Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 13:24     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Dh found a pure breed dog he’s interested in buying from Ohio, seems to be from a Mennonite community, and of course they sent lovely pics of the dogs running free in meadows etc.

But is that legit? How does one find a good breeder?


Unfortunately Mennonite community is a HUGE red flag for it being a puppy mill.


+1

Request to visit their facility. The puppies should be in an indoor, humane environment having lots of interactions with humans. They should not leave their mothers until eight weeks at a minimum (ten or twelve is better) and mothers should not be bred more than once a year. If they don't let you visit, that's a red flag as a legitimate breeder wants you to come by their facility.

The breeder should not be breeding multiple generations of dogs together (inbreeding).

If the animals are fearful and skittish - puppy mill. The animals at a legitimate breeder are happy and well-socialized.

If you ask a breeder for references (not other clients because puppy mills often pay people to give good references) and they don't have any, that's a red flag. They should be able to provide a vet reference along with two or three client references. They should also be active members of breed clubs and kennel clubs.

Ohio + Mennonites = Red Flag
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 13:18     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Would they let you meet the mom? Never, ever, ever buy a puppy if you can't meet the mom.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 13:17     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Anonymous wrote:Nope. That community is not known for medically-sound or sensitive breeding practices.

You want to find a breeder that you can visit, OP. Breeders who care for their animals will NEVER ship them out. Those who care also don't want to sell them to just anyone, and will require an in-person visit to check you out. This is what our breeder did. We drove to Pennsylvania and met with her and the litter when the puppies were 5 weeks old. She approved of us, we approved of her and the puppies, and we selected one. Then we went to her home to pick him up at 11 weeks, and visited her home, where she lived with her dam, a couple of other dogs of the same breed, and her dam's litter. No kennels, no volume, in-house training by her, genetic screens, the works! It should be a labor of love, not a cash cow.


Op here. Sorry I had to sign off for awhile. The puppy wouldn’t shipped. We’d have to go get her.

And to answer the above poster, they seemed to have 3 puppies left. Not sure of other breeds bc we aren’t looking for those.

They have papers and a vet screening, but I’m not sure what genetic tests we should ask for




Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 12:38     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Anonymous wrote:A friend’s family are Mennonite dog breeders. They have one female they breed at a time but she has a litter basically every year. The dogs do always seem well cared for, clean, live in their house with them, etc. But I don’t know how good it is to be bred that often. Or maybe that isn’t often for a purebred breeder?


It's good the dogs live with them, that's very important for early socialization. One litter every year is the maximum acceptable for a few years, but not more than 5 years. Ideally, a dam shouldn't be bred more than a 2-3 times in her life.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 12:22     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
A friend’s family are Mennonite dog breeders. They have one female they breed at a time but she has a litter basically every year. The dogs do always seem well cared for, clean, live in their house with them, etc. But I don’t know how good it is to be bred that often. Or maybe that isn’t often for a purebred breeder?
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 12:16     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:How many different puppies do they have available? Are those puppies the same breed or multiple different breeds? Do they have health screenings for the parents?

Generally speaking, Amish or Mennonite breeders think of the dogs the same way they would think about any other kind of farm animal. They aren't going to mistreat them on purpose, but they aren't going to baby it any more than they would a calf. They probably are not that worried about breed standards or genetic issues. They are selling cute puppies for money.


That's a vast, vast understatement about the brutality of these places.


+1

My dog is a puppy mill rescue. She came into rescue with a lot of trauma.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 12:07     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Nope. That community is not known for medically-sound or sensitive breeding practices.

You want to find a breeder that you can visit, OP. Breeders who care for their animals will NEVER ship them out. Those who care also don't want to sell them to just anyone, and will require an in-person visit to check you out. This is what our breeder did. We drove to Pennsylvania and met with her and the litter when the puppies were 5 weeks old. She approved of us, we approved of her and the puppies, and we selected one. Then we went to her home to pick him up at 11 weeks, and visited her home, where she lived with her dam, a couple of other dogs of the same breed, and her dam's litter. No kennels, no volume, in-house training by her, genetic screens, the works! It should be a labor of love, not a cash cow.





Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 12:00     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
https://www.milwaukeemag.com/PuppyHell/

This article is about puppies from Amish and Mennonite community in Wisconsin and describes in graphic detail the extent of the abuse.

Don't do it.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 11:55     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Anonymous wrote:How many different puppies do they have available? Are those puppies the same breed or multiple different breeds? Do they have health screenings for the parents?

Generally speaking, Amish or Mennonite breeders think of the dogs the same way they would think about any other kind of farm animal. They aren't going to mistreat them on purpose, but they aren't going to baby it any more than they would a calf. They probably are not that worried about breed standards or genetic issues. They are selling cute puppies for money.


That's a vast, vast understatement about the brutality of these places.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 11:53     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
How many different puppies do they have available? Are those puppies the same breed or multiple different breeds? Do they have health screenings for the parents?

Generally speaking, Amish or Mennonite breeders think of the dogs the same way they would think about any other kind of farm animal. They aren't going to mistreat them on purpose, but they aren't going to baby it any more than they would a calf. They probably are not that worried about breed standards or genetic issues. They are selling cute puppies for money.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 11:53     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Anonymous wrote:Ask for the medical screenings that are breed required by the AKC. The Mennonite breeders almost never do those and you also don’t really have a sense of how many times they’ve bred the mom. That said they still are better than the old school puppy mills that put dogs in cages and sold them to places st the mall. I know people who have gotten great dogs from those Amish or Mennonite breeders but I think it’s a bit of a crap shoot.


Most of those mall or pet store puppies come from Amish puppy mills.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 11:53     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Dh found a pure breed dog he’s interested in buying from Ohio, seems to be from a Mennonite community, and of course they sent lovely pics of the dogs running free in meadows etc.

But is that legit? How does one find a good breeder?


Unfortunately Mennonite community is a HUGE red flag for it being a puppy mill.

+1
The Mennonite and Amish breeders are usually full-blown puppy mills. You can google around for warnings from multiple rescue groups about them.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 11:49     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Anonymous wrote:Dh found a pure breed dog he’s interested in buying from Ohio, seems to be from a Mennonite community, and of course they sent lovely pics of the dogs running free in meadows etc.

But is that legit? How does one find a good breeder?


Unfortunately Mennonite community is a HUGE red flag for it being a puppy mill.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 11:48     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Ask for the medical screenings that are breed required by the AKC. The Mennonite breeders almost never do those and you also don’t really have a sense of how many times they’ve bred the mom. That said they still are better than the old school puppy mills that put dogs in cages and sold them to places st the mall. I know people who have gotten great dogs from those Amish or Mennonite breeders but I think it’s a bit of a crap shoot.
Anonymous
Post 04/07/2025 11:43     Subject: How do you know if a breeder is really a puppy mill?
Dh found a pure breed dog he’s interested in buying from Ohio, seems to be from a Mennonite community, and of course they sent lovely pics of the dogs running free in meadows etc.

But is that legit? How does one find a good breeder?