Anonymous wrote:


The irony of your whining is it sounds like you were discriminated against in favor of your younger brother. I hope you a wise enough not to make such an allegation in the sanctity of your own family! You may not be a stronger or more successful student than your brother over the long haul. Success or brilliance is not measured simply by minor variations in SAT scores or GPAs. With maturity you will learn this lesson in due time.

The poster was not whining, just describing his or her own experience.
Go to bed, grumpy.

Anonymous wrote:


The irony of your whining is it sounds like you were discriminated against in favor of your younger brother. I hope you a wise enough not to make such an allegation in the sanctity of your own family! You may not be a stronger or more successful student than your brother over the long haul. Success or brilliance is not measured simply by minor variations in SAT scores or GPAs. With maturity you will learn this lesson in due time.

Wasn't really whinging but more accurately I wanted to just share my experiences to the OP, being a fellow Asian American. I'm really proud of my younger sibling and he's extremely grateful for my advice on how to be the strongest applicant possible with the current system that is in place at most schools. Regardless, it doesn't matter now as I'm successful and happy with my path and it has all worked out.

I never said I felt discriminated in favour of him. The only bitterness (albeit small) that I have was that I did not know the nuances of elite private college admissions when I was going through the process and no one really told me (we did not grow up in an area with many asians in it). However I was able to impart that knowledge for my brother and so when a follow Asian/Indian-American asks, I try to give my two cents so they are more informed than I was during my cycle.

It isn't discrimination as much as each school has an idea of how they want to fill their class in terms of quotas. Asians/Indians are the 'new' Jews (read up on Jewish discrimination in Ivy League admissions from 50 years ago).

Most elite schools are private and are not subject to anti-affirmative action laws. Otherwise Stanford would be 30-40%+ asian like UCLA and Berkeley are.

Please read: http://thechoice.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/02/08/do-a...-admissions-at-elite-colleges/

As an A/I, all I can say to the OP is it is what it is, Asians (and white females) are the worst group to be in demographically for admittance to elite private schools. It is even more important that you have a 'hook'; an attribute you bring that makes admissions officials compare you to a smaller pool than "all asians with 2200+ SAT's and top 5% class ranks".

I was a stronger student than my much younger sibling, however I was unhooked. My sibling was an athletic recruit (rare for an asian/indian-american). I ended up going to my last choice safety school (my fault as i didn't apply to enough schools in the 15-25 range and applied to too many in the top 5-10 range). My sibling OTOH goes to a very elite school.

If you don't want to be 'discriminated' against based on race, apply to UCLA and Berkeley.

Also, don't put too much stock into the what the 25-75th percentile bands are for scores for schools if you are an un-hooked asian/indian. You pretty much need to be in the 75th percentile or greater otherwise you probably wont be getting into that school.

Also cast your net wide; there are a ton of great schools besides HYPSM and AWS.

The irony of your whining is it sounds like you were discriminated against in favor of your younger brother. I hope you a wise enough not to make such an allegation in the sanctity of your own family! You may not be a stronger or more successful student than your brother over the long haul. Success or brilliance is not measured simply by minor variations in SAT scores or GPAs. With maturity you will learn this lesson in due time.

I'm not sure what you mean by downweighted. The best schools look at test scores as the beginning of their evaluation process. Harvard gets 15 applicants for every spot. 30-40% of those kids have 750+ on all parts of the SAT and multiple 5's on AP tests. They ultimately have to make their decision based on factors other than test scores.

Top colleges also aren't that convinced that test scores completely measure the things they care about. The correlation between SAT scores and performance in college is in the neighborhood of .2 - positive, but not that high. Colleges want successful alums who will donate money and/or make them look good. They look for evidence of motivation, critical thinking, original research, and leadership.

In general, all college applicants should pursue their top 2 or 3 interests with enthusiasm. Whatever it is (fencing, community service etc.), the universities will look for evidence of increasing mastery and leadership.

If you want to apply to universities that place weight on test scores, you can apply to flagship state universities, which often use formulas for admissions, and CalTech.

Anonymous wrote:"Unhooked" isn't really a term. A hook is when a student has an admissions advantage because of some unique characteristic, like being a top athlete, or an Intel finalist, or something like that. There is no opposite. You either have a hook or you don't.

Oh, and at DC's prep school, the kids going to the top colleges are the ones with the hooks, not the very top students. Imagine the AD at Penn. 4.0 GPA with 2200 SATs? Yawn. 3.75 GPA with 2100 SATs AND averages 22 points and 10 rebounds? Now we are talking. Elite colleges don't want great students who are well-rounded. They want great students with exceptional talents. This has more to do with getting admitted than race.

So the Asians need to be exceptional at sports and academics? Are they getting the message?

"Unhooked" isn't really a term. A hook is when a student has an admissions advantage because of some unique characteristic, like being a top athlete, or an Intel finalist, or something like that. There is no opposite. You either have a hook or you don't.

Oh, and at DC's prep school, the kids going to the top colleges are the ones with the hooks, not the very top students. Imagine the AD at Penn. 4.0 GPA with 2200 SATs? Yawn. 3.75 GPA with 2100 SATs AND averages 22 points and 10 rebounds? Now we are talking. Elite colleges don't want great students who are well-rounded. They want great students with exceptional talents. This has more to do with getting admitted than race.

