Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Paramount position clinics are expensive and basic unless you are high level and get pulled aside. In the past they’d have 30+ on a court with one coach directing traffic and yelling at them to do better as the form of coaching. He seems hit or miss at clinics. Their gym is odd shaped so viewing is hard and the gentleman at the front desk can be rude. There haven’t been many players who have gear identified from the club. Players may be elsewhere or different invite events. Like their business, designed to profit not train.

Not designed to train? I guess they qualified 9 teams for Nationals without quality training? Blind luck?

Training in a clinic is very different than training club players. Though, to the point made above, taking player’s developed at other clubs doesn’t take a lot of great coaching or training. The private / 1:1 sales job at paramount is strong. That’s where individual development is happening there.

A review is a review. You don’t have to like it. By all means offer your own first hand account and review, don’t just complain about the other person’s post.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Paramount position clinics are expensive and basic unless you are high level and get pulled aside. In the past they’d have 30+ on a court with one coach directing traffic and yelling at them to do better as the form of coaching. He seems hit or miss at clinics. Their gym is odd shaped so viewing is hard and the gentleman at the front desk can be rude. There haven’t been many players who have gear identified from the club. Players may be elsewhere or different invite events. Like their business, designed to profit not train.

Not designed to train? I guess they qualified 9 teams for Nationals without quality training? Blind luck?

See the other thread on Paramount vs. Metro. A post there makes a convincing argument that they aren't good at training players other than the very top group, and half of those leave each year. So yes, it may be reasonable to believe they aren't designed to develop players and really just focus on pulling already good players aside for recruiting.

I guess the players on their 2nd teams are such standouts and so talented that they can just miraculously get bids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Paramount position clinics are expensive and basic unless you are high level and get pulled aside. In the past they’d have 30+ on a court with one coach directing traffic and yelling at them to do better as the form of coaching. He seems hit or miss at clinics. Their gym is odd shaped so viewing is hard and the gentleman at the front desk can be rude. There haven’t been many players who have gear identified from the club. Players may be elsewhere or different invite events. Like their business, designed to profit not train.

Not designed to train? I guess they qualified 9 teams for Nationals without quality training? Blind luck?

See the other thread on Paramount vs. Metro. A post there makes a convincing argument that they aren't good at training players other than the very top group, and half of those leave each year. So yes, it may be reasonable to believe they aren't designed to develop players and really just focus on pulling already good players aside for recruiting.

Anonymous wrote:Paramount position clinics are expensive and basic unless you are high level and get pulled aside. In the past they’d have 30+ on a court with one coach directing traffic and yelling at them to do better as the form of coaching. He seems hit or miss at clinics. Their gym is odd shaped so viewing is hard and the gentleman at the front desk can be rude. There haven’t been many players who have gear identified from the club. Players may be elsewhere or different invite events. Like their business, designed to profit not train.

Not designed to train? I guess they qualified 9 teams for Nationals without quality training? Blind luck?

Paramount position clinics are expensive and basic unless you are high level and get pulled aside. In the past they’d have 30+ on a court with one coach directing traffic and yelling at them to do better as the form of coaching. He seems hit or miss at clinics. Their gym is odd shaped so viewing is hard and the gentleman at the front desk can be rude. There haven’t been many players who have gear identified from the club. Players may be elsewhere or different invite events. Like their business, designed to profit not train.

Anonymous wrote:VAJRS 4 days in new facility. Minimal AC first two days. 3 courts. Rising 8th graders take up one (not HS) court. Too many players on what seemed like to be top net that had their former club players. Good tall players in middle court didn’t get a chance to go up and top net players who didn’t belong didn’t go down. Long lines for the drills. Touching repition over teaching and individual help, but limited contacts with the ball d/t lines. One day was playing with balloons and t shirts less volleyball. A lot of players for not a lot of coaches coaching. Coaches told them things to do and talked to each other a lot. Younger coaches. Laugh and joke with players and parents like friends. Best court of players seemed good but not many really tall players just some high jumpers. One court had a lot of loud cheering and stuff but the others really didn’t. New people not feeling very welcomed. Competition level seemed better than other camps.

Kind of harsh but fits with their sad slow decline. GJNC performance and college commit rates as proof.

Anonymous wrote:Serious question--do parents stay and watch? I didn't so have no details like the PP.

Could sell tix to some Metro clinics. Like baseball spring training. Gotta worry about a club that says no though esp for price of pay to play. Seriously though how do you know if you got your ROI if not.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Serious question--do parents stay and watch? I didn't so have no details like the PP.

Lots of variation in whether parents can and do watch.

Some facilities don’t have a reasonable place to watch, especially school gyms with not much space outside the court.

Some clubs prefer or even have a policy that parents don’t watch. I’ve heard various reasons for why - parents distract their kid, it can create situations where parents question coaching decisions or methods, or some nebulous concept of “safety”. I’ve always thought this seemed shady.

