My dd's imaginary play is definite far behind her peers. She much prefers games that have fixed rules, even if she makes them up.

Paula Elitov, a developmenal psychologist, diagnosed our child with AS after a visit to the school that lasted a couple of hours and a long (many pages) survey/checklist that the teacher filled out (and, of course, playing with and testing our child and a long survey that we filled out).

Anonymous wrote:OP here, thanks everyone.
Our dev ped is Dr Beverly Powell, she asked us to ask the school to do an eval using a checklist and send her the report so she can diagnose. We will take this up as soon as school starts.
She also opened a book and read about Asperger's and indicated vaguely that DS might have it.
Agreed he cant articulate his imaginary play, actually he daydreams a lot, so maybe imagination in his head? Again DH & I were like that as well.

I tried tons of other doctors and could not get an appointment, I am in the waitlist for KKI and they said atleast a year. Does anyone have recommendations for a dev ped?

Wow, she opened a book to learn about Aspergers? I'm glad you're looking for another doctor.

OP here, thanks everyone.
Our dev ped is Dr Beverly Powell, she asked us to ask the school to do an eval using a checklist and send her the report so she can diagnose. We will take this up as soon as school starts.
She also opened a book and read about Asperger's and indicated vaguely that DS might have it.
Agreed he cant articulate his imaginary play, actually he daydreams a lot, so maybe imagination in his head? Again DH & I were like that as well.

I tried tons of other doctors and could not get an appointment, I am in the waitlist for KKI and they said atleast a year. Does anyone have recommendations for a dev ped?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is why observing the child at school s an important part of the evaluation. At the very least there should be a teacher questionnaire. Kids with AS can have some imaginative play, its just delayed, just like kids with AS can socialize, its just that they don't socialize in the way NT kids do. This makes it very difficult to put on the parents, to have you decide what is going on.

I've hear of almost no private evaluator who goes to a school.

Some psychologists might. The only developmental pediatrician who does is Dr Dan Shapiro.

Children's and KKI has teachers/caretakers fill out forms as part of their eval.

Our educational consultant went to DD's school and observed her prior to our first EMT meeting. If the psychologist doesn't do it, perhaps you can move to that step.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is why observing the child at school s an important part of the evaluation. At the very least there should be a teacher questionnaire. Kids with AS can have some imaginative play, its just delayed, just like kids with AS can socialize, its just that they don't socialize in the way NT kids do. This makes it very difficult to put on the parents, to have you decide what is going on.

I've hear of almost no private evaluator who goes to a school.

Our developmental ped did and continues to do so if there is an issue. Obviously that costs more so we've taken advantage of it sparingly but it can be incredibly helpful.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is why observing the child at school s an important part of the evaluation. At the very least there should be a teacher questionnaire. Kids with AS can have some imaginative play, its just delayed, just like kids with AS can socialize, its just that they don't socialize in the way NT kids do. This makes it very difficult to put on the parents, to have you decide what is going on.

I've hear of almost no private evaluator who goes to a school.

Some psychologists might. The only developmental pediatrician who does is Dr Dan Shapiro.

Children's and KKI has teachers/caretakers fill out forms as part of their eval.

Anonymous wrote:This is why observing the child at school s an important part of the evaluation. At the very least there should be a teacher questionnaire. Kids with AS can have some imaginative play, its just delayed, just like kids with AS can socialize, its just that they don't socialize in the way NT kids do. This makes it very difficult to put on the parents, to have you decide what is going on.

I've hear of almost no private evaluator who goes to a school.

This is why observing the child at school s an important part of the evaluation. At the very least there should be a teacher questionnaire. Kids with AS can have some imaginative play, its just delayed, just like kids with AS can socialize, its just that they don't socialize in the way NT kids do. This makes it very difficult to put on the parents, to have you decide what is going on.

Anonymous wrote:Its not the be all and end all. I would go to a speech pathologist over a developmental ped for an assessment. Our developmental ped said autism and our speech pathologist says no. It is very common in speech delayed kids not to have imaginary play. If you don't have the speech, its hard to do the play. Ours has only started to come in as the speech is coming in. To me, that play is not a big deal and I'd focus on the bigger issues. If you are not in private speech, I would do that.

Exactly! How dumb are some evaluators? How do we know a child had imaginary play...because we "hear" them narrate their play. In a language delayed child, others don't hear it, so they falsely claim no imaginary play.

My child always had a great imagination, but it wasn't until his language really kicked in that everybody else could finally understand it.

15:10 again. Doesn't your developmental pediatrician have your son's teachers fill out forms and/or speak with them? Please take your DS to Children's or KKI for another opinion. If your doctor tells you that they are unable to diagnose for whatever reason, it's time to take them at their word and see someone else.

OP,

Can your developmental pediatrician (or proxy) do an in-school observation to see your DC in action?

Also, would you mind sharing who your doctor is?

(Lastly, I sometimes think it helps for kids with delays to play with kids a little younger than they. When a kid is out-stripped by their peers they can get left behind. This way they can still work on their social/play skills with a little less pressure.)

Its not the be all and end all. I would go to a speech pathologist over a developmental ped for an assessment. Our developmental ped said autism and our speech pathologist says no. It is very common in speech delayed kids not to have imaginary play. If you don't have the speech, its hard to do the play. Ours has only started to come in as the speech is coming in. To me, that play is not a big deal and I'd focus on the bigger issues. If you are not in private speech, I would do that.

I have a 6 yr old diagnosed with ASD/AS when he was 4 yrs old. No language issues. Attends an immersion language school and does well in both English and the target language ahead of grade level, rising 1st, in speaking, reading, writing. He has imaginary play but it isn't at the level of his NT peers.

DS was diagnosed by a developmental pediatrician who does school observations. DS's main issue was relating to peers. At this point he appears "normal" and relates to peers fine without prompting. I don't consider DS to have "outgrown" his diagnosis. DS will always have issues "reading" non-verbal social cues. DH does too and while he compensates well, it does not mean he has overcome this issue.

I can only share my experiences with my daughter who is now 7 and who has severe executive function issues (extremely low working memory, auditory processing, etc.)

She still to this day has great difficulty with imaginary play although at her age she no longer even tries as it is just too hard for her. It is near impossible to create a story line when you can not hold onto the plot and characters via memory. Now if she had another child to model such play she will happily join in and follow but she never takes the lead.

OP, it sounds like your child has made great progress - congratulations on that !

DS is 6, had ASD diagnosis sine 2.5, special Ed preschool helped a lot, now finished mainstream kindergarten with IEP for articulation, some anxiety around loud noise and comprehension around WH questions. So overall great progress. Difficulty in peer interactions without adult prompting maybe due to articulation, but shows lots of interest in other kids. Lots of empathy as well.
Now the dev ped says she cannot diagnose him as she can't see him interact with children to determine if he has social delays because of language, which means he has outgrown spectrum, or if he still has both language and social, implying he is on spectrum. She said imaginary play is the other yardstick to measure his ASD and DS definitely is not the one to spin imaginary tales With ease. At the most he can extend on his immediate surroundings, past experiences or based on what he has read or watched on tv. Nothing completely original like her example where a kid would stage a war with a blanket and dolls etc. frankly, neither DH or I did that either.
what are your experiences, is lack of elaborate imaginary play a definite indicator of ASD?