Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's American individualism vs community and social contract in other countries. Especially in DC where a lot of people specifically eschewed community of their hometowns to do other things and move up in the world.
Took me a while but after 10 years in my neighborhood and little kids we have a good school and neighborhood community. Took a lot of inviting and playdates and coffee and bus stop conversations. Volunteering for things, going to neighborhood events etc etc.

I think you're on to something about leaving hometowns. There's a natural community in smaller towns because you're seeing the same people all the time, they know you and your family, and to a large extent you have to depend on each other for entertainment since there isn't much else going on. I think people are also nicer to one another because they don't know who you know, whether you're related to their best friend, the daughter of their teacher, etc. Then you move to DC and realize you've got to seek it out, but you also want to prove that it was right to leave.

Are you from a small town? I am and that wasn't my experience at all. My hometown is cliquish and if you aren't from certain families or neighborhoods, you are treated as a second citizen. People might be nicer to your face than they are in a city, but because everyone knows everyone's business, there's also more judgment and gossip -- I find the live and let live ethos of a city far more welcoming. There is less pressure to conform and more acceptance generally. I would never describe my hometown as nicer or friendlier than DC. Maybe if you are the kid of the one prominent surgeon in town and you're naturally sporty and conventionally attractive and belong to one of the "right" churches and are not gay? For most people the small town environment is harder than a city with more diversity and more opportunities than meeting and be accepted by others.

It takes time

Get a dog and walk it around. People approach those with dogs.

Anonymous wrote:It's American individualism vs community and social contract in other countries. Especially in DC where a lot of people specifically eschewed community of their hometowns to do other things and move up in the world.
Took me a while but after 10 years in my neighborhood and little kids we have a good school and neighborhood community. Took a lot of inviting and playdates and coffee and bus stop conversations. Volunteering for things, going to neighborhood events etc etc.

I think you're on to something about leaving hometowns. There's a natural community in smaller towns because you're seeing the same people all the time, they know you and your family, and to a large extent you have to depend on each other for entertainment since there isn't much else going on. I think people are also nicer to one another because they don't know who you know, whether you're related to their best friend, the daughter of their teacher, etc. Then you move to DC and realize you've got to seek it out, but you also want to prove that it was right to leave.

I never relate to these posts. Half of my family is Europe (Spain) and while people are incredibly friendly, community oriented, and very into work-life balance everyone I know has lifelong friends and isn't looking for more. It can be very easy to find people to socialize with but hard to make deep friendships. I find Americans incredibly open and eager for friendship. Neighbors, parents of school friends, parents of sports teams, and work people -- there are always more people interested in connecting than I have time for.

I find it somewhat difficult for DH and me. He’s fairly shy and I like to be very active and I think it scares women my age. (59). We’re now in a snowbirding situation and most guys golf or fish (DH does neither) and the women sit by the pool and drink. I’m walking or reading and don’t drink.
I’m sure we’ll find our ppl but I can see that this will take time.

Anonymous wrote:Pp aboit the 'weird' - for example theres a group of 5-6 50 something women in my spin class. They are friendly and will talk to new people, but can't handle if someone uses "their" bike. One will show up hours earlier to mark their bikes with towels. If one of the group isn’t there one day and someone else uses it, they will make it vety clear that "this is Catherine's bike". Its just too weird for me at this stage and age in life.

Strict enforcement of the social order.

Pp aboit the 'weird' - for example theres a group of 5-6 50 something women in my spin class. They are friendly and will talk to new people, but can't handle if someone uses "their" bike. One will show up hours earlier to mark their bikes with towels. If one of the group isn’t there one day and someone else uses it, they will make it vety clear that "this is Catherine's bike". Its just too weird for me at this stage and age in life.

People don't want to commit. Clubs and meetups quickly disappear. If a core group doesn't come to the bookclub every month, eventually it fades and dies.

People are more weird (?) I've tried being open to new friends but sometimes some of things that get said feel really bizarre to me. Does that stuff sort itself out when we're young but is harder to discern with adults?

People want familiar. I'm early forties and spend the majority of my time with my same age cousins & close in age aunts, and then my two best friends (one 30 year friendship, the other 15 years). For newer friends that I spend some time with but not a lot, they started over work projects & getting to know each other quite well initially.

Europe is a big place. I've heard for example, that in Bassel, Switzerland, for example, people stay friends with the people they made friends with in HS, for their whole lives, and it's very hard for a new to the area adult to make friends.

I lived in a Republican, Christian area for a while, and as a Democratic Jewish person had a hard time making friends, because value systems were so different, and I wasn't used to having to explain very basic things about my religion (yes, I celebrate Thanksgiving, no I don't get a Christmas tree, etc.).

It's American individualism vs community and social contract in other countries. Especially in DC where a lot of people specifically eschewed community of their hometowns to do other things and move up in the world.
Took me a while but after 10 years in my neighborhood and little kids we have a good school and neighborhood community. Took a lot of inviting and playdates and coffee and bus stop conversations. Volunteering for things, going to neighborhood events etc etc.

People are insecure, defensive, and competitive (all of these qualities are related). I do think American culture either causes this or makes it worse because of how our economy and education system work.

I am fortunate to have a small group of longtime friends where we don't have these issues, and I think the key was that pretty much all of us went through some kind of serious setback in our 30s where we had to learn on the others, and it was humbling, and it made us just support each other instead of competing. But we also had to be open to it, and willing to turn to each other for support. I think that's what I see now -- people are afraid to be vulnerable with other people because they are afraid of judgment, and in many cases that fear is justified.

In order to make lasting friendships and real community, you have to be willing to admit you don't have it all figured out, and not expect others to have it figured out either. I see this so much with parents -- so many missed opportunities to connect because people are afraid to admit they are struggling and are too quick to judge other parents for not being perfect.

I sort of agree ( grew up in England) I think Americans are much more into pushing their kids and the whole rat race culture. I’ve only lived in the dmv though so don’t know about other places. Having said that, I’ve found good friends here. I joined a moms group when DD was a baby and a few of us became really good friends. DD is 13 now and I’m still close with 5-6 moms from that group.
I also live in a neighborhood where people get to know each other. Our immediate neighbors opposite and on either side are great. We all have 3 of us have dogs so there is that connection.

It is really hard. People in general have gotten meaner + closed off. I think we all need some new ways to meet people...the old " join a book club", " join a church group" or " go to a gym", aren't working as well anymore.

Why does it feel almost impossible to form even casual friendships? (I don’t think this is unique to the DC area, by the way.) I’m not sure if it’s Covid, middle age, or what, but it seems to take an extraordinary effort for people to even be interested in getting together or getting to know new friends. I also think this is a uniquely American issue - I lived in Europe as a younger woman (though with a family) and the culture was definitely more community-oriented.

Thoughts?