Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can anyone give me straight numbers (MAPs, grades, MCAPs?) on what the cutoffs are for entry into the lottery for the middle school magnet programs? Naturally the MCPS website for these programs are not the easiest to navigate to a clear answer. Thanks.

The information is all public if you know where to look. Basically, you need to be in the top 15% at your school. The cutoffs are based on school SES, so it may be 95%+ for a low-farm school to 60% at a high-farm school. It's still a lottery so getting into the pool is just part of the equation and the other part is random.

We are in the lowest FARMS category and last year our DC got into the TPMS pool with a 96% in MAP-M but kids with scores just 1-2 points lower did not. So then cutoff was clearly right at her score.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

OP, ignore this. It’s not true. They say that they take these things into account but in no way have they confirmed a specific lower percentile and I know several people with kids with IEPs and 504 plans who were well about 85th percentile nationally and didn’t get in the pool (assuming that 85th is way above 70th locally in a medium poverty school)

That contradicts what I read from the MCCPTA folks.

People who guess? No one with scores that low is in the magnet. I’ve had two kids there and they both consistently report that their own 99th percentile scores are “low” compared to other kids.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

OP, ignore this. It’s not true. They say that they take these things into account but in no way have they confirmed a specific lower percentile and I know several people with kids with IEPs and 504 plans who were well about 85th percentile nationally and didn’t get in the pool (assuming that 85th is way above 70th locally in a medium poverty school)

There was a discussion about the lower cutoff for those receiving services just a short while back:

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/15/1178989.page#26604725

This presentation to the BOE shows that the adjustment for the CES magnet lottery pool is to 70%.

https://www2.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/siteassets/district/boe/meetings/memorandum/09/uploadedfiles/boe/meetings/memorandum/230119-ap-capstone-magnet-prog-12-06-2022-01-c-d-e-bd.pdf

The slides also show MS criteria-based magmet lottery pools are shown to be constructed in essentially the same exact way (As, reading level, 85th %ile locally normed for MAP). They say a lower threshold is used.

That lower threshold for MS magnets is not specified in the presentation as it it with CES. But the parallels are so direct as to make 70th a very reasonable guess. Until MCPS opens up and specifies something else, that is.

The usual reply to this from posters disputing this, here, is, nearly literally, "No, it's not," with nothing supporting that point of view.

Happy to be shown something different -- I have no intention, here, besides making the information available to the best of my understanding.

Your guess is a guess. It’s not even a likely guess. Next time you present data as fact when it’s actually a guess please make clear that it’s a guess.

I have direct experience in it not being accurate based on who does and does not get selected, so I know your guess is wrong, but go ahead and make that guess so long as you explain it is one.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

OP, ignore this. It’s not true. They say that they take these things into account but in no way have they confirmed a specific lower percentile and I know several people with kids with IEPs and 504 plans who were well about 85th percentile nationally and didn’t get in the pool (assuming that 85th is way above 70th locally in a medium poverty school)

That contradicts what I read from the MCCPTA folks.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

OP, ignore this. It’s not true. They say that they take these things into account but in no way have they confirmed a specific lower percentile and I know several people with kids with IEPs and 504 plans who were well about 85th percentile nationally and didn’t get in the pool (assuming that 85th is way above 70th locally in a medium poverty school)

+1 Same. DC's friend with a 504 with 90th or higher percentile scores at DC's school was not in the pool. DC was in the pool but has 99th percentile scores so we have no idea of the cut off. Low poverty school.

That sounds like grounds for an appeal since they would be in the pool based on all the information that was released through foira.

Anonymous wrote:Can anyone give me straight numbers (MAPs, grades, MCAPs?) on what the cutoffs are for entry into the lottery for the middle school magnet programs? Naturally the MCPS website for these programs are not the easiest to navigate to a clear answer. Thanks.

The information is all public if you know where to look. Basically, you need to be in the top 15% at your school. The cutoffs are based on school SES, so it may be 95%+ for a low-farm school to 60% at a high-farm school. It's still a lottery so getting into the pool is just part of the equation and the other part is random.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

OP, ignore this. It’s not true. They say that they take these things into account but in no way have they confirmed a specific lower percentile and I know several people with kids with IEPs and 504 plans who were well about 85th percentile nationally and didn’t get in the pool (assuming that 85th is way above 70th locally in a medium poverty school)

+1 Same. DC's friend with a 504 with 90th or higher percentile scores at DC's school was not in the pool. DC was in the pool but has 99th percentile scores so we have no idea of the cut off. Low poverty school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

