO bitter, and it is blindingly obvious. I am a fundraiser and I have to refute this stuff from alumni every day while I get treated as one of those evil "administrators.". It gets tiring having these people bitch about having no money when they are the most difficult and obnoxious people to work with. The difficult ones and the most difficult departments get no money because they alienate donors. I've had alumni parents bitch about some of these people to me, not that it matters. They are untouchable because of tenure. So what happens? The department loses money when that alumni parent pulls or withholds donations. I work with tons of great profs, but the ones who are bad are truly horrid.

And to the PP who pointed out that they make less than other professions with similar levels of education.....so what? It's not like that isn't a well known fact. If that's not the life you want, get a JD or an MBA instead of a PhD in English.

Oh OP, you keep qualifying your statement as if you don't mean all professors and then you go on a rant as if every professor were responsible for the bad ones. This reminds me of the criticisms I see on DCUM of the black community as if every black person had to account for the shooting at the zoo on Easter Monday.

I'd give my left arm to be an underpaid professor again. I don't care if you think I'm selfish and want to make me responsible for the few profs who phone it in. You seem to want to hate us all despite your attempts to qualify your assertions.

But it is true that anyone who is interested in the profession should really think carefully about it. And talk to people newly in the field rather than people who have been out awhile. My advisor couldn't understand why I was applying to so many schools. He was sure I'd get 12 offers. Moron.

^17:56 here. My real complaint is not with professors, but with bloated administrator salaries, though.

I am against professors who bitch that they are underpaid when they make more (and often far more) than the median HHI income for the country, often don't teach in the summer, have job security and flexibility and make the overall profession look bad by treating students like shit and acting like entitled jerks. They are the reason why the public looks down on professors as a whole. There - is that easier to understand? Maybe you are one of my crappy colleagues?

I mean, I'm not a professor and I have no desire to be one (although I do have a PhD), but relative to any other profession that requires that much (or often less) education and competitiveness in terms of landing a job, they make far less. Professors make much less than lawyers, doctors, C-level executives, and often than PhDs in industry (especially in biotechnology and chemistry) or at think tanks (especially in economics), and in turn they are compensated far less in exchange for their extraordinary job security. Sure they make far more than the median wage, but 1.5% of the population has a PhD...how many median wage workers have 9+ years of higher education (often more if you count postdoctoral fellowships)? They also have to bust their ass to get tenure in the first place.

The job security and the flexibility can't be beat, but it's not exactly like most tenured profs don't work over the summer. The summer is usually filled with research, professional conferences, grant writing, and service for the university, even if they don't teach. Plus, even if they "don't treat undergrads well," a lot of hot shot research professors bring in huge amounts of money to the university in the form of overhead from their grants, which basically allows the university to sustain itself (google NIH RO1 indirect costs if you don't know what I'm talking about).

There are certainly some asshole professors, but in any job that is highly competitive you will find assholes. My father is a lawyer, and there are plenty of self-important assholes in his law firm. Just as there are self-important asshole doctors, CEOs, hollywood actors, politicians, etc. I don't think this is unique to professors.

The public looks down on professors?

Re: "A good number of you make much more than than the median salary"

I'm going to assume the OP is doing way more better in stats than most students.

What's up OP? Fail your final paper this semester?

Anonymous wrote:Well. You are obviously for, or against, something.

I am against professors who bitch that they are underpaid when they make more (and often far more) than the median HHI income for the country, often don't teach in the summer, have job security and flexibility and make the overall profession look bad by treating students like shit and acting like entitled jerks. They are the reason why the public looks down on professors as a whole. There - is that easier to understand? Maybe you are one of my crappy colleagues?

Well. You are obviously for, or against, something.

Because though the vast majority of you are good scholars and dedicated teachers, those among you who are bitter and hate their jobs allow the massive chips on their shoulders to show. And your students know. And they tell their parents. Even if you feel you are underpaid, you still make more than at least 50% of the country - http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/2012/tables/12s0696.pdf. A good number of you make much more than than the median salary - http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2014/04/07/faculty-salaries-are-22-report-sees-many-financial-issues-facing-professors#sthash.iPb5PcAa.dpbs. If you are tenured you cannot be removed from your position for all but the worst of offenses. You have job security beyond what anyone else could dream of. You have flexibility in your schedules that other people can only dream of, especially those working hourly jobs who can be fired at the drop of a hat with no recourse. This is the profession you chose, and I cannot for the life of me imagine why you thought it would be any different than it is. You are free to leave at any time and pursue another line of work. No one is forcing you continue being miserable.

You taint the entire profession with your bitterness and misery and your obvious disdain for teaching students. The vast majority of professors care about their students - but you don't get special credit for that since teaching is a part of the job. This isn't the 1950's anymore - public funding of higher ed is down, hiring of tenured faculty is down, costs are rising and public pressure is mounting to reverse that trend and prove value. Please, if you are thinking of becoming a professor, talk to a faculty member under the age of 45 to ask them what it is really like NOW - not in the "good old days." Ask yourself why you want the job. If you just want to research, get a research job. But don't take a job that requires teaching and research and then spend all of your time bitching about students and how you don't get enough money for your research. It just makes you look like a pompous, entitled asshole.