Anonymous wrote:pp have you been through this? I am asking in a non snarky way as I don't know how to accomplish this when my mom refuses. How did you do this with an unwilling parent? I am wondering APS also forces this when someone is in danger? I do believe my mom is in danger to herself but I am trying to figure out how this forced without being violent..I am imagining someone in the white coat at her house. Geez getting old really sucks. I would hate to be in the situation. Makes me remind myself to have a plan when I am older to go to a place that has steps ie living indepdendantly, assisted and then full nursing.

Yes, we are going through this now and it is a nightmare. We ended up moving my MIL in our home and its been horrible to say the least but it was our only option. She was in a bad situation and while we called APS and other folks none could do anything as she was not in danger. Danger is a relative term and your standard vs. their standard are two different things. We did not give my MIL a choice. We waited as long as we could but then flew out there once to visit, did not like what we saw and made plans and flew out there to go get her and bring her home. She had basically nothing and we had to rebut her everything. We are just figuring it all out now. She probably has a combination of depression and dementia which is exactly what we are going through. Hopkins has a clinic to deal with it and we have an appointment set up. We are having a terrible time getting her into a nursing home. The gov't will not pay for assisted living. If you are in Maryland, do call and get her on the medicaid waiver program - that pays for assisted living but it is about a 4-6 year minimum wait. You just have to call and giver her name/your contact information. I would move her here as there is no one willing to look in on her if she stays there. That is what happened to us. We have lots of family where she was but no one was doing anything and her other son basically walked away from the situation. If she is low income there are several low income independent living programs that have shorter waits. We cannot do one of those. There is an lower cost assisted living in Silver Spring for about $2600 but she does not have that kind of money. Or, if there is very low income (social security) and limited assets (spouse can keep the house, car and some money) then you can get the medicaid long term care but it is proving very hard for us and near impossible to find a nursing home to take the medicaid. I look at it is how I'd want my kids to treat me. They watch everything so if we did not step in, how will they look at that and treat me when I am old.

You are at the point where your only option is to bring her to you and get her evaluated and make a plan from there. It sucks. There are really no good options.

pp have you been through this? I am asking in a non snarky way as I don't know how to accomplish this when my mom refuses. How did you do this with an unwilling parent? I am wondering APS also forces this when someone is in danger? I do believe my mom is in danger to herself but I am trying to figure out how this forced without being violent..I am imagining someone in the white coat at her house. Geez getting old really sucks. I would hate to be in the situation. Makes me remind myself to have a plan when I am older to go to a place that has steps ie living indepdendantly, assisted and then full nursing.

Anonymous wrote:Thanks for the information. This is very very stressful. I don't think dad is a bad person but he, with his new relationship, is content to let me my mom sort of deteriorate in the house. Last summer I found out incidentally that the AC wasn't working and her house was 95 degrees. I made sure it was fixed asap but I only found out by a surprise visit as my mom just was clueless. Since then I have been rumininating over what to do as I know it will develop into a family control war. Curious--if APS finds reason that she is a mess..and they will of that I am sure. Do they have legal course to get my mom in for a full evaluation? I am asking as my mom would say she is fine and her sister would say she if fine. I am hoping the answer would be that APS would insist on something happening? I know if she was forced to do an evaluation they would for sure find out she needs a lot of help. I do mean a lot. I know it's confusing with someone's right to be a mess but literally I stay up at night wondering if she is safe. I am asking on this anonymous forum as I want to have an idea before I call in case my call starts the process and if there is any downside to my calling and starting the process.

You need to get your mom an evaluation. You need to fly out there and make some appointments or bring her here. They aren't going to do all that for you. If you are concerned, your only good option is to move her.

Anonymous wrote:
While your intentions are that of a very caring daughter, you do need to think about how things might go on both ends. Contacting Adult Protective Services sounds like the appropriate first step for your Mom's welfare AND to document the seriousness of the situation for other family members, too.


Key to what you will be able to set up in terms of care for your Mom will be finances, and unless your Mother has income of her own and is still legally married, your Dad would need to be directly involved. Based upon what APS finds, an initial step might be for you to go out and get your Mom in for a full physical and mental health evaluation with her primary care doctor and a geriatric psychologist for a complete level of function evaluation. This will let everyone know how your Mom is doing healthwise. Before such a trip, it you could also research agencies which provide in-home services to get an idea of the ones which provide the services your Mom might need and the cost range. It would seem that as a first step, in-home supports might be set up to see how she does with that step and appropriate medical care.

