Anonymous wrote:I don't think it is just the electroninc projects..I am bothered by all cases where kids just get the ruberick back with points in the different categories but no way to know what the issues were.

Kids used to just get a letter grade, now a rubric isn't enough? Aren't there descriptions in the rubric boxes? Different categories? So a 4/5 for organization lets you know there was a problem with the organization. No?

[i]"I am a teacher (used to teach high school and now teach at a university) and I think you are conflating two separate issues. One is turning in papers electronically and one is not getting feedback on written work. We have students turn in papers electronically as one of the ways that we are trying to combat cheating. Programs like "Turn It In" allow teachers to run papers through a filter that electronically checks for plagiarism against other published and internet sources. This is invaluable to teachers in the age of internet research because it can be difficult to catch this kind of plagiarism in student papers. The fact that the student is not getting written feedback is a separate issue and is not dependent on the student submitting a paper copy or an electronic copy of the paper. I am required to give written feedback (and I believe it is one of the most important parts of my job) on all written work. Like the previous teacher mentioned, it is actually easier to give substantial written feedback on electronically submitted papers using the "track changes" feature in Word than it is to write in the margins with a red pen like we used to do.

I would talk to the teacher about the feedback issue. One caveat is that I often give extensive written feedback on early drafts of papers and then only give a grade on the final draft. I want to focus my written feedback on the versions that students are actually going to read carefully and consider as part of a revision. Long comments on a final draft that is not going to be revised are not as useful as extensive commenting on work still to be improved. Ask if this is what is going on if you are only seeing the final graded draft of your student's work. "[/i]

Thank you for your comment and insight. It is good to understand the view piont from a teacher.

I am a teacher (used to teach high school and now teach at a university) and I think you are conflating two separate issues. One is turning in papers electronically and one is not getting feedback on written work. We have students turn in papers electronically as one of the ways that we are trying to combat cheating. Programs like "Turn It In" allow teachers to run papers through a filter that electronically checks for plagiarism against other published and internet sources. This is invaluable to teachers in the age of internet research because it can be difficult to catch this kind of plagiarism in student papers. The fact that the student is not getting written feedback is a separate issue and is not dependent on the student submitting a paper copy or an electronic copy of the paper. I am required to give written feedback (and I believe it is one of the most important parts of my job) on all written work. Like the previous teacher mentioned, it is actually easier to give substantial written feedback on electronically submitted papers using the "track changes" feature in Word than it is to write in the margins with a red pen like we used to do.

I would talk to the teacher about the feedback issue. One caveat is that I often give extensive written feedback on early drafts of papers and then only give a grade on the final draft. I want to focus my written feedback on the versions that students are actually going to read carefully and consider as part of a revision. Long comments on a final draft that is not going to be revised are not as useful as extensive commenting on work still to be improved. Ask if this is what is going on if you are only seeing the final graded draft of your student's work.

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]OP here, I asked DC again, and confirmed that the teacher has never given any feedback to assignments turned in electronically. The only feedback the students receive is their grade posted on edline. How to proceed without offending the teacher?[/quote]

Here are some options:

Student: Excuse me, Mr./Ms. Teacher, could I possibly get some feedback about the paper I turned in?
Student: Mr./Ms. Teacher, are you available to meet some time at lunch or before/after school? I'd like to have a look at that paper and get some feedback.
Student: I saw on edline that I got __ on that paper. Would you be able to go over the rubric with me so I can see how to improve?
Student: Hey Teach, I really like it when I get papers back with comments. Can you do that for me in the future? Thanks, it really helps a lot.

Note who should be doing the talking here. [/quote]\

+1 This is good advice. Your child is old enough to be his/her own advocate here. Helping them develop a comfortable and appropriate "script" to take to the teacher might be a good idea depending on how assertive your DC is, but this is a good learning experience. Hopefully the teacher will be pleased to have a student motivated to improve, DC will get some feedback and be able to incorporate it into the next assignment and everyone is happy.

