Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I live in CA now and my son has taken 12 dual enrollment classes and 5 AP classes. There has not been one community college class that is anywhere remotely close to the rigor of a well taught AP course or even an honors class at his upper middle class, competitive high school with the exception of a dual enrollment math class and chemistry class.

I think all colleges realize the rigor is not the same. However, public 4 year colleges love dual enrollment because kids can graduate faster and/or not have to take as many lower division units and/ir not as many units per quarter/semester. My son took 12-13 units every quarter instead of 15 freshman year at his UC.

My experience was opposite. The rigor of AP classes is overblown in my opinion. Between AP Calculus BC and community college Calculus I and II, the latter one covered more material, but the exam was easier, both require about one hour of studying per day.

AP Physics C has the same textbook as first semester of CC calculus physics 1, but is doing about two thirds of the material. Same story for AP Physics C Electromagnetism.

The instructions are far better at community college, with at least Master or PhD degrees from UC Berkeley or other comparable universities.

depends on the High school. many publics and all three top privates have masters and PhD teaching the AP classes.

Anonymous wrote:No, in fact I think it’s the opposite. My district in the Northeast doesn’t offer dual enrollment at all but plenty of APs. From the articles I’ve read, the goal of expanding dual enrollment programs is to get students to graduate high school with some community college credits so they are more likely to enroll in college and complete a degree.

In some states it’s also marketed as a way to save money and graduate in only 3 or 3.5 years. Not every college will accept those credits, though. This is most likely to work if you transfer them to a state university in the same state the student graduated high school in.

same as our area of the midatlantic. DE is seen as much lower quality in all our area public schools. The only exception is DE multivariable calc, calc-based physics(AP phys C equivalent, we only have AP phys 1 and 2), Diff EQ. These are not offered at our district high schools so DE is the only way. They take these classes senior year after maxing out on AP. DE in place of Calc AB or BC is where the good but not great kids are tracked after honors precalculus, if it does not go as well. Top kids track to AP Calc BC as seniors or even juniors. UVA and VT and WM never take non-AP/full DE-program kids from our district.

Kids take DE classes to avoid the hard teachers at their high schools. Using Rate My Professor, you can find teachers who are good but not overly demanding. Kids know what they’re doing!

Anonymous wrote:I live in CA now and my son has taken 12 dual enrollment classes and 5 AP classes. There has not been one community college class that is anywhere remotely close to the rigor of a well taught AP course or even an honors class at his upper middle class, competitive high school with the exception of a dual enrollment math class and chemistry class.

I think all colleges realize the rigor is not the same. However, public 4 year colleges love dual enrollment because kids can graduate faster and/or not have to take as many lower division units and/ir not as many units per quarter/semester. My son took 12-13 units every quarter instead of 15 freshman year at his UC.

My experience was opposite. The rigor of AP classes is overblown in my opinion. Between AP Calculus BC and community college Calculus I and II, the latter one covered more material, but the exam was easier, both require about one hour of studying per day.

AP Physics C has the same textbook as first semester of CC calculus physics 1, but is doing about two thirds of the material. Same story for AP Physics C Electromagnetism.

The instructions are far better at community college, with at least Master or PhD degrees from UC Berkeley or other comparable universities.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, in fact I think it’s the opposite. My district in the Northeast doesn’t offer dual enrollment at all but plenty of APs. From the articles I’ve read, the goal of expanding dual enrollment programs is to get students to graduate high school with some community college credits so they are more likely to enroll in college and complete a degree.

In some states it’s also marketed as a way to save money and graduate in only 3 or 3.5 years. Not every college will accept those credits, though. This is most likely to work if you transfer them to a state university in the same state the student graduated high school in.

That’s so parochial, if it’s not in your district it doesn’t matter. If you’re trying to say it’s not the way to get into a good college, you are completely wrong. A large fraction of those students end up in the UC system, at Berkeley, UCLA. It’s true they are state universities, albeit top notch ones. I wouldn’t discount the other good California school, UCSD, UCSB, Cal Poly etc.

The point is tripling the number of students taking dual enrollment is significant, and these kids will apply to many of colleges in the country, regardless of dual enrollment being offered in your district or not.

I should have been more nuanced and thorough in my reply. The OP posted an article about dual enrollment in California. My point is that the expansion and usage of dual enrollment is regional.

