Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Several SLC in my DOJ office left (before DOGE) to be partners in Biglaw firms. Both failed spectacularly. Less recently a friend left to be the workhorse partner to a big-gov-name partner; they worked very hard and became quite successful. I know another lawyer who succeeded beautifully as a big law partner post-DOJ, but they were in an high profile appointed position, and had been a partner in a different firm before that.

This is excellent info. Some attorneys can pull in business because they had a huge title in govt (e.g. head of DOJ white collar crime, head of an agency).

But most government attorneys affected by Project 2025 and Trump don’t fall into that category.

All of those attorneys are now trying to chart a career path forward.

Yes. Your average GS15 would probably struggle mightily, if they could even get a job as a biglaw partner. FWIW, the difference between those I mentioned who failed and those who succeeded? It was social skills. It seems to me that this should be obvious, that in most cases being a good lawyer is necessary but not sufficient for success as a partner given what the job actually entails, but to many it doesn’t seem to be. I was career, but worked with the appointed folks pretty closely, and we would call it “walking and talking.” It was hard to find line attorneys good at both. Those who were brilliant subject matter experts often couldn’t even be trusted to behave normally, and those with great social skills and a sufficient understanding of mores (including what to wear) often didn’t know what they were talking about. The gov is a weird place. But so is biglaw.

Agree that it generally works best if the lawyer has ever worked in biglaw because it is so different and if you’re new to it, it’s pretty hard to make it work. Similarly, I know some who have been very successful because they were very high up in government and they are able to bring in business on their name/reputation alone. But that is rare and for most gov attorneys it’s a hard transition. It may even better for the lawyer to come in as counsel/senior counsel (depending on the firm - if it is one like PP’s where everyone is made partner at 7/8 years then you need to come in as partner) so that the expectation is lower and they will get staffed on matters rather than having as much pressure to build a book. If you’re contemplating it, I’d ask a lot of questions to the firm about how they plan to support you in building your book, whether or not they have work for you already, etc

Anonymous wrote:Several SLC in my DOJ office left (before DOGE) to be partners in Biglaw firms. Both failed spectacularly. Less recently a friend left to be the workhorse partner to a big-gov-name partner; they worked very hard and became quite successful. I know another lawyer who succeeded beautifully as a big law partner post-DOJ, but they were in an high profile appointed position, and had been a partner in a different firm before that.

This is excellent info. Some attorneys can pull in business because they had a huge title in govt (e.g. head of DOJ white collar crime, head of an agency).

But most government attorneys affected by Project 2025 and Trump don’t fall into that category.

All of those attorneys are now trying to chart a career path forward.

Several SLC in my DOJ office left (before DOGE) to be partners in Biglaw firms. Both failed spectacularly. Less recently a friend left to be the workhorse partner to a big-gov-name partner; they worked very hard and became quite successful. I know another lawyer who succeeded beautifully as a big law partner post-DOJ, but they were in an high profile appointed position, and had been a partner in a different firm before that.

What is comp like as counsel vs NEP?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Related to this, how much mentoring or training is there for government attorneys to lead to make billable hours?

Government attorneys have the subject matter expertise but I always wonder how they can adapt to that expectation.

You don’t need that much mentoring for billables you just need to be willing and able to put in *and track* the time.

The harder skill and more important skill is developing business

Setting aside attorneys who held a top level government role, are longtime government attorneys generally able to bring in business?

In other words, is it likely many government attorneys can transition to law firm life? Not just big law but medium to small firms as well.

Anonymous wrote:Related to this, how much mentoring or training is there for government attorneys to lead to make billable hours?

Government attorneys have the subject matter expertise but I always wonder how they can adapt to that expectation.

You don’t need that much mentoring for billables you just need to be willing and able to put in *and track* the time.

The harder skill and more important skill is developing business

My DH went from 12 years in the government to big law as counsel. It’s taken him 10 years to make partner because he had no book. Even now, he doesn’t really have any but clients like him and his team appreciates his hard work so they finally elevated him. At 54, he’s waaayy old to just be making partner, but whatever.
I’ve heard that some negotiate a transition to partner from the government. That’s probably the better thing to do than what DH did.
FWIW, he’s now an NEP and basically took a pay cut from his counsel take home pay.

I only have awareness in a different market, but the ones who made it into biglaw and were successful had a niche area of expertise that was valuable to clients, e.g. commercial real estate group hiring a municipal lawyer with knowledge of rezoning and development processes. I've seen a few people really struggle with the hours and development expectations after having a "lifestyle" position for a decade or more in government and limited contacts outside.

Anonymous wrote:Related to this, how much mentoring or training is there for government attorneys to lead to make billable hours?

Government attorneys have the subject matter expertise but I always wonder how they can adapt to that expectation.

Ignore typo in the first paragraph.

Anonymous wrote:This is pretty common. Firms all have two tiers of partnership. NEP is just glorified senior associate, pay is very similar, only difference is title. We promote everyone at year 7 or 8, so the partners are really young and more often than not they aren't particularly experts and still need a lot of oversight and hand holding.

So when we need more bodies to get work done, we want to hire in the sweet spot of years 3-10. More senior than useless first years, but no expectation of bringing their own work. So if we hire at years 8-10, they probably get brought in as partners. But everyone knows what the deal is.

Do you count years of experience in gov the same as BigLaw years?

Related to this, how much mentoring or training is there for government attorneys to lead to make billable hours?

Government attorneys have the subject matter expertise but I always wonder how they can adapt to that expectation.

This is pretty common. Firms all have two tiers of partnership. NEP is just glorified senior associate, pay is very similar, only difference is title. We promote everyone at year 7 or 8, so the partners are really young and more often than not they aren't particularly experts and still need a lot of oversight and hand holding.

So when we need more bodies to get work done, we want to hire in the sweet spot of years 3-10. More senior than useless first years, but no expectation of bringing their own work. So if we hire at years 8-10, they probably get brought in as partners. But everyone knows what the deal is.

I’ve seen that sometimes where the person was at big law before they left. I think it’s also often non equity so they get the partner title but have to prove they can make it rain before they get into any equity.
My firm doesn’t do this—we bring people in as Counsel to see if it will work out. Have had mixed experiences with gov lawyers not being able to make the transition.

I know of several government attorneys at different levels (GS-15, SES) who have transitioned in last year to Big Law jobs. Some were hired as Partners and others as Of Counsel. I’m curious about going this route and am wondering if anyone has insight on how big firms decide to offer a partnership slot to departing government attorneys.