Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Therapists are taught how to establish a comfortable relationship with their patients.

The reality OP, is that if you could do it on your own, you'd have done it. If you don't want to get divorced, then you need to do everything in your power to save your marriage, even if it's uncomfortable for you.

I would guess that your rigidity may be a factor in the problems in your marriage, just based on your OP. Marriage counseling has helped hundreds of thousands of couples, if not more. Do you HONESTLY think you're that much brighter than all of them? Again, if you were capable due to your self-proclaimed smarts, of saving your marriage, you'd have done it already.

Not OP, but there are thousands of couples who haven't been helped from counseling, too.

The one person I know in real life who is a marriage counselor has the most dysfunctional marriage I've ever witnessed. Most of the people I knew in college who were on the path to being counselors were kind of screwed up.

I know that's just anecdotal, but it has always clouded my view of counselors.

I have a different and better view of psychiatrists. Most of the people headed in that direction were more interested in hard science and research and seemed a lot less new agey.

I'm sure I'll get flamed for saying this.

The probably is that anyone can become a marital counselor. There's no extra training.

Most are divorced. I agree about that - you should ask this question before you hire someone.

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe in marriage counseling either. I would rather go individual counselor, to get another perspective.

I agree. I spent years in marital counseling. What a waste of money and time.

I would say it's just me, but I've never known a marriage that has become significantly better (or a relationship repaired) through marital counseling. And I've known dozens of NW DC and Bethesda couples who have done it. As the second article below states, it's a pretty expensive way to keep your spouse in check - but it's temporary.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/erica-manfred/why-marriage-counseling-d_b_860493.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/laura-doyle/marriage-counseling_b_1933187.html

I would say, give it a try, if you're at a stalemate. Sometimes a third person's perspective helps a couple see each other's side and reach compromise and understanding.

I do agree, though, that I am skeptical that most professional counselors have enough wisdom and experience.

Anonymous wrote:Therapists are taught how to establish a comfortable relationship with their patients.

The reality OP, is that if you could do it on your own, you'd have done it. If you don't want to get divorced, then you need to do everything in your power to save your marriage, even if it's uncomfortable for you.

I would guess that your rigidity may be a factor in the problems in your marriage, just based on your OP. Marriage counseling has helped hundreds of thousands of couples, if not more. Do you HONESTLY think you're that much brighter than all of them? Again, if you were capable due to your self-proclaimed smarts, of saving your marriage, you'd have done it already.

Not OP, but there are thousands of couples who haven't been helped from counseling, too.

The one person I know in real life who is a marriage counselor has the most dysfunctional marriage I've ever witnessed. Most of the people I knew in college who were on the path to being counselors were kind of screwed up.

I know that's just anecdotal, but it has always clouded my view of counselors.

I have a different and better view of psychiatrists. Most of the people headed in that direction were more interested in hard science and research and seemed a lot less new agey.

I'm sure I'll get flamed for saying this.

yourselves, not yourself

OP, I kind of agree with you. I know a few couples who did marriage counseling, and my impression from their discussion of it was that they jockeyed for sympathy from the counselor. It wasn't so much having a middle man as having an audience. And it didn't seem to do much.

That said, if you have reached a wall, I still would say it's worth a try. I think it's sort of like if you have a serious illness and the only options are to accept death or to try a treatment that might not work, go ahead and try the treatment.

But set some parameters. Like, say, "we'll commit to going to counseling for 3 months and then have a conversation about it." Not that you expect everything to be fixed in 3 months, but it is enough time to at least sit down and decide if it is at all helpful. Just make sure to set an amount of time that gives you enough time to adjust to the counselor, et cetera.

The biggest issue I have with counseling of any kind, individual, couples or groups, is that, sure, there are techniques, but I think there are very few people who have the wisdom, the personality, et cetera, to really be a good counselor.

I also think that the other issue is that even individuals in individual counseling are rarely brutally honest. Whenever someone is telling someone else something, they are always subconsciously aware of audience, and I think it skews how they communicate what is going on.

Personally, a far better way to notice patterns and address them is to keep a regular journal. Set an amount of time aside and commit to writing the entire time. Try not to stop to "think" about what you are writing. Just write stream of consciousness. And then once a week or once a month, go back and read the entries. I think it is the only space, a private journal, where people are truly honest.

Perhaps you and your husband could keep a journal. And see if you each notice patterns in yourself and then schedule a time once a week to talk to each other about what issues came up in the journals.

Therapists are taught how to establish a comfortable relationship with their patients.

The reality OP, is that if you could do it on your own, you'd have done it. If you don't want to get divorced, then you need to do everything in your power to save your marriage, even if it's uncomfortable for you.

I would guess that your rigidity may be a factor in the problems in your marriage, just based on your OP. Marriage counseling has helped hundreds of thousands of couples, if not more. Do you HONESTLY think you're that much brighter than all of them? Again, if you were capable due to your self-proclaimed smarts, of saving your marriage, you'd have done it already.

Anonymous wrote:I don't believe in marriage counseling either. I would rather go individual counselor, to get another perspective.

I have not been to marriage counseling but my best friend has and has always been quite open about the experience. For them it was less of a therapy session and more of having a middle man to facilitate their discussions. Both my friend and her husband had a tendency to dismiss the other one's points and then get annoyed if pressed further. Obviously a recipe for disaster. The marriage counselor simply helped them have these conversations with a middle man present to diffuse the situation and then to later work on communication. It not only saved and drastically improved their marriage, but it also changed the quality of our friendship. Individual counseling (which I've been doing for years) is unable to help you with perspective of your spouse, since they are not there to say their point. The individual counselor can only help you with how you report things, which lets face it, when we are annoyed or angry at our spouse, we tend not to paint an entirely truthful situation.

We've been to both individual and couple's counseling. I agree with 10:41 that you generally get a lot more out of individual counseling. Getting that deep understanding of yourself and healing whatever stuff you brought to the marriage will make a world of difference for you both.

OP, what do you view as the alternative? Stay miserable? Or start the process of separation?

One of the best evidenced-based counseling modalities is EFT. It saved our marriage. Not once did we talk about date nights or specific things to increase intimacy. Nor did we talk about our parents' marriages. BUT the outcome after a dozen sessions was that we both wanted more intimacy and we were having alot of date nights. We are both bright people, but our Ph.D counselor was a step ahead of us. Not hokey at all.

I don't believe in marriage counseling either. I would rather go individual counselor, to get another perspective.

* be very helpful.

It's not ridiculous. Among other things, it's about recognizing patterns - in yourself, in your relationship and, sometimes in your parents' relationship (because that's the relationship model you grew up with and have the most experience with) - and then learning tools to deal with those patterns. It can

I am a private person. The thought of talking to some random stranger does not appeal. Plus, I worry about non-evidenced based counseling practices and worry it will just be too hokey.

At the same time, marriage is pretty miserable. Your garden variety post kids stuff. But I don't see how we repair this gulf between us. I am so angry and sad a lot of the time and basically feel like DH doesn't like me anymore. We fight and there is never any repair.

He'll go to counseling with me, he says. But I just really doubt it will help. I hate the thought of telling our troubles to someone outside the marriage. I hate the thought of bringing someone else into the equation. If we wanted to do things like date nights or a list of things to build intimacy we could. We are not stupid people. People always suggest counseling but I just suspect it would be excruciating and a waste of money. But I don't know what else to do.