Anonymous
08/13/2025 17:09
Subject: Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:No. It has to do with socio-economics and placement of magnets.
I have college kids and high schoolers, who all attended or still attend multiple MCPS schools, because they all attended different schools due to special programs. We know a lot of people who have relayed their experiences with various other MCPS schools (and privates too).
Your premise is incorrect. Quality is not related to size. The advantages come from an intelligent, caring and competent Principal and the staff they hire (competency trickles down from the top), as well as the socio-economic make-up of the attending families.
Great employees are more likely to want to work in pleasant districts where students are less likely to have issues (wealthy districts and/or magnets); OR in really low-income districts at the *elementary* level, where there is a guarantee of extra funds to bolster social and academic weaknesses (but that advantage disappears at the low-income *secondary* levels, where kid problems turn into teen problems, that no school environment can fix).
You see where I'm going with this?
Educated and wealthy parents tend to pay more attention to their kids and care for their education. They are ready to plunk down any amount of money for early childhood enrichment, and then later, tutoring and test prep. Schools in those areas have a much less heavy lift for the average kid. (It also means they can devote more of their resources to special needs students - which explains why SN services and accommodations tend to be slightly better in the wealthy districts. Educated parents also know how to demand, insist and work the system better by paying astronomical prices for private neuropyschological evaluations to present as evidence of need: I know, I've had to do that.) The cohort of kids in a wealthy or magnet school district will be on average more studious and focused on their studies because they are raised in an environment where school matters a lot.
Caveat: magnets are purposefully housed in middle class or struggling neighborhoods (or which struggled at some point in time), in an attempt to elevate the cohort and insert a little equity into the system. This means there can be a wide difference in achievement between the magnet kids and the rest of the school, but you can't see that on the data sheet provided by MCPS - it's all averaged together per school. That's their goal - to hide the fish with sauce. The difference is sharper if the neighborhood is struggling, and less so if the neighborhood is stable. This might explain the difference between Blair and Poolesville.
Whether the building is large or small, and whether there are 1500 or 3000 high schoolers, or 300 or 600 elementary schoolers, in the end, does not matter at all.
It is not SES, it’s the parent/s. Economically poorer parents who place a high value on education will often have children who do well academically in school.
Anonymous
08/13/2025 16:30
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:If your child is garbage, Montgomery County public schools isn’t gonna change that so yeah garbage in and garbage out.
And MoCo has a lot more “garbage” than when OP went to school back then. Yes diversity is good but don’t think you can have cake and eat it too
I doubt the diversity is more garbage than the white trash of yesteryear.
Anonymous
08/13/2025 16:29
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I don't see that trend at all. Poolesville is one of our smallest high schools, and is also very highly ranked. Blair is the largest high school in the state, and is usually ranked somewhere in the middle.
I don’t think you understand what the OP is saying.
Poolesville is more than three-quarters magnet, full with exceptional students. Of course it's going to rank high.
Blair has a variety of students with different potential, of course its scores would be lower and will always rank lower.
Well Blair is decent. It ranked like #31 in the state, so that’s Top-50. Which is pretty good.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 11:16
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:I don't see that trend at all. Poolesville is one of our smallest high schools, and is also very highly ranked. Blair is the largest high school in the state, and is usually ranked somewhere in the middle.
I don’t think you understand what the OP is saying.
Poolesville is more than three-quarters magnet, full with exceptional students. Of course it's going to rank high.
Blair has a variety of students with different potential, of course its scores would be lower and will always rank lower.
Understood. But OP claimed "school rankings are suspiciously aligned with school size—where “biggest” seems to equal “best,” and the assumption is that bigger means better."
These are the five biggest schools in MCPS:
Blair
Walter Johnson
Wheaton
Gaithersburg
Seneca Valley
Are those ranked as the best schools anywhere?
Anonymous
08/08/2025 10:42
Subject: Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
No. It has to do with socio-economics and placement of magnets.
I have college kids and high schoolers, who all attended or still attend multiple MCPS schools, because they all attended different schools due to special programs. We know a lot of people who have relayed their experiences with various other MCPS schools (and privates too).
