Anonymous wrote:By 3rd grade, the kids are very well aware of who the smartest kids in the class are, with or without AAP.

Yes, but the AAP selection process doesn't necessarily get all the smart kids. There is a difference between gifted and smart. There are smart kids who are left behind and have to live with the stigma created by the large percentage of kids that end up in AAP. So many smart but not gifted kids get into the program that is does make it seem like only kids who are not smart stay in Gen Ed. DS is in AAP and was shocked when two of the most academically advanced kids in his class didn't also get in. I explained that the program was an opportunity for him to learn things in a different way and not that the kids in the program are smarter than the ones who don't go. I think there should be a program for profoundly gifted kids and all the other kids should be in gen ed and should have access to the current AAP curriculum. I don't think DS is profoundly gifted so this is not a self-serving suggestion.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It isn't just my school, it's much of the area.

No, it is not. But some people, especially on DCUM, want to give the impression that it is.

I think it is much of the area. A friend's younger DC was found eligible for AAP, when an older sibling had not been. Immediately the older sibling said "They shouldn't have that." The older DC thought AAP should not exist because it made the kids not part of it feel stupid. That family lives many miles from us within the county, but the same feelings exist in both places. Luckily my DC was found eligible, but I would have been very disappointed had the decision gone the other way, especially being at a center school and seeing all the AAP kids and activities happening all around.

Not sure what the answer is since, as others have said, kids do know who is doing well academically even within their own class (for example, who is in the "highest" reading group, the only one to start out second grade reading books without pictures). And it is good to have more challenge for those able to advance more quickly. I try to convey to my kids that different people are good at different things. Some might be quicker academically but others better at sports, music, art, theatre, etc. The most academically gifted don't necessarily achieve the most success in life -- they don't necessarily make the most money, have the happiest marriages, have the sunniest outlook. I have seen lots of hard-working, cheerful, nonprocrastinating average people go farther in life than those who did better academically in earlier years.

OP, I'm glad that your DD got into AAP since it meant so much to her!

I grew up in an area that had just started a gifted program when I was in elementary school.

Many of my close friends were a part of it, I was not. My parent's were not the type to appeal things like this.

I remember doing some of the acticvities with my friends during free periods and the friends saying you should be a part of this - but then being asked to leave as the formal activity started.

It definitely made me feel as if I was not as smart / smart enough.

Anonymous wrote:It isn't just my school, it's much of the area.

No, it is not. But some people, especially on DCUM, want to give the impression that it is.

It isn't just my school, it's much of the area.

I wonder what is wrong with your particular school culture and also the parents' attitudes at the school if this type of reaction is occuring.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think this is one reason that we as parents try so hard to get our kids into the program -- because it's there, the kids know it's there, and whatever we tell them, some kid on the bus is going to say the smart kids are in AAP. It's life, part of growing up. Both my kids are "in" and yet I still feel, deep in my heart, that it's wrong to create this dichotomy in third grade. They are eight years old, and the majority of them are hearing that they are not smart enough to get in the advanced program. I do think it's just wrong.

If they didn't have it, there would still be a group of smarter kids that everyone knew were smarter than everybody else..... And when they go to High School, there will be the smarter kids generally getting into TJ, then College where the smartest will get into the Ivies generally, then Jobs and new businesses where the smartest generally will succeed. IOW, it's a part of life. My advice is to try to make the best of it without making a big deal about it. It's more important overall for your child to be happy...

+1. Kids always know who the smart kids, with or without AAP. AAP just attempts to challenge those kids. If you do not feel your daughter can handle the work, do not put her in. If you think she can, do. I am certain most of the feelings of inferiority or superiority come from the parents. I wish parents would relax about it and not have so much invested in it and then the kids would relax. I have encountered o many parents who are so distressed when their child is not placed and so thrilled when their child gets in on appeal. It freaks me out.

