Anonymous
04/11/2025 12:25
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Because parents keep sending these schools money anyway.
This is public school.
Parents don't have any easy options. Complain and make a fuss and the school is not going to look favorably on your kid. Going private and moving are your only options, and they suck.
In a school choice world, clued-in parents are more likely to start leaving for privates or charters or something that is not district run, and schools will either adapt to bring them back, or at least not damage the same number of children. But school choice is an issue that now belongs to, ew, those people. So it's better to just reteach your kids after school and complain anonymously, in the hope that the zeitgeist shifts.
Now belongs to "ew, those people?"
It belonged to Republicans long before Trump and will never belong to the left, despite the best attempts to cast it as an equality issue since the 1990s at least.
Just because it ended up staying with the Republicans once they became MAGA doesn't meant Republicans weren't "ew, those people" to many of you before Trump.
-lifelong conservative Never Trumper
Anonymous
04/11/2025 12:23
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Are you talking about in general or just your specific expensive independent school?
Virginia passed a law I think 2 years ago (might have been 3) requiring districts to switch to at least more science-of-reading curricula. It was a broadly popular, cross-political-party bill and basically all northern VA districts have made a switch.
That said, spelling and grammar have not yet been made part of the big "science of reading" push - knowledge for reading comprehension is getting there but even that isn't that great. Broader writing instruction that is direct and explicit hasn't either.
I would love for more generally cognitive science to actually inform how teachers are taught to teach. Based on what I understand, school would probably start looking a lot more like we remember (the "sage on the stage" and lots of practice) and less like it does today.
https://marylandmatters.org/2025/01/02/what-happens-when-a-school-district-commits-to-the-science-of-learning/
I am talking about public school in upper middle to wealthy areas. Why is our school sticking to these methods of teaching reading and writing? I didn’t know enough to actually call different schools to ask about specific curriculum (I did check out school websites and it looked fine. I talked to parents, older people, realtors, neighbors. All raved.). Once we got kindergarten with my oldest, we found out the kids were being taught to memorize a handful of words every week and guess the rest. It doesn’t seem to be teacher specific, either, it is the curriculum!
Since you're now at independent school, are you sure they're still using that curriculum? MCPS and APS are now using CKLA. FCPS is using Benchmark (not as good but still an upgrade over Calkins). Lots of districts just switched for SY 2024-2025 to a new curriculum.
And yes, before they switched plenty of teachers were doing things like getting Orton-Gillingham certified on their own time. Some admin certainly cared because it was good for the kids and encouraged it. Some I think just saw which way the breeze was blowing and became "science of reading" advocates because it was becoming politically popular and would be beneficial to their careers.
If you want more districts to adopt direct instruction in more areas (spelling, grammar, math), you clearly need Emily Hanaford to do a big expose podcast and your local NAACP to get on board with direct instruction as a way to close the equity gap. Or these were the things that worked in FCPS to get phonics sort of into school.
We are waiting to hear back for entrance this fall into 2nd grade. We are not in DC and it’s a different application timeline, since the public schools are so “amazing” that most private schools are able to have rolling admissions. But the two schools we applied to use old school textbook reader and workbook method, including phonics, spelling, and grammar. Which I know probably has its drawbacks, but oldest is motivated and I think would do well with that approach.
Anonymous
04/11/2025 12:00
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Because parents keep sending these schools money anyway.
This is public school.
Parents don't have any easy options. Complain and make a fuss and the school is not going to look favorably on your kid. Going private and moving are your only options, and they suck.
In a school choice world, clued-in parents are more likely to start leaving for privates or charters or something that is not district run, and schools will either adapt to bring them back, or at least not damage the same number of children. But school choice is an issue that now belongs to, ew, those people. So it's better to just reteach your kids after school and complain anonymously, in the hope that the zeitgeist shifts.
Anonymous
04/11/2025 11:39
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Anonymous wrote:Because they expect parents to teach phonics and teach their kids to read. Read with their kids nightly.
I don't agree with this approach and it's why lower class kids are being left behind. Not everyone has the free time to tutor their kids nightly (I wish I could do other fun things with my kids!). Not everyone has parents who even speak English to be able to teach reading. Quite a few kids come into k not knowing a word of English.
And it turns out direct phonetic spelling instruction is especially key for the bolded kids.
Anonymous
04/11/2025 11:37
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Because they expect parents to teach phonics and teach their kids to read. Read with their kids nightly.
I don't agree with this approach and it's why lower class kids are being left behind. Not everyone has the free time to tutor their kids nightly (I wish I could do other fun things with my kids!). Not everyone has parents who even speak English to be able to teach reading. Quite a few kids come into k not knowing a word of English.
I don't agree with this approach and it's why lower class kids are being left behind. Not everyone has the free time to tutor their kids nightly (I wish I could do other fun things with my kids!). Not everyone has parents who even speak English to be able to teach reading. Quite a few kids come into k not knowing a word of English.
Anonymous
04/11/2025 11:37
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Are you talking about in general or just your specific expensive independent school?
Virginia passed a law I think 2 years ago (might have been 3) requiring districts to switch to at least more science-of-reading curricula. It was a broadly popular, cross-political-party bill and basically all northern VA districts have made a switch.
That said, spelling and grammar have not yet been made part of the big "science of reading" push - knowledge for reading comprehension is getting there but even that isn't that great. Broader writing instruction that is direct and explicit hasn't either.