Your premise is incorrect. Quality is not related to size. The advantages come from an intelligent, caring and competent Principal and the staff they hire (competency trickles down from the top), as well as the socio-economic make-up of the attending families.
Great employees are more likely to want to work in pleasant districts where students are less likely to have issues (wealthy districts and/or magnets); OR in really low-income districts at the *elementary* level, where there is a guarantee of extra funds to bolster social and academic weaknesses (but that advantage disappears at the low-income *secondary* levels, where kid problems turn into teen problems, that no school environment can fix).
You see where I'm going with this?
Educated and wealthy parents tend to pay more attention to their kids and care for their education. They are ready to plunk down any amount of money for early childhood enrichment, and then later, tutoring and test prep. Schools in those areas have a much less heavy lift for the average kid. (It also means they can devote more of their resources to special needs students - which explains why SN services and accommodations tend to be slightly better in the wealthy districts. Educated parents also know how to demand, insist and work the system better by paying astronomical prices for private neuropyschological evaluations to present as evidence of need: I know, I've had to do that.) The cohort of kids in a wealthy or magnet school district will be on average more studious and focused on their studies because they are raised in an environment where school matters a lot.
Caveat: magnets are purposefully housed in middle class or struggling neighborhoods (or which struggled at some point in time), in an attempt to elevate the cohort and insert a little equity into the system. This means there can be a wide difference in achievement between the magnet kids and the rest of the school, but you can't see that on the data sheet provided by MCPS - it's all averaged together per school. That's their goal - to hide the fish with sauce. The difference is sharper if the neighborhood is struggling, and less so if the neighborhood is stable. This might explain the difference between Blair and Poolesville.
Whether the building is large or small, and whether there are 1500 or 3000 high schoolers, or 300 or 600 elementary schoolers, in the end, does not matter at all.
I have college kids and high schoolers, who all attended or still attend multiple MCPS schools, because they all attended different schools due to special programs. We know a lot of people who have relayed their experiences with various other MCPS schools (and privates too).
Your premise is incorrect. Quality is not related to size. The advantages come from an intelligent, caring and competent Principal and the staff they hire (competency trickles down from the top), as well as the socio-economic make-up of the attending families.
Great employees are more likely to want to work in pleasant districts where students are less likely to have issues (wealthy districts and/or magnets); OR in really low-income districts at the *elementary* level, where there is a guarantee of extra funds to bolster social and academic weaknesses (but that advantage disappears at the low-income *secondary* levels, where kid problems turn into teen problems, that no school environment can fix).
You see where I'm going with this?
Educated and wealthy parents tend to pay more attention to their kids and care for their education. They are ready to plunk down any amount of money for early childhood enrichment, and then later, tutoring and test prep. Schools in those areas have a much less heavy lift for the average kid. (It also means they can devote more of their resources to special needs students - which explains why SN services and accommodations tend to be slightly better in the wealthy districts. Educated parents also know how to demand, insist and work the system better by paying astronomical prices for private neuropyschological evaluations to present as evidence of need: I know, I've had to do that.) The cohort of kids in a wealthy or magnet school district will be on average more studious and focused on their studies because they are raised in an environment where school matters a lot.
Caveat: magnets are purposefully housed in middle class or struggling neighborhoods (or which struggled at some point in time), in an attempt to elevate the cohort and insert a little equity into the system. This means there can be a wide difference in achievement between the magnet kids and the rest of the school, but you can't see that on the data sheet provided by MCPS - it's all averaged together per school. That's their goal - to hide the fish with sauce. The difference is sharper if the neighborhood is struggling, and less so if the neighborhood is stable. This might explain the difference between Blair and Poolesville.
Whether the building is large or small, and whether there are 1500 or 3000 high schoolers, or 300 or 600 elementary schoolers, in the end, does not matter at all.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 10:04
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:If your child is garbage, Montgomery County public schools isn’t gonna change that so yeah garbage in and garbage out.