Some clubs have a parent culture that groups of parents come to watch, whether practice, clinic, or whatever. I think this has as much to do with parents from a team/club who have gotten to know each other wanting to socialize as it does with actually watching their kids play.

Finally, I think there are more parents that watch their younger kids - as they get older there tends to be less parents around.

We did the math and driving back and forth between home and practice offers no benefits. With a 30 minute commute, we would drive 2 hours to drop off, then pick up. It would make sense to do it if you pair up with another family (with one dropping off, the other picking up - and some families do just that). We are lucky that our club allows the parents to watch (at least they can see what they spend money for). A lot of other clubs (but not all) have similar policies. I was hoping to observe an MEVC summer program, but they told me that their facility doesn't have space for spectators. That was the first and the last time when we signed up for MEVC activities.

We did a bunch of camps / clinics during prior years hoping that they would make a difference not only skill-wise, but also to get coaches eyes on our player. Some of them were really cheap and useless (through the city or county), some of them were expensive and useless (through various clubs). Since our DD's chances to play in college is practically zero and the cost of club is really high, we are trying to avoid wasting more money over the summer. It is very unlikely that we will spend more money on club programs and clinics with the exception of MVSA (which are reasonably priced). For us it's mostly open gyms from now on. We will give other parents opportunities to realize that they are overpaying for these activities.

Anonymous wrote:Serious question--do parents stay and watch? I didn't so have no details like the PP.

Lots of variation in whether parents can and do watch.

Some facilities don’t have a reasonable place to watch, especially school gyms with not much space outside the court.

Some clubs prefer or even have a policy that parents don’t watch. I’ve heard various reasons for why - parents distract their kid, it can create situations where parents question coaching decisions or methods, or some nebulous concept of “safety”. I’ve always thought this seemed shady.

Some clubs have a parent culture that groups of parents come to watch, whether practice, clinic, or whatever. I think this has as much to do with parents from a team/club who have gotten to know each other wanting to socialize as it does with actually watching their kids play.

Finally, I think there are more parents that watch their younger kids - as they get older there tends to be less parents around.

My player did multiple camps, clinics, and open gyms; some positional, some generic, including one sleep away college camp. The big name, college camps sort players by size very quickly and it can be hard to make your way up even if you’re an amazing and skilled player. In general College camps seem better suited to meet players from all over, interact with college players, enjoy the sleep away experience, but not a lot of true skill building happens. The intensity and caliber of play can vary dramatically. I heard similar feedback as above for JMU minus the catty player comments. We did camps at Marymount a few years until they outgrew them. They grew a lot in that timeframe and more players equal less court time but in general the coaching engagement was as high. Except younger / youngest age and in fairness it seemed like some kids were forced there by parents.

Clinic and camps at the big name, local clubs seemed more of a cattle call. A lot of players clamoring to get eyes on. That makes concrete feedback and as a result, skill-building hard to impossible. Finding good, high-level open gyms was hard to do, but when we could they were just as good as some of the generic prep clinics in terms of reps. Maybe even more so because of fewer players. The lack of structure is a downside while the free to low cost was a huge upside unless it was packed with inexperienced players. VAE in particular stood out for high-quality experienced, coaching feedback 1:1 and engagement in the positional clinics. Though, the caliber of players seemed newer and less skilled. That’s okay if the drills and skills are truly individually focused. These were. Ideal would be both but that wasn’t anywhere we went.

One club described their clinic as knocking the rust off. That seemed on target for a lot/ most of them but for a hefty price tag.

To a question above, yes, some parents do and can sit and watch. If it’s a long drive or commute and nothing better to do, especially.

Anonymous wrote:Serious question--do parents stay and watch? I didn't so have no details like the PP.

No but we hear from our kids.

DD did not enjoy JMU’s camp as much as previous years. I know this is for HS prep but I thought it was worth posting. She felt the sorting by teams was really off and the coaches were unprofessional. They are players themself but in past years that was a great experience. This year they heard them spend a lot time talking amongst themselves and making fun of the girls, the campers, behind their backs but in earshot. She came home feeling down about her skills rather than positive because of that.

Serious question--do parents stay and watch? I didn't so have no details like the PP.

VAJRS 4 days in new facility. Minimal AC first two days. 3 courts. Rising 8th graders take up one (not HS) court. Too many players on what seemed like to be top net that had their former club players. Good tall players in middle court didn’t get a chance to go up and top net players who didn’t belong didn’t go down. Long lines for the drills. Touching repition over teaching and individual help, but limited contacts with the ball d/t lines. One day was playing with balloons and t shirts less volleyball. A lot of players for not a lot of coaches coaching. Coaches told them things to do and talked to each other a lot. Younger coaches. Laugh and joke with players and parents like friends. Best court of players seemed good but not many really tall players just some high jumpers. One court had a lot of loud cheering and stuff but the others really didn’t. New people not feeling very welcomed. Competition level seemed better than other camps.

Post your reviews of HS specific camps and prep clinics. Organization, coaching quality, focus, volume of players, facility feedback and any insider upcoming club season tips you learned.