California has a symbiosis between it’s community colleges and state universities that doesn’t exist in other states. From what I understand, California community colleges are also well respected which, fairly or unfairly, is not true in other states. This is a great program for California students and they should take advantage of it.

In other locales, dual enrollment offers no advantage over APs and often isn’t offered.

To the OP, you need to know your high school culture. If many good students are taking dual enrollment classes and successfully getting the credits to transfer, follow along. If the strongest students are instead taking APs and forgoing the dual enrollment classes, do that.

I might ask the guidance counselor if there is an agreement with state universities to accept the credits and which popular private universities at your school have accepted them.

Anonymous wrote:I live in CA now and my son has taken 12 dual enrollment classes and 5 AP classes. There has not been one community college class that is anywhere remotely close to the rigor of a well taught AP course or even an honors class at his upper middle class, competitive high school with the exception of a dual enrollment math class and chemistry class.

I think all colleges realize the rigor is not the same. However, public 4 year colleges love dual enrollment because kids can graduate faster and/or not have to take as many lower division units and/ir not as many units per quarter/semester. My son took 12-13 units every quarter instead of 15 freshman year at his UC.

To paraphrase you, not a single one except for two. Facepalm!

I live in CA now and my son has taken 12 dual enrollment classes and 5 AP classes. There has not been one community college class that is anywhere remotely close to the rigor of a well taught AP course or even an honors class at his upper middle class, competitive high school with the exception of a dual enrollment math class and chemistry class.

I think all colleges realize the rigor is not the same. However, public 4 year colleges love dual enrollment because kids can graduate faster and/or not have to take as many lower division units and/ir not as many units per quarter/semester. My son took 12-13 units every quarter instead of 15 freshman year at his UC.

Anonymous wrote:Cornell would not take any credits that counted towards HS graduation. I assume some others schools are similar. At my kids hs, ap considered more challenging because of the exam
.

Your school is an anomaly. Even Yale counts Ib, DE and AP the same in admissions.

It may be with the lowering of standards for AP courses and exams. It’s one way to demonstrate rigor, but not the only one. There’s more variability in the rigor of DE classes, but AP classes also fall short of a rigorous college class.

Anonymous wrote:Cornell would not take any credits that counted towards HS graduation. I assume some others schools are similar. At my kids hs, ap considered more challenging because of the exam
.

Students can take dual enrollment classes in addition to high graduation requirements. A vast number of schools accept dual enrollment credit, often it’s up to the department, and may include taking an exam.

No

Anonymous wrote:No, in fact I think it’s the opposite. My district in the Northeast doesn’t offer dual enrollment at all but plenty of APs. From the articles I’ve read, the goal of expanding dual enrollment programs is to get students to graduate high school with some community college credits so they are more likely to enroll in college and complete a degree.

In some states it’s also marketed as a way to save money and graduate in only 3 or 3.5 years. Not every college will accept those credits, though. This is most likely to work if you transfer them to a state university in the same state the student graduated high school in.

That’s so parochial, if it’s not in your district it doesn’t matter. If you’re trying to say it’s not the way to get into a good college, you are completely wrong. A large fraction of those students end up in the UC system, at Berkeley, UCLA. It’s true they are state universities, albeit top notch ones. I wouldn’t discount the other good California school, UCSD, UCSB, Cal Poly etc.

The point is tripling the number of students taking dual enrollment is significant, and these kids will apply to many of colleges in the country, regardless of dual enrollment being offered in your district or not.

Cornell would not take any credits that counted towards HS graduation. I assume some others schools are similar. At my kids hs, ap considered more challenging because of the exam
.

No, in fact I think it’s the opposite. My district in the Northeast doesn’t offer dual enrollment at all but plenty of APs. From the articles I’ve read, the goal of expanding dual enrollment programs is to get students to graduate high school with some community college credits so they are more likely to enroll in college and complete a degree.

In some states it’s also marketed as a way to save money and graduate in only 3 or 3.5 years. Not every college will accept those credits, though. This is most likely to work if you transfer them to a state university in the same state the student graduated high school in.

Interesting read, the dual enrollment in California tripled in the last 10 years.

https://calmatters.org/education/higher-education/2025/04/california-dual-enrollment-community-college-growth/

The state invested 700 million in dual enrollment programs and about 30% of graduating high school students took at least one dual enrollment class, comparable to the rate for AP participation which is 35%.