Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 22:17     Subject: Re:In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Anonymous wrote:It seems like the two choices are total opposites. Computer science at a tech school vs a liberal arts degree. I'm a fan of liberal arts and went to a school much like Grinnell and don't regret it. Also ended up in a finance/consulting career contrary to what a PP suggested who dissed my college. But if she wants computer science Grinnell is probably not the place.


how far removed are you from undergrad? I'm less than 10 years out, and it is brutal right now..especially as firms have cut back from the mid 2000's in terms core recruiting schools for OCI.

I didn't say you couldn't get Goldman/McKinsey type positions out of Grinnell...i'm saying it is going to be pretty tough...definitely compared to Williams and Amherst.

If you are a carleton grad, i did say Carleton is ranked higher than Grinnell and i would not be surprised if carleton places much better in IBD/S&T or MBB consulting better than grinnell.

The OP's DD is not interested in CS either. The major is econ or stat, minor in phil.
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 22:13     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Grinnell is not saks. It is more like Macy's. I don't thi k it is worth the debt. But UMBC isn't that great. Is there a middle ground/ other option?
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 22:08     Subject: Re:In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
It seems like the two choices are total opposites. Computer science at a tech school vs a liberal arts degree. I'm a fan of liberal arts and went to a school much like Grinnell and don't regret it. Also ended up in a finance/consulting career contrary to what a PP suggested who dissed my college. But if she wants computer science Grinnell is probably not the place.
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 22:00     Subject: Re:In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:UMBC is the in-state, her dream school is Grinnel. She's also been accepted to a handful of more affordable schools.

She plans on majoring in either economics or statistics (if offered where she ultimately attends) and minoring in philosophy. Her college savings cover one year of tuition and she has $15k a year in merit rewards.




I had a really good economics prof who is an adjunct at SAIS who I believe teaches full time at UMBC i believe. Economics as an undergrad study is interesting (and pretty easy for the most part), but as a vehicle to get a really sweet job right out of undergrad it is tied too much into school reputation. Statistics might be a bit more useful (i.e. teach hard skills).

Grinnell is a good school, but it is disappointed they are not giving your daughter more given the fact that they have a top-10 in the nation ranking in endowment/student ratio (higher than half the ivy league).

3 options:

1. I would suggest for her to go to UMBC and since she'll stay in the balt-wash area, to really network hard during the year so she can leverage that into internships every summer so she'll be set up really nicely come graduation time.

2. Her other option of course is to call up grinnell and tell them what umbc is offering and see if they'll bump up the aid/merit money.

3. A compromise with her could be to tell her to go to umbc for a year or two...kick ass..i.e. rock a 3.7+, get involved, help out in some research in whatever she's intersted in and then put in transfer apps to Williams/Amherst/Pomona (if she is dying for a LAC feel). Those three get amazing recruiting from places that are more stuck up on 'elite' brands like the banks and strat consulting firms i mentioned...plus they have AWESOME alum networks.





That's just it! She wants the brand, not the education. She feels like I'm giving her Walmart by pushing her towards UMBC when she could have Saks (in her mind).


I understand her thinking (i'm not too far removed from undergrad) and in this new-normal hiring environment, in certain fields, going to 'target' schools is even more heightened.

That is why i asked is it say "state school vs. williams or state school vs. carleton (which is around or perhaps even a notch higher than grinnell)".

Before grinnell lovers flame me, i'm not saying grinnell is not a top lac...but it isn't Williams/Amherst/Swat/Pomona when it comes to alum network strength and recruting into industries that are sticklers for 'prestige'. Not even close.

Therefore, i have to disagree with your daughter's assertion that she would be getting 'saks' through grinnell.

more than half of college these days is 'buying access'. That encompasses the network you build, the alum network, and the companies you feed to.

IMO i cannot be sure that grinnell gives 100k+ worth of value in this attribute. for sure grinnell gives lots of value over umbc when it comes to class size, prof/student ratio and focus....but is the whole package a 100k+ worth..it is tough to say.....probably not.

Would she be open to the third option i provided you as a compromise if she's really wanting a 'saks' degree from a lac?
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 21:48     Subject: Re:In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:UMBC is the in-state, her dream school is Grinnel. She's also been accepted to a handful of more affordable schools.

She plans on majoring in either economics or statistics (if offered where she ultimately attends) and minoring in philosophy. Her college savings cover one year of tuition and she has $15k a year in merit rewards.




I had a really good economics prof who is an adjunct at SAIS who I believe teaches full time at UMBC i believe. Economics as an undergrad study is interesting (and pretty easy for the most part), but as a vehicle to get a really sweet job right out of undergrad it is tied too much into school reputation. Statistics might be a bit more useful (i.e. teach hard skills).