I would love for more generally cognitive science to actually inform how teachers are taught to teach. Based on what I understand, school would probably start looking a lot more like we remember (the "sage on the stage" and lots of practice) and less like it does today.
https://marylandmatters.org/2025/01/02/what-happens-when-a-school-district-commits-to-the-science-of-learning/
I am talking about public school in upper middle to wealthy areas. Why is our school sticking to these methods of teaching reading and writing? I didn’t know enough to actually call different schools to ask about specific curriculum (I did check out school websites and it looked fine. I talked to parents, older people, realtors, neighbors. All raved.). Once we got kindergarten with my oldest, we found out the kids were being taught to memorize a handful of words every week and guess the rest. It doesn’t seem to be teacher specific, either, it is the curriculum!
Since you're now at independent school, are you sure they're still using that curriculum? MCPS and APS are now using CKLA. FCPS is using Benchmark (not as good but still an upgrade over Calkins). Lots of districts just switched for SY 2024-2025 to a new curriculum.
And yes, before they switched plenty of teachers were doing things like getting Orton-Gillingham certified on their own time. Some admin certainly cared because it was good for the kids and encouraged it. Some I think just saw which way the breeze was blowing and became "science of reading" advocates because it was becoming politically popular and would be beneficial to their careers.
If you want more districts to adopt direct instruction in more areas (spelling, grammar, math), you clearly need Emily Hanaford to do a big expose podcast and your local NAACP to get on board with direct instruction as a way to close the equity gap. Or these were the things that worked in FCPS to get phonics sort of into school.
Anonymous
04/11/2025 11:33
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Anonymous wrote:Because parents keep sending these schools money anyway.
This is public school.
Anonymous
04/11/2025 11:33
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Anonymous wrote:Are you talking about in general or just your specific expensive independent school?
Virginia passed a law I think 2 years ago (might have been 3) requiring districts to switch to at least more science-of-reading curricula. It was a broadly popular, cross-political-party bill and basically all northern VA districts have made a switch.
That said, spelling and grammar have not yet been made part of the big "science of reading" push - knowledge for reading comprehension is getting there but even that isn't that great. Broader writing instruction that is direct and explicit hasn't either.
I would love for more generally cognitive science to actually inform how teachers are taught to teach. Based on what I understand, school would probably start looking a lot more like we remember (the "sage on the stage" and lots of practice) and less like it does today.
https://marylandmatters.org/2025/01/02/what-happens-when-a-school-district-commits-to-the-science-of-learning/
I am talking about public school in upper middle to wealthy areas. Why is our school sticking to these methods of teaching reading and writing? I didn’t know enough to actually call different schools to ask about specific curriculum (I did check out school websites and it looked fine. I talked to parents, older people, realtors, neighbors. All raved.). Once we got kindergarten with my oldest, we found out the kids were being taught to memorize a handful of words every week and guess the rest. It doesn’t seem to be teacher specific, either, it is the curriculum!
Anonymous
04/11/2025 11:29
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Are you talking about in general or just your specific expensive independent school?
Virginia passed a law I think 2 years ago (might have been 3) requiring districts to switch to at least more science-of-reading curricula. It was a broadly popular, cross-political-party bill and basically all northern VA districts have made a switch.
That said, spelling and grammar have not yet been made part of the big "science of reading" push - knowledge for reading comprehension is getting there but even that isn't that great. Broader writing instruction that is direct and explicit hasn't either.
I would love for more generally cognitive science to actually inform how teachers are taught to teach. Based on what I understand, school would probably start looking a lot more like we remember (the "sage on the stage" and lots of practice) and less like it does today.
https://marylandmatters.org/2025/01/02/what-happens-when-a-school-district-commits-to-the-science-of-learning/
Virginia passed a law I think 2 years ago (might have been 3) requiring districts to switch to at least more science-of-reading curricula. It was a broadly popular, cross-political-party bill and basically all northern VA districts have made a switch.
That said, spelling and grammar have not yet been made part of the big "science of reading" push - knowledge for reading comprehension is getting there but even that isn't that great. Broader writing instruction that is direct and explicit hasn't either.
I would love for more generally cognitive science to actually inform how teachers are taught to teach. Based on what I understand, school would probably start looking a lot more like we remember (the "sage on the stage" and lots of practice) and less like it does today.
https://marylandmatters.org/2025/01/02/what-happens-when-a-school-district-commits-to-the-science-of-learning/
Anonymous
04/11/2025 11:27
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
Because parents keep sending these schools money anyway.
Anonymous
04/11/2025 11:16
Subject: Why do schools in upper middle class areas stick to debunked literacy curricula?
I am assuming that admin, some teachers, at least SOME people in a given school boundary would know that reading strategies such as cueing have been debunked. It’s been decades and with national news covering it, it seems like there would at least be an awareness on some level.
So why do schools keep this curriculum? The schools I am talking about have enough money to switch. I am frustrated as a parent who, on top of paying a lot for my house in a “top school district” and a ton of property taxes, is now looking at paying tens of thousands per year to send my kid to independent school to learn what I consider to be basics - reading, spelling, grammar.
So why do schools keep this curriculum? The schools I am talking about have enough money to switch. I am frustrated as a parent who, on top of paying a lot for my house in a “top school district” and a ton of property taxes, is now looking at paying tens of thousands per year to send my kid to independent school to learn what I consider to be basics - reading, spelling, grammar.