And MoCo has a lot more “garbage” than when OP went to school back then. Yes diversity is good but don’t think you can have cake and eat it too
Anonymous
08/08/2025 10:01
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
If your child is garbage, Montgomery County public schools isn’t gonna change that so yeah garbage in and garbage out.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 10:00
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:I don't see that trend at all. Poolesville is one of our smallest high schools, and is also very highly ranked. Blair is the largest high school in the state, and is usually ranked somewhere in the middle.
IMO from a statistical perspective this should be more of the norm. Smaller schools having more variability most the time outranking big schools on any given year, by virtue of numbers of schools.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 10:00
Subject: Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Personally, my opinion is that the kids who want to do well and get an education can and will do so at whatever school they choose to. Especially with most of the schools having AP/IB/Academy type setups and Dual Enrollment possibilities.
When I decided to move back I had the option to send my kid to a lot of different schools but I chose Gaithersburg because it is where I graduated from and I liked the diversity.
I tend to be of this mentality, but I feel there is something a little more sinister going on.
Talk to your shrink about that.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 09:59
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:I don't see that trend at all. Poolesville is one of our smallest high schools, and is also very highly ranked. Blair is the largest high school in the state, and is usually ranked somewhere in the middle.
You picked two magnet schools
Anonymous
08/08/2025 09:55
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:I don't see that trend at all. Poolesville is one of our smallest high schools, and is also very highly ranked. Blair is the largest high school in the state, and is usually ranked somewhere in the middle.
I don’t think you understand what the OP is saying.
Poolesville is more than three-quarters magnet, full with exceptional students. Of course it's going to rank high.
Blair has a variety of students with different potential, of course its scores would be lower and will always rank lower.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 09:53
Subject: Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Anonymous wrote:Personally, my opinion is that the kids who want to do well and get an education can and will do so at whatever school they choose to. Especially with most of the schools having AP/IB/Academy type setups and Dual Enrollment possibilities.
When I decided to move back I had the option to send my kid to a lot of different schools but I chose Gaithersburg because it is where I graduated from and I liked the diversity.
I tend to be of this mentality, but I feel there is something a little more sinister going on.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 09:47
Subject: Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
Personally, my opinion is that the kids who want to do well and get an education can and will do so at whatever school they choose to. Especially with most of the schools having AP/IB/Academy type setups and Dual Enrollment possibilities.
When I decided to move back I had the option to send my kid to a lot of different schools but I chose Gaithersburg because it is where I graduated from and I liked the diversity.
When I decided to move back I had the option to send my kid to a lot of different schools but I chose Gaithersburg because it is where I graduated from and I liked the diversity.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 09:38
Subject: Re:Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
I don't see that trend at all. Poolesville is one of our smallest high schools, and is also very highly ranked. Blair is the largest high school in the state, and is usually ranked somewhere in the middle.
Anonymous
08/08/2025 09:33
Subject: Is there a good way to escape the "garbage in, garbage out" mentality in MCPS schools?
I’ve had a nagging feeling that school rankings are suspiciously aligned with school size—where “biggest” seems to equal “best,” and the assumption is that bigger means better.
It also feels like the statistics are biased against smaller schools due to their natural variability. I was explaining to my wife: that’s actually what we want. If a class is full of exceptional students, then of course they should score well. But if a class has different potential and the test scores are lower, that’s fine too—what matters is whether the school helps students reach their potential.
It all seems acceptable if you're lucky enough to be in a big, high-performing school. But what about the large schools that aren't doing as well?
It just feels like your child’s educational experience is predetermined by your zip code.
Are there any school rankings or metrics that actually account for this?
It also feels like the statistics are biased against smaller schools due to their natural variability. I was explaining to my wife: that’s actually what we want. If a class is full of exceptional students, then of course they should score well. But if a class has different potential and the test scores are lower, that’s fine too—what matters is whether the school helps students reach their potential.
It all seems acceptable if you're lucky enough to be in a big, high-performing school. But what about the large schools that aren't doing as well?
It just feels like your child’s educational experience is predetermined by your zip code.
Are there any school rankings or metrics that actually account for this?