Grinnell is a good school, but it is disappointed they are not giving your daughter more given the fact that they have a top-10 in the nation ranking in endowment/student ratio (higher than half the ivy league).

3 options:

1. I would suggest for her to go to UMBC and since she'll stay in the balt-wash area, to really network hard during the year so she can leverage that into internships every summer so she'll be set up really nicely come graduation time.

2. Her other option of course is to call up grinnell and tell them what umbc is offering and see if they'll bump up the aid/merit money.

3. A compromise with her could be to tell her to go to umbc for a year or two...kick ass..i.e. rock a 3.7+, get involved, help out in some research in whatever she's intersted in and then put in transfer apps to Williams/Amherst/Pomona (if she is dying for a LAC feel). Those three get amazing recruiting from places that are more stuck up on 'elite' brands like the banks and strat consulting firms i mentioned...plus they have AWESOME alum networks.





That's just it! She wants the brand, not the education. She feels like I'm giving her Walmart by pushing her towards UMBC when she could have Saks (in her mind).
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 21:44     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Anonymous wrote:Umbc - do they even have an Econ major? I had thought it wasn't a full program there. Philosophy is an interesting angle there, but outside of the purer mathematics, not sure how Umbc does for Econ.


She'd do STEM at UMBC, computer science.
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 21:30     Subject: Re:In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Anonymous wrote:UMBC is the in-state, her dream school is Grinnel. She's also been accepted to a handful of more affordable schools.

She plans on majoring in either economics or statistics (if offered where she ultimately attends) and minoring in philosophy. Her college savings cover one year of tuition and she has $15k a year in merit rewards.




I had a really good economics prof who is an adjunct at SAIS who I believe teaches full time at UMBC i believe. Economics as an undergrad study is interesting (and pretty easy for the most part), but as a vehicle to get a really sweet job right out of undergrad it is tied too much into school reputation. Statistics might be a bit more useful (i.e. teach hard skills).

Grinnell is a good school, but it is disappointed they are not giving your daughter more given the fact that they have a top-10 in the nation ranking in endowment/student ratio (higher than half the ivy league).

3 options:

1. I would suggest for her to go to UMBC and since she'll stay in the balt-wash area, to really network hard during the year so she can leverage that into internships every summer so she'll be set up really nicely come graduation time.

2. Her other option of course is to call up grinnell and tell them what umbc is offering and see if they'll bump up the aid/merit money.

3. A compromise with her could be to tell her to go to umbc for a year or two...kick ass..i.e. rock a 3.7+, get involved, help out in some research in whatever she's intersted in and then put in transfer apps to Williams/Amherst/Pomona (if she is dying for a LAC feel). Those three get amazing recruiting from places that are more stuck up on 'elite' brands like the banks and strat consulting firms i mentioned...plus they have AWESOME alum networks.



Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 21:08     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Umbc - do they even have an Econ major? I had thought it wasn't a full program there. Philosophy is an interesting angle there, but outside of the purer mathematics, not sure how Umbc does for Econ.
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 21:06     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Grinnell? As a Umbc alum I can tell you I think it is a great school for intellectually curious low-to-mid middle class kids (amazingly racially diverse, not economically) with not the best alumni connections.

I can't say anything about grinnell except - where and what is it?
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 21:02     Subject: Re:In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
UMBC is the in-state, her dream school is Grinnel. She's also been accepted to a handful of more affordable schools.

She plans on majoring in either economics or statistics (if offered where she ultimately attends) and minoring in philosophy. Her college savings cover one year of tuition and she has $15k a year in merit rewards.


Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 20:26     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
Agree w pp we need the names of the schools... And yes, 100k is a lot of debt.
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 20:24     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
A few questions to ponder:

1. How focused/disciplined/good of a student is your daughter?

2. Does she have a burning desire for a certain field....specifically investment banking, trading, front office wall street, elite strategy consulting like Bain/McKinsey?

3. What is the in-state uni and what is the slac?

If your answers are Very, Yes, and UMD vs. Williams/Amherst.....I would let her go to the SLAC.

if question three is answered as UVA vs. Carleton....then it is stupid to turn down the money.

you have to give us more to give a better answer OP.
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 19:36     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
It's undergrad. Insist on the full ride scholarship in state. If she graduates with all that debt, it will foreclose a lot of life options for her.
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 19:34     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
I think you need to tell her no.
Anonymous
Post 03/24/2013 19:32     Subject: In State Scholarship vs Out of State Debt
DD has a full ride to a wonderful in state honor university, but insists on going out of state to a $46,000 SLAC 900 miles away. She has some merit money, but not much.

Help me not to implode at the thought of $100,000 debt.