Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op again. So basically, other than that children's diagnosis on that doctor's letterhead recommending follow up's that was sent to our pediatrician, we have no other proof that DC was suspected to have autism. We didn't want to believe it and were getting services anyways so it is not on official records. DC has shown lots of improvement since then, except for being slow in everything. DC works very hard (used to be distracted before but now very focused yet DC is slow).

Given the IQ scores above, does this being slow seem like a disability?

Was the autism diagnosis given on the basis of ADOS?

Is ADOS the in person observation? She observed my kid playing 2 times for maybe 30 min and then wrote down the diagnosis. We thought it was a bunch of crock and hence why we never went back.

DC had good eye contact then and now too. But DC gets anxious a lot, hardly opens mouth to speak (very quiet generally, always second guesses if they are saying the right thing in response and doesn't initiate conversations unless it is with friends and family). In group settings like sleep overs with friends, DC is always the quietest person.

Anonymous wrote:Op again. So basically, other than that children's diagnosis on that doctor's letterhead recommending follow up's that was sent to our pediatrician, we have no other proof that DC was suspected to have autism. We didn't want to believe it and were getting services anyways so it is not on official records. DC has shown lots of improvement since then, except for being slow in everything. DC works very hard (used to be distracted before but now very focused yet DC is slow).

Given the IQ scores above, does this being slow seem like a disability?

Was the autism diagnosis given on the basis of ADOS?

Op again. So basically, other than that children's diagnosis on that doctor's letterhead recommending follow up's that was sent to our pediatrician, we have no other proof that DC was suspected to have autism. We didn't want to believe it and were getting services anyways so it is not on official records. DC has shown lots of improvement since then, except for being slow in everything. DC works very hard (used to be distracted before but now very focused yet DC is slow).

Given the IQ scores above, does this being slow seem like a disability?

Op again.

I just checked the other document they sent and the tests they did was called:

Woodcock Johnson IV
QRI-6

They tested DC for reading, math, written expression.

Anonymous wrote:This is the problem with the "significant discrepancies model" of qualification for IEP. Your school is essentially saying that DC is performing at a level above her predicted ability by IQ. Is there a significant difference between any of the 4 IQ subcomponents? If, so it is inappropriate to use the composite IQ to judge ability. (Sometimes schools will use composite or average scores in ability and/or achievement in order to hide discrepant subscores that would otherwise be qualifying.)

But, I am concerned that the school is using bare minimum "data" to do so. It sounds like she has not had a full evaluation - neither in school nor privately - because you mention IQ and 1 norm. A full assessment would involve IQ, full achievement