If you find little "sustained" family interest in overseeing your Mom's continued care with in-home or facility based care, then this would give you time to set up the legal and financial tools to bring your Mom to your area. With her still being legally married and an aunt having POA, it sounds like this could be tricky and take time.....And realize that on your end you do need to d do some research on line to see what assisted living facilities there are in her area, what range of services do they offer (assisted and memory care), do they have an opening, what is involved in someone applying, is there an entry fee, what is the monthly base fee as well as added levels of care etc. THEN do the same research on your end as you do not just bring a person anywhere.

This isn't exactly correct as we are going through it. A lot of nursing homes, especially on medicaid or any other services will not allow you to get any type of help, until mom is living here. We have been doing this now. If your family has private funds to pay, then it will be much easier. If not, it is not an easy process. The POA and being married if they are not doing anything is not a big deal. Someone else has POA on our family member. We consider it void and do not use it. Adult protective services will only get involved in very bad situations. If she is being minimally maintained, they will not help. We called APS in CA many times and they did nothing even when our family member was being taken advantage of and had nothing but the clothing on her back. We had to advocate very hard to get any help here and even so it is minimal.

Thanks for the information. This is very very stressful. I don't think dad is a bad person but he, with his new relationship, is content to let me my mom sort of deteriorate in the house. Last summer I found out incidentally that the AC wasn't working and her house was 95 degrees. I made sure it was fixed asap but I only found out by a surprise visit as my mom just was clueless. Since then I have been rumininating over what to do as I know it will develop into a family control war. Curious--if APS finds reason that she is a mess..and they will of that I am sure. Do they have legal course to get my mom in for a full evaluation? I am asking as my mom would say she is fine and her sister would say she if fine. I am hoping the answer would be that APS would insist on something happening? I know if she was forced to do an evaluation they would for sure find out she needs a lot of help. I do mean a lot. I know it's confusing with someone's right to be a mess but literally I stay up at night wondering if she is safe. I am asking on this anonymous forum as I want to have an idea before I call in case my call starts the process and if there is any downside to my calling and starting the process.

While your intentions are that of a very caring daughter, you do need to think about how things might go on both ends. Contacting Adult Protective Services sounds like the appropriate first step for your Mom's welfare AND to document the seriousness of the situation for other family members, too.


Key to what you will be able to set up in terms of care for your Mom will be finances, and unless your Mother has income of her own and is still legally married, your Dad would need to be directly involved. Based upon what APS finds, an initial step might be for you to go out and get your Mom in for a full physical and mental health evaluation with her primary care doctor and a geriatric psychologist for a complete level of function evaluation. This will let everyone know how your Mom is doing healthwise. Before such a trip, it you could also research agencies which provide in-home services to get an idea of the ones which provide the services your Mom might need and the cost range. It would seem that as a first step, in-home supports might be set up to see how she does with that step and appropriate medical care.

If you find little "sustained" family interest in overseeing your Mom's continued care with in-home or facility based care, then this would give you time to set up the legal and financial tools to bring your Mom to your area. With her still being legally married and an aunt having POA, it sounds like this could be tricky and take time.....And realize that on your end you do need to d do some research on line to see what assisted living facilities there are in her area, what range of services do they offer (assisted and memory care), do they have an opening, what is involved in someone applying, is there an entry fee, what is the monthly base fee as well as added levels of care etc. THEN do the same research on your end as you do not just bring a person anywhere.

I would suggest you call Adult Protective services. If you are not sure of the number, you can either call the sheriff's department (non emergency number) or go and talk to them. They can give you the agencies that will help you.

I had to call for step father in law and they told me the agencies that could help. APS is the agency in my area. Probably the same for you. Don't know if the sheriffs deputy can talk to her and if they determine she is in danger or a danger to herself, they might be able to help sooner rather than later. Doesn't hurt to ask.