[quote=Anonymous]OP here, I asked DC again, and confirmed that the teacher has never given any feedback to assignments turned in electronically. The only feedback the students receive is their grade posted on edline. How to proceed without offending the teacher?[/quote]

Here are some options:

Student: Excuse me, Mr./Ms. Teacher, could I possibly get some feedback about the paper I turned in?
Student: Mr./Ms. Teacher, are you available to meet some time at lunch or before/after school? I'd like to have a look at that paper and get some feedback.
Student: I saw on edline that I got __ on that paper. Would you be able to go over the rubric with me so I can see how to improve?
Student: Hey Teach, I really like it when I get papers back with comments. Can you do that for me in the future? Thanks, it really helps a lot.

Note who should be doing the talking here.

Op - you are a pill. Bet your kids love you.

OP here, I asked DC again, and confirmed that the teacher has never given any feedback to assignments turned in electronically. The only feedback the students receive is their grade posted on edline. How to proceed without offending the teacher?

Anonymous wrote:Are you sure they aren't getting feedback? I teach and ask for electronic submission of papers but I return the papers electronically with detailed feedback via track changes and comments using review features. If students are really receiving nothing but a grade then I think you should ask the teacher about this. A poor grade on a paper without comments is completely worthless. The student learns nothing from the grade and learns nothing about how to produce a better paper the next time. It would surprise me if multiple teachers are providing no critiques at all of student writing, so I'm wondering if the papers are coming back electronically with markup and you just aren't seeing them.

Hooray for you! You sound like a great teacher. My DC hands in papers electronically, and she only has one teacher who provides feedback done via electronic "sticky notes". Most of the time when she hands in something electronically, she has to wait until the grade is posted on Edline -- that is the only feedback she would receive. When kids turn in papers electronically and don't get feedback, it's a huge negative in terms of quality of education received. When papers are returned with electronic comments, then I think it's fine.

The only caveat is that we do know a number of kids at school who don't have the same access as we do in our family to internet, computer, printer, etc. For these kids, a blanket rule that papers must be turned in electronically can be problematic.

I think the point of the electronic submission is that the program checks for plagiarism. My DC in private school, and now in college, has to use the same program. My DC at MCPS has gotten feedback on most assignments, but certainly not all. We've encouraged her to talk to the teachers about how to improve when that's been needed.

If they turn in papers electronically, it doesn't automatically mean they don't get feedback. Those are two separate things. In some recent graduate courses, I turned in papers electronically and got them back either in the same format, with comments, or printed out with comments in class.

If we've learned anything from that crazy exam thread, it's the value of teaching your kids to self-advocate and ASK for feedback if they are not getting it. When they get to college (and beyond) this will be an important skill.

I don't think it is just the electroninc projects..I am bothered by all cases where kids just get the ruberick back with points in the different categories but no way to know what the issues were.

Turning in papers electronically is the future our kids will live in. It is commonplace in the high schools, colleges and graduate schools already.

Getting feedback, though, is important. I agree that it diminishes the educational value if kids turn something in and receive little or no feedback from the teacher. Unfortunately, my DS in high school has had this experience on a few occasions. Most of his teachers do a decent job of giving comments and corrections, though.

My kid is in elementary school and doing this for some of his homework. I mostly stay out of his homework, but as far as I can tell he gets no feedback-- just a grade without even an indication of what question he got wrong. He doesn't seem bothered by it so I am not sure if they are going over it in class, or he just figures it doesn't matter if he occasionally gets one wrong.

Are you sure they aren't getting feedback? I teach and ask for electronic submission of papers but I return the papers electronically with detailed feedback via track changes and comments using review features. If students are really receiving nothing but a grade then I think you should ask the teacher about this. A poor grade on a paper without comments is completely worthless. The student learns nothing from the grade and learns nothing about how to produce a better paper the next time. It would surprise me if multiple teachers are providing no critiques at all of student writing, so I'm wondering if the papers are coming back electronically with markup and you just aren't seeing them.

Our DC is in high school and I have noticed that some of his teachers are requiring that students turn in their papers (essays, research papers, etc.) electronically. My problem with this is that the students never get their assignments back with comments on what they got wrong and what was right - basically they do not learn how to improve. This is similar to another poster who complained about students not getting their test back to review and study. Is their anything a parent can do or say without sounding like a PITA? Why is MCPS taking steps that prevent students from learning how to improve. I remember one of the best way me to study was reviewing old tests and reading over teachers' comments.