How about legally changing your name, including your first name if you are female and your first name gives it away?

Anonymous wrote:I think several people have filed complaints over the years alleging discrimination against Asian applicants to college. As far as I know, all the complaints have been dismissed or withdrawn.

IIRC, the basis for the complaints is the idea that Asian applicants on average have higher scores on standardized tests than other races, and that some Asian applicants are rejected/waitlisted even though they have higher standardized test scores than other applicants who are admitted. The complaints probably would be more successful if admissions were based solely on standardized test scores.

They have been withdrawn because it is tough to prove since the suits are brought against private schools.

UCLA and Berkeley look at the 'whole candidate' as well, but they are truly race blind and you see the results when in comparison to Stanford when it comes to student demographics.

Anonymous wrote:Hi!
I was recently told by a friend of mine that Asians and Indians are discriminated against in the application process. Apparently their scores are downweighted while others are upweighted so that everyone scores look more comparable. If this is true, what can you do if you are Asian/Indian to ensure that you can go into a top university. Also how would the school know if you were Asian/Indian besides self-reporting?

Definitely apply to Vanderbilt. It is a great school, extremely fun, great looking student body, great academically. In short, if you are an Asian/Indian-American kid who is well-rounded, socially not-awkward your total undergrad experience will be great there compared to being a gunner at HYPSM.

It is unique amongst its peers in the top25 in that Asian/Indian enrollment is much lower in comparison to its peers. A lot of it has to do with Vandy's image as being an 'old money southern school', which is true, but Vandy administrators are doing an active job in trying to change that image.

It is overlooked a lot by Asians/Indians from the coasts so you are competing against less similar candidates while at the same time the admissions staff at Vandy wants you more than at other top25 schools due to the demographic differences between vandy and those schools.

It isn't discrimination as much as each school has an idea of how they want to fill their class in terms of quotas. Asians/Indians are the 'new' Jews (read up on Jewish discrimination in Ivy League admissions from 50 years ago).

Most elite schools are private and are not subject to anti-affirmative action laws. Otherwise Stanford would be 30-40%+ asian like UCLA and Berkeley are.

Please read: http://thechoice.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/02/08/do-asian-americans-face-bias-in-admissions-at-elite-colleges/

As an A/I, all I can say to the OP is it is what it is, Asians (and white females) are the worst group to be in demographically for admittance to elite private schools. It is even more important that you have a 'hook'; an attribute you bring that makes admissions officials compare you to a smaller pool than "all asians with 2200+ SAT's and top 5% class ranks".

I was a stronger student than my much younger sibling, however I was unhooked. My sibling was an athletic recruit (rare for an asian/indian-american). I ended up going to my last choice safety school (my fault as i didn't apply to enough schools in the 15-25 range and applied to too many in the top 5-10 range). My sibling OTOH goes to a very elite school.

If you don't want to be 'discriminated' against based on race, apply to UCLA and Berkeley.

Also, don't put too much stock into the what the 25-75th percentile bands are for scores for schools if you are an un-hooked asian/indian. You pretty much need to be in the 75th percentile or greater otherwise you probably wont be getting into that school.

Also cast your net wide; there are a ton of great schools besides HYPSM and AWS.

I think several people have filed complaints over the years alleging discrimination against Asian applicants to college. As far as I know, all the complaints have been dismissed or withdrawn.

IIRC, the basis for the complaints is the idea that Asian applicants on average have higher scores on standardized tests than other races, and that some Asian applicants are rejected/waitlisted even though they have higher standardized test scores than other applicants who are admitted. The complaints probably would be more successful if admissions were based solely on standardized test scores.

First of all, no one is entitled to a spot at a college so you can't ever say you were deprived of one.

Schools try to get a demographic mix which means that any particular demographic that is in large supply will have a harder time because there are more of them. This is often true for Asian applicants. It is also often true for girls -- there are more girls applying to the top schools so it is more difficult for them to get in. Ditto white people.

This isn't about weighing scores, they don't do that. Its weighing a lot of factors having to do with the applicant.

If you look at this as discrimination I think you will have a tough time. There are plenty of fantastic colleges in this country and your child will get into one. I say this as the parents of a white girl who is applying this year. I know she is in the toughest demographic. But I don't call this discrimination because she will get in somewhere and we are not entitled to a slot.

Anonymous wrote:Hi!
I was recently told by a friend of mine that Asians and Indians are discriminated against in the application process. Apparently their scores are downweighted while others are upweighted so that everyone scores look more comparable. If this is true, what can you do if you are Asian/Indian to ensure that you can go into a top university. Also how would the school know if you were Asian/Indian besides self-reporting?

I'm sure you're a bright person; surely you can figure this out?

I find that very, very hard to believe.

Hi!
I was recently told by a friend of mine that Asians and Indians are discriminated against in the application process. Apparently their scores are downweighted while others are upweighted so that everyone scores look more comparable. If this is true, what can you do if you are Asian/Indian to ensure that you can go into a top university. Also how would the school know if you were Asian/Indian besides self-reporting?