Anonymous wrote:

Yes, it is now hell and it's nothing like what we went through when we applied to college or to grad school. The world has completely changed.

Hold on, this is a little hyperbolic. If you are talking about Harvard/Yale/Princeton/Stanford/MIT/Caltech then Chicago/Amerhst/Columbia etc. being the only acceptable options, yes, things are far more competitive. But my brother is just finishing college right now and he didn't take any AP or honors classes in high school and he definitely got into some reasonably good second tier colleges and is finishing up a degree in mechanical engineering.

OP's question was "to get into a good college". because you don't name brother's college we can only assume you don't think it is a "good" college or you would have named it. It is murder to get into HYP now (and I did get in). I doubt I could get into my own college and law school now.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a sincere question - are we overthinking the college acceptance issue?

Yes. At least, some of us are. Others of us realize that you are not doomed (doomed!!!!!!!!) if you go to a state school; you are not guaranteed success and eliteness forever if you go to Harvard/Yale/Princeton; and graduating from college without being $100,000 in debt is a good thing.

That comes up a lot - I went to Princeton and left with zero debt (had to do work study, housing costs covered by being an RA) - but there were NO loans, only grants. Not really answering the original question, but just have to comment when people imply that it's more expensive to get a private education.

PP, yes, but that is true only for Harvard, Yale, and Princeton -- as far as I know. Or do any other private colleges considered worthy by DCUM offer no-loan financial aid?

I went to college on a merit scholarship that was need based. You needed to keep a 3.5 gpa to keep the scholarship but your parents had to be below a certain income to apply.

Part of the battle is kids having their act together once they do get into college - having the adequate skills, work ethic, study habits and so on to make it through a good college program. That was the reality check for me - I sailed through high school, National Honor Society, G&T program, AP courses - but when I got to college, I realized I actually had to work and study.

Yes, it is now hell and it's nothing like what we went through when we applied to college or to grad school. The world has completely changed.

Hold on, this is a little hyperbolic. If you are talking about Harvard/Yale/Princeton/Stanford/MIT/Caltech then Chicago/Amerhst/Columbia etc. being the only acceptable options, yes, things are far more competitive. But my brother is just finishing college right now and he didn't take any AP or honors classes in high school and he definitely got into some reasonably good second tier colleges and is finishing up a degree in mechanical engineering.

Yes, it is now hell and it's nothing like what we went through when we applied to college or to grad school. The world has completely changed.

Anonymous wrote:It is relatively easy to graduate from a top-20 private with little if any student loan debt. HYP all offer zero-debt, need-blind financial aid. The other Ivies are close, as are Amherst, Williams, JH, U Chicago, Stanford, and a few others.

It's easy if you meet the FA thresholds, generally HHI under $100k, lower at many schools with lower endowments, and higher if you have extenuating circumstances, like multiple kids in college (but no consideration for younger siblings in private school).

It is relatively easy to graduate from a top-20 private with little if any student loan debt. HYP all offer zero-debt, need-blind financial aid. The other Ivies are close, as are Amherst, Williams, JH, U Chicago, Stanford, and a few others.

The issue I see with people's expectations is that even if a school is "need blind" this means that it will meet the expected family contribution according to the FAFSA. So the choice is not paying full sticker price of 50K or whatever, but if you have a household income over 150K and are expecting a full ride, good luck with that. Depending on a variety of factors (not just income, but also net worth, number of kids in college, whether or not you are divorced, etc.) you might get SOME aid, though. Most good private schools, including liberal arts schools offer at least some need-based aid if there is demonstrated financial need. This doesn't mean "I live in an expensive area and have high property taxes and have a 4,000 a month mortgage" need, this means need according to a formula based on your tax returns.

As far as the original question goes: YES YOU ARE OVER THINKING IT, ALL OF YOU! Life is not all about gaming the system to get into a good college, but I would say your kids benefit from getting a stellar education all the way through. There are literally thousands of colleges in the US, and your kid is not set up for failure if they don't go to, say, the 20 colleges deemed acceptable on this forum. I think the benefit to living in an urban area is that you realize very early in life how small of a fish you really are--and what is important is how you react to it. If you come to the realization in high school that "hey I'm not the smartest person around, but the smartest people are not always the most successful, and I just need to do the best I can do" that is a good lesson for life. I have seen people in graduate school who were the smartest around all the way through college, and they learn that lesson at 23 instead of 14, and sometimes it's harder that way.

