Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone have experience with this program? I have a kid who is intrigued by it and would love to hear more.

What's the student's social experience like? Do they get to join clubs, activities at each place? Do they feel part of each commjnity>
How many kids are in it each year? Do they stick together - is this their friend group?
How does housing work at St A's? Is it provided or do they have to find off campus flats?
Can they double major or minor in something else?

Have a kid in the program so will answer questions asked and try to anticipate some:

They have friends that are part of the program and at both schools. Since you have a group going back and forth, you are not going abroad alone. That said, it is in some ways like having two freshman years when you go to the other school sophomore (2nd) year. Over time they feel part of each community, W&M, St Andrews and the JDP. Housing is guaranteed at St. Andrews but some choose to move into rental flats. You cannot double major but you can minor. DC joined clubs at both schools and has had a good social experience maintaining friends at both schools. The number of students in the program varies from year to year and students do drop out of the program for a variety of reasons.

The program has been great for my DC, but it is not for everyone. Two vary distinct learning and grading styles at each school. Kids at university in the UK are adults and treated as such. St, Andrews offers no hand holding or coddling, they have rules and you need to follow them. Very few graded items, usually only two or three per semester per class and you will take 2 or 3 classes per semester depending on major. Not into reading on your own and not into or good at writing papers, then it is going to be a struggle. Grades only count in honors classes (3rd & 4th) years, but do count on W&M GPA, so don't expect to graduate with 3.8 and above.

Kids usually only come home during semester break when at St. Andrews but travel around Europe on fall and spring breaks. It can be rough getting out of class at 3:00PM and having it be dark. Often rainy as well. Like everything in life there are plusses and minuses. DC has gotten a great education, become more independent and resilient and is capable of traveling the world on her own.

If your kid is interested in working in the UK, they get an automatic 2 year work visa as a graduate of a distinguished UK university.

Hope that helps.

My understanding is that this privilege also is granted to graduates of elite US universities as well.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It can be colder and darker than your student expects.

That’s why pubs exist.

Yuck !!!

Pubs are a major negative.

Anonymous wrote:It can be colder and darker than your student expects.

That’s why pubs exist.

My daughter is in the program. She has loved St.A, the housing is on-campus mostly historic residential accommodation with meal service served on the first floor (kind of like Princeton).

She and her group have travelled quite a bit while there and the academics have been challenging but enjoyable.

It can be colder and darker than your student expects.

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone have experience with this program? I have a kid who is intrigued by it and would love to hear more.

What's the student's social experience like? Do they get to join clubs, activities at each place? Do they feel part of each commjnity>
How many kids are in it each year? Do they stick together - is this their friend group?
How does housing work at St A's? Is it provided or do they have to find off campus flats?
Can they double major or minor in something else?

Have a kid in the program so will answer questions asked and try to anticipate some:

They have friends that are part of the program and at both schools. Since you have a group going back and forth, you are not going abroad alone. That said, it is in some ways like having two freshman years when you go to the other school sophomore (2nd) year. Over time they feel part of each community, W&M, St Andrews and the JDP. Housing is guaranteed at St. Andrews but some choose to move into rental flats. You cannot double major but you can minor. DC joined clubs at both schools and has had a good social experience maintaining friends at both schools. The number of students in the program varies from year to year and students do drop out of the program for a variety of reasons.

The program has been great for my DC, but it is not for everyone. Two vary distinct learning and grading styles at each school. Kids at university in the UK are adults and treated as such. St, Andrews offers no hand holding or coddling, they have rules and you need to follow them. Very few graded items, usually only two or three per semester per class and you will take 2 or 3 classes per semester depending on major. Not into reading on your own and not into or good at writing papers, then it is going to be a struggle. Grades only count in honors classes (3rd & 4th) years, but do count on W&M GPA, so don't expect to graduate with 3.8 and above.

Kids usually only come home during semester break when at St. Andrews but travel around Europe on fall and spring breaks. It can be rough getting out of class at 3:00PM and having it be dark. Often rainy as well. Like everything in life there are plusses and minuses. DC has gotten a great education, become more independent and resilient and is capable of traveling the world on her own.

If your kid is interested in working in the UK, they get an automatic 2 year work visa as a graduate of a distinguished UK university.

Hope that helps.

My kid is an IR major at WM and has friends in the program. It has a higher than I would expect drop out rate. I don’t remember the exact percent, but it was decent. Some kids love it and thrive. Some kids get settled on one campus or the other and don’t want to miss two years on that campus, or end up feeling like the just got settled in one place and then it’s time to start over. I think your kid’s personality plays a big role here and they should think carefully about what they want their college experience to be.

My IR major didn’t apply because she wanted a second major in a foreign language, which was not possible. I believe is was also OOS tuition (?) which was a factor, esp since since we are VA prepaid 529. And the program is structured was such that study abroad at not St. Andrews for language immersion wouldn’t be possible, even if she could get the second language.

Academically, it’s apparently a great program with great outcomes. Your kids personality plays just needs to really think about whether going back and forth between the two schools is the college experience they want.

I have a friend with a kid in the program and he loves it. I think the kids mostly hang out together though and it’s hard to do other thi my s at W and M because you are gone two years. The kids in Scotland travel around Europe a ton and I didn’t hear of any issues with housing.

Another friend who went to St A ended up quitting because could not deal with the decreased sunlight in winter. So that’s something to think about and plan for (vitamin D supplements, maybe a seasonal light etc.).

Anonymous wrote:My kid was very interested until she read you cannot get credit for your APs and DE classes with this program. That would’ve been about a year’s worth of credits she cannot use. I told her if it’s something she is really interested in, then the experience might be worth the sacrifice. Something to think about😊

Not a dealbreaker for my kid, we assumed he would not be able to use AP. But good to know, thanks!

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wm.edu/as/undergraduate/more-pathways/standrews/how-this-works/housing/

Good find thank you!

My kid was very interested until she read you cannot get credit for your APs and DE classes with this program. That would’ve been about a year’s worth of credits she cannot use. I told her if it’s something she is really interested in, then the experience might be worth the sacrifice. Something to think about😊

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone have experience with this program? I have a kid who is intrigued by it and would love to hear more.

What's the student's social experience like? Do they get to join clubs, activities at each place? Do they feel part of each commjnity>
How many kids are in it each year? Do they stick together - is this their friend group?
How does housing work at St A's? Is it provided or do they have to find off campus flats?
Can they double major or minor in something else?

I recommend being sure to get a clear answer on this. I was with a St Andrews faculty member a few weeks ago, and he mentioned housing was very challenging.

The info on the website says you cannot double major but “with careful planning” you could take a minor at W&M.

https://www.wm.edu/as/undergraduate/more-pathways/standrews/academic_program/

Does anyone have experience with this program? I have a kid who is intrigued by it and would love to hear more.

What's the student's social experience like? Do they get to join clubs, activities at each place? Do they feel part of each commjnity>
How many kids are in it each year? Do they stick together - is this their friend group?
How does housing work at St A's? Is it provided or do they have to find off campus flats?
Can they double major or minor in something else?