OP, ignore this. It’s not true. They say that they take these things into account but in no way have they confirmed a specific lower percentile and I know several people with kids with IEPs and 504 plans who were well about 85th percentile nationally and didn’t get in the pool (assuming that 85th is way above 70th locally in a medium poverty school)

That doesn't sound like a safe assumption to me.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

OP, ignore this. It’s not true. They say that they take these things into account but in no way have they confirmed a specific lower percentile and I know several people with kids with IEPs and 504 plans who were well about 85th percentile nationally and didn’t get in the pool (assuming that 85th is way above 70th locally in a medium poverty school)

There was a discussion about the lower cutoff for those receiving services just a short while back:

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/15/1178989.page#26604725

This presentation to the BOE shows that the adjustment for the CES magnet lottery pool is to 70%.

https://www2.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/siteassets/district/boe/meetings/memorandum/09/uploadedfiles/boe/meetings/memorandum/230119-ap-capstone-magnet-prog-12-06-2022-01-c-d-e-bd.pdf

The slides also show MS criteria-based magmet lottery pools are shown to be constructed in essentially the same exact way (As, reading level, 85th %ile locally normed for MAP). They say a lower threshold is used.

That lower threshold for MS magnets is not specified in the presentation as it it with CES. But the parallels are so direct as to make 70th a very reasonable guess. Until MCPS opens up and specifies something else, that is.

The usual reply to this from posters disputing this, here, is, nearly literally, "No, it's not," with nothing supporting that point of view.

Happy to be shown something different -- I have no intention, here, besides making the information available to the best of my understanding.

Anonymous wrote:Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

OP, ignore this. It’s not true. They say that they take these things into account but in no way have they confirmed a specific lower percentile and I know several people with kids with IEPs and 504 plans who were well about 85th percentile nationally and didn’t get in the pool (assuming that 85th is way above 70th locally in a medium poverty school)

Students receiving certain services (FARMS, EML/ESOL, 504, IEP) have had an allowance to qualify with what appears to be a 70th percentile locally normed MAP score instead of 85th.

No, nobody actually can. Grades have to be As in 1st quarter 5th grade. MCAP isn’t used. MAP score varies based on what school you go to. If you are at a wealthier school you need a much higher MAP score than if your school is high FARMS. You can contact the office of AEI and they can tell you what score your child would’ve needed to get in the pool from your school this year (changes year to year), but other children at other schools needed different scores to get in the lottery pool.

Meant to include the link:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CD-zDANEJAR5X-g5pMijtx9sCd4JS1IGPEB1VL-0-9Y/preview

This says its for last year but the FAQ answer your questions.

What data will be used to review Grade 5 students for needing enriched services in middle school?

The process uses a multiple measures approach that includes Grade 5 report cards, locally-normed percentile ranks for the fall 2022 Measures of Adequate Progress in Reading and Mathematics (MAP-R and MAP-M), instructional reading level and student services including: special education services, EML- Emergent Multilingual Learner, Section 504 accommodations plan and Free and Reduced-priced Meals. The math, science and computer science program will use the MAP-M, science and math report card grades; and the humanities and communication program will use the MAP-R along with the reading and writing grades.

Students who meet various academic criteria will receive enriched services in middle school. To receive enriched services for humanities and be placed in the humanities and communication lottery pool, Grade 5 students need to demonstrate an A in both reading and writing, above reading grade level on the marking period 1 report card from Grade 5, and a locally normed minimum of 85th percentile on this year’s (fall) MAP-R. For math, science or computer science, an A in both math and science and an indication of on level or higher for reading on the marking period 1 report card from Grade 5 and a locally normed minimum of 85th percentile on this year’s (fall) MAP-M.

What are locally normed scores?

Gifted and talented experts recommend the use of local norms of assessment scores as an equitable approach to ensure equity and access in identification of students for program access. Additionally, the current draft of Gifted and Talented Definitions from the Maryland State Department of Education includes the use of local norms as part of the gifted and talented identification process. MCPS locally normed scores are designed to examine test takers in relation to one another within MCPS. As part of the middle school magnet identification process, scores obtained on the MAP assessment were locally normed. The socioeconomic status of elementary schools will be used to establish local norms for the MAP R. In establishing local norms, students in schools with similar FARMS rates were grouped together for comparison.

Can anyone give me straight numbers (MAPs, grades, MCAPs?) on what the cutoffs are for entry into the lottery for the middle school magnet programs? Naturally the MCPS website for these programs are not the easiest to navigate to a clear answer. Thanks.