It is relatively easy to graduate from a top-20 private with little if any student loan debt. HYP all offer zero-debt, need-blind financial aid. The other Ivies are close, as are Amherst, Williams, JH, U Chicago, Stanford, and a few others.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a sincere question - are we overthinking the college acceptance issue?

Yes. At least, some of us are. Others of us realize that you are not doomed (doomed!!!!!!!!) if you go to a state school; you are not guaranteed success and eliteness forever if you go to Harvard/Yale/Princeton; and graduating from college without being $100,000 in debt is a good thing.

That comes up a lot - I went to Princeton and left with zero debt (had to do work study, housing costs covered by being an RA) - but there were NO loans, only grants. Not really answering the original question, but just have to comment when people imply that it's more expensive to get a private education.

PP, yes, but that is true only for Harvard, Yale, and Princeton -- as far as I know. Or do any other private colleges considered worthy by DCUM offer no-loan financial aid?

Many of the top schools do now. Duke, Columbia, Penn, for example, offer all or mostly grants if you qualify.

Most schools offer all kinds of aid-whether loans, scholarships, etc-but most us need based, and most people posting on DCUM are not in the income bracket that qualifies them for any aid. That doesn't mean they can necessarily pay full private university expenses though.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a sincere question - are we overthinking the college acceptance issue?

Yes. At least, some of us are. Others of us realize that you are not doomed (doomed!!!!!!!!) if you go to a state school; you are not guaranteed success and eliteness forever if you go to Harvard/Yale/Princeton; and graduating from college without being $100,000 in debt is a good thing.

That comes up a lot - I went to Princeton and left with zero debt (had to do work study, housing costs covered by being an RA) - but there were NO loans, only grants. Not really answering the original question, but just have to comment when people imply that it's more expensive to get a private education.

PP, yes, but that is true only for Harvard, Yale, and Princeton -- as far as I know. Or do any other private colleges considered worthy by DCUM offer no-loan financial aid?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a sincere question - are we overthinking the college acceptance issue?

Yes. At least, some of us are. Others of us realize that you are not doomed (doomed!!!!!!!!) if you go to a state school; you are not guaranteed success and eliteness forever if you go to Harvard/Yale/Princeton; and graduating from college without being $100,000 in debt is a good thing.

That comes up a lot - I went to Princeton and left with zero debt (had to do work study, housing costs covered by being an RA) - but there were NO loans, only grants. Not really answering the original question, but just have to comment when people imply that it's more expensive to get a private education.

Anonymous wrote:This is a sincere question - are we overthinking the college acceptance issue?

Yes. At least, some of us are. Others of us realize that you are not doomed (doomed!!!!!!!!) if you go to a state school; you are not guaranteed success and eliteness forever if you go to Harvard/Yale/Princeton; and graduating from college without being $100,000 in debt is a good thing.

Is it all that competitive? Yes. Does it matter? No, not really. I agree with you that people can become happy and successful despite (because of?) not following the Ivy path. However, I would say that many parents who pay a bundle for private secondary school are not doing it to get into college; they are doing it because that particular school provides a better environment and overall educational experience for their kid.

I say this as someone who is likely to send my kids to private middle/high schools, and then University of Maryland! As far as I'm concerned the point is not to go to an Ivy League school -- the point is to become an educated person and a lifelong learner.

This is a sincere question - are we overthinking the college acceptance issue? Is it really that competitive, and does it matter? I grew up in the midwest, went to a bad public school, and went to a very good Ivy League school, where I was extremely ill-prepared the first year, but then caught up and did fine. I realize that much of the reason I got in is that there was little local competition (I was the only person in my school's history to go to this school), and it's very different here in DC. But I am frankly dismayed at the talk I see on this forum - is it necessary to spend 35K a year in elementary school so that your child can go to college? Is it really all that important to go to a "top school" for college - I know many people who went to "lesser" schools who are doing just fine, and many of my classmates who were "the best and brightest" in their high schools, who have not done much with their elite education. I'd be curious to hear from parents whose kids are looking at/have been accepted at colleges, to see what different experiences are. I have a strong feeling that my children will not be able to get into my alma mater because of how competitive it has become. But I'm also amazed at what people invest in their children's primary and secondary education, and wonder if that was necessary in order to go to college.