Anonymous
10/16/2024 21:36
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
It’s a law that de facto makes it impossible for gay couples to have children. It’s not progressive. In Italy it was advanced by the far right government.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 21:19
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:In France and Germany by law whoever gives birth is the mother. Even altruistic surrogacy is banned. So if your sister wants to help you out and carry your child for free it still isn't allowed.
They see surrogacy as undignified because a child is not a product or the result of some type of transaction. Surrogacy is treating the child as something fungible not human.
Bravo to these countries.
I definitely agree with this.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 21:16
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
In France and Germany by law whoever gives birth is the mother. Even altruistic surrogacy is banned. So if your sister wants to help you out and carry your child for free it still isn't allowed.
They see surrogacy as undignified because a child is not a product or the result of some type of transaction. Surrogacy is treating the child as something fungible not human.
They see surrogacy as undignified because a child is not a product or the result of some type of transaction. Surrogacy is treating the child as something fungible not human.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 21:13
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
It isn’t really an issue of progressive or not. There is a just a different conception of human dignity and the role of the market in Europe than the US. In their view it infringes human dignity to allow “renting wombs”. Whereas in the US you tend to believe that people should have the right to make money from their body parts if they want to.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 20:57
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Europe is stronger on human rights and this practice is exploitative. This law is preventing people from renting the bodies of poor women in third world countries.
Then they could just prohibit gojng abroad for it. But presumably any woman living in these countries is not so financial desperate because they have minimum wage laws and social welfare safety nets, right? So it’s not quite like going to Bangladesh where a women might not be forced to do it by a male relative or to present starvation. I just think it’s dumb to say that a woman can engage in back breaking labor cleaning toilets on her hands and knees for 7 hours a day (and force her to put her own child in daycare) but the same woman can’t decide that, for the same amount of money, she’d rather sit at home with her toddler and carry someone else’s baby. I personally did not like being pregnant but there are a lot of other jobs that are more dangerous and physically taxing for less pay and that don’t allow you to spend time with your own small children.
Is it too hard to click the link? The title of the article is “Italy bans couples from travelling abroad for surrogacy”
Anonymous
10/16/2024 20:18
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:Europe is stronger on human rights and this practice is exploitative. This law is preventing people from renting the bodies of poor women in third world countries.
Expectations of a decent quality of life during one's life.
Anti-capital punishment.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 20:14
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c62rmv63069o
At the bottom of this article it mentions that “all forms of surrogacy” are banned in Italy, France, Germany, and Spain. This really surprises me that Western European countries, that are typically rather progressive, at least compared to the U.S. would have this type of policy.
Did you know that they also ban abortion in the third trimester?
Germany and France ban elective abortions at 12 and 14 weeks.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 19:45
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c62rmv63069o
At the bottom of this article it mentions that “all forms of surrogacy” are banned in Italy, France, Germany, and Spain. This really surprises me that Western European countries, that are typically rather progressive, at least compared to the U.S. would have this type of policy.
I would disagree that those countries are progressive compared to the US. They are merely socialist.
This hurts couples with infertility, not just same sex couples. I know a woman who was a surrogate several times. The idea of her being exploited makes me laugh.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 19:37
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c62rmv63069o
At the bottom of this article it mentions that “all forms of surrogacy” are banned in Italy, France, Germany, and Spain. This really surprises me that Western European countries, that are typically rather progressive, at least compared to the U.S. would have this type of policy.
Did you know that they also ban abortion in the third trimester?
Just a bunch of backward, ignorant hicks.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 19:10
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:Europe is stronger on human rights and this practice is exploitative. This law is preventing people from renting the bodies of poor women in third world countries.
Then they could just prohibit gojng abroad for it. But presumably any woman living in these countries is not so financial desperate because they have minimum wage laws and social welfare safety nets, right? So it’s not quite like going to Bangladesh where a women might not be forced to do it by a male relative or to present starvation. I just think it’s dumb to say that a woman can engage in back breaking labor cleaning toilets on her hands and knees for 7 hours a day (and force her to put her own child in daycare) but the same woman can’t decide that, for the same amount of money, she’d rather sit at home with her toddler and carry someone else’s baby. I personally did not like being pregnant but there are a lot of other jobs that are more dangerous and physically taxing for less pay and that don’t allow you to spend time with your own small children.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 18:55
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:Europe is stronger on human rights and this practice is exploitative. This law is preventing people from renting the bodies of poor women in third world countries.
Agreed.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 18:55
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Yes, Spain bans surrogacy on the basis that it is exploitative for women and therefore women must be protected from exploitation of their bodies by making it illegal. Also if you use donor elements for reproduction, the doctor selects the donor, the intended parents cannot decide.
What does this mean? Rich Spaniards go to the US or other places to do surrogacy while poor Spaniards are out of luck and must accept their place in the world as childless peasants. There are no exceptions--not even if you're doing it for a family member, or completely altruistically for a stranger.
What does this mean? Rich Spaniards go to the US or other places to do surrogacy while poor Spaniards are out of luck and must accept their place in the world as childless peasants. There are no exceptions--not even if you're doing it for a family member, or completely altruistically for a stranger.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 18:46
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Europe is stronger on human rights and this practice is exploitative. This law is preventing people from renting the bodies of poor women in third world countries.
Anonymous
10/16/2024 18:42
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
Anonymous wrote:https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c62rmv63069o
At the bottom of this article it mentions that “all forms of surrogacy” are banned in Italy, France, Germany, and Spain. This really surprises me that Western European countries, that are typically rather progressive, at least compared to the U.S. would have this type of policy.
Did you know that they also ban abortion in the third trimester?
Anonymous
10/16/2024 18:36
Subject: Italy, France, Germany, and Spain outlaw surrogacy?
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c62rmv63069o
At the bottom of this article it mentions that “all forms of surrogacy” are banned in Italy, France, Germany, and Spain. This really surprises me that Western European countries, that are typically rather progressive, at least compared to the U.S. would have this type of policy.
At the bottom of this article it mentions that “all forms of surrogacy” are banned in Italy, France, Germany, and Spain. This really surprises me that Western European countries, that are typically rather progressive, at least compared to the U.S. would have this type of policy.