Good advice. I also sometimes feel that the parents who are most distressed or thrilled are also those who aren't confident enough of their kid's abilities (or weren't of their own) and need some kind of external validation. I had kids in aap and not in aap and could really have cared less, as long as they ultimately (and if this happens in middle or high school, fine) come to love learning. So far they all have, but I think that comes from living in their house where they see their parents constantly reading and learning new things. There's not a specific amount of information that needs to be crammed in a kid's head by a certain date, but a way of looking at the world so they know that all the things they teach you; discovery, investigation, problem-solving, analysis, etc. are tools you will use for the rest of your life.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think this is one reason that we as parents try so hard to get our kids into the program -- because it's there, the kids know it's there, and whatever we tell them, some kid on the bus is going to say the smart kids are in AAP. It's life, part of growing up. Both my kids are "in" and yet I still feel, deep in my heart, that it's wrong to create this dichotomy in third grade. They are eight years old, and the majority of them are hearing that they are not smart enough to get in the advanced program. I do think it's just wrong.

If they didn't have it, there would still be a group of smarter kids that everyone knew were smarter than everybody else..... And when they go to High School, there will be the smarter kids generally getting into TJ, then College where the smartest will get into the Ivies generally, then Jobs and new businesses where the smartest generally will succeed. IOW, it's a part of life. My advice is to try to make the best of it without making a big deal about it. It's more important overall for your child to be happy...

+1. Kids always know who the smart kids, with or without AAP. AAP just attempts to challenge those kids. If you do not feel your daughter can handle the work, do not put her in. If you think she can, do. I am certain most of the feelings of inferiority or superiority come from the parents. I wish parents would relax about it and not have so much invested in it and then the kids would relax. I have encountered o many parents who are so distressed when their child is not placed and so thrilled when their child gets in on appeal. It freaks me out.

"I can be with my friends again and now people won't think I'm dumb".

This is why AAP is hated. It tears apart friendships - and siblings (one is "smart", one "isn't")

Not as big a deal in high school, but not forgotten. The nonAAP ers won't be rooting for your child to succeed.

By 3rd grade, the kids are very well aware of who the smartest kids in the class are, with or without AAP.

Anonymous wrote:I think this is one reason that we as parents try so hard to get our kids into the program -- because it's there, the kids know it's there, and whatever we tell them, some kid on the bus is going to say the smart kids are in AAP. It's life, part of growing up. Both my kids are "in" and yet I still feel, deep in my heart, that it's wrong to create this dichotomy in third grade. They are eight years old, and the majority of them are hearing that they are not smart enough to get in the advanced program. I do think it's just wrong.

If they didn't have it, there would still be a group of smarter kids that everyone knew were smarter than everybody else..... And when they go to High School, there will be the smarter kids generally getting into TJ, then College where the smartest will get into the Ivies generally, then Jobs and new businesses where the smartest generally will succeed. IOW, it's a part of life. My advice is to try to make the best of it without making a big deal about it. It's more important overall for your child to be happy...

I think this is one reason that we as parents try so hard to get our kids into the program -- because it's there, the kids know it's there, and whatever we tell them, some kid on the bus is going to say the smart kids are in AAP. It's life, part of growing up. Both my kids are "in" and yet I still feel, deep in my heart, that it's wrong to create this dichotomy in third grade. They are eight years old, and the majority of them are hearing that they are not smart enough to get in the advanced program. I do think it's just wrong.

I had the same thoughts. But others told me -- go ahead and do it. I am SO glad I did. Mine in HS now.

Do what u think is right for your DD. What r the consequences of being in aap, exactly?

So we submitted our daughter for AAP consideration in February without her knowing. She was found to be ineligible for Level IV. We appealed, again without her knowing. We received her eligibility determination yesterday. When we shared the news with her she was elated - literally crying tears of happiness. I have never seen her so happy (not even on Christmas Morning). As a parent, I had the same feelings - especially since her AART said she was "average" and not motivated and because she received a GBRS of 8 even though she consistently receives 4s.

Still, I was surprised by her reaction to the news. At the end of 2nd grade when she realized she did not get into AAP she shrugged it off as no big deal.

So when I asked her why she was so excited to find out she was in she said, "it's because I can be with my friends again and now people won't think I'm dumb".

I informed her that being in AAP doesn't mean she's smarter than anyone and it doesn't mean kids not in the program are "dumber" than those that are in the program.

When she went to bed last night I started thinking - AAP is great and as a parent we're fortunate to have the option within the public school system. However, is it worth the consequences? No child should be made to feel they are inferior - especially in their home school and in their neighborhood.