Anonymous wrote:I actually think she is a threat to herself. I am not sure she is with it enough not to leave stove on. PP do you have experience with this? MY thought is no way will she pass a sanity exam. I do not think she should be on her own. I was hoping she could be forced to get help and possibly this could force her sister to do something or allow me to do something. This is why I am wondering what happens if your parent starts to lose it and they don't want help. What happens?

There is a different threshold for seniors with dementia/memory issues and mental health issues. I would call aging and disability or protective services and request a home visit and if possible a caregiver in the home. We are in this situation. We moved them here and are trying to get them in a nursing home. Its a bad situation. You cannot force someone like her sister to provide more help. We did that wait and see approach with several relatives. It never happened. They were so out of touch they did not even realize for weeks she was moved across the country. Call for support services or move her here. Those are your only options other than walking away.

I actually think she is a threat to herself. I am not sure she is with it enough not to leave stove on. PP do you have experience with this? MY thought is no way will she pass a sanity exam. I do not think she should be on her own. I was hoping she could be forced to get help and possibly this could force her sister to do something or allow me to do something. This is why I am wondering what happens if your parent starts to lose it and they don't want help. What happens?

Anonymous wrote:Someone told me that in MD you only need 3 doctors to go before a judge and get a mandatory psych hold & limited poa.

That is generally for someone who is an imminent threat to themselves or others. So unless they are actively suicidal or homicidal- with a plan and intent- I wouldn't go that route. It will buy 72 hours and a mountain of resentment.

Someone told me that in MD you only need 3 doctors to go before a judge and get a mandatory psych hold & limited poa.

Thanks for your responses. This is devastating. I just actually had a friend listen to a phone message my mom left and we agreed that she needs help. This is awful and no way to live for her. I love my mom and I really hope she can get some help.

Anonymous wrote:Why don't you at least call the local Adult Protective Services office and have a conversation? Or the local office on Aging, if there is one? You don't have to name names and give a report, but get some information and find out if it is worth it.

This. We are going through this too and moved the parent here and its been terrible. In less you private pay for a few months, it is very very hard to get into a facility via medicaid. Call adult services and ask them what services they have. Some have respite/care givers that can come into the home if she is income qualified. We have a worker involved and its been a huge help. She is able to get things pushed through that I have been struggling with for months. And, just keep calling. It took several tries for us to get the help. I would try working with them first and if not file a report based on the condition of the house and her not able to care for herself.

Why don't you at least call the local Adult Protective Services office and have a conversation? Or the local office on Aging, if there is one? You don't have to name names and give a report, but get some information and find out if it is worth it.

My mom lives far away. She is in some sort of decline and has been for awhile. She is basically on her own except for bills being taken care of (somewhat as I have had to step in on more than one occasion) by my father. Parents live apart but neither considers themselves apart. I realize this is crazy and it is but it is a religion thing too long for a thread. My mom has a few friends around who say she is fine as well as her sister. They call her an eccentric. I know better. She is soooo thin and just not right. Father just doesn't want to deal and he has moved on with another relationship. I go to the house and it is a mess and she is a mess and has bursts of anger etc. I cannot have my kids there and as they get older I can't just jump on a plane as I had in the past. My brothers are useless and say leave it alone. I feel horrible guilt. What would I like to do. I would like to move her here and get her in a facility that she has some independence but I know someone is there. I can't have her at my house to live with her tantrums, not fair to husband and kids etc. I would like for her to be part of something and fun things to do and be around people who aren't using her. She is famous for taking people out and buying things etc. and this includes her sister who is a widow and is all around a nasty person. Her sister is now her power of attorney as in a fight she took my dad off. I am tempted to call a welfare type agency but I also wonder if this would inflame things. Part of me just wants to run from the whole thing but I don't think this is right. I don't even want to argue with my dad because I am sure he has caregiver fatigue coupled with just wanting to pretend there is nothing wrong so he can pursue his other life. I am sure I am not the only person who has been in this situation and I am wondering how best to navigate. My intention is not to argue with anyone, even my dad/aunt etc. I just want my mom to get some help. I believe some medicine could calm her down, she needs to be in a sanitary situation and she should be enjoying this phase of her life. This is also not about money, I am not trying to oversee her for some sort of future inheritance. Frankly I have a lot more than either of my parents. Anyway, advice would be helpful. I talked to her this morning and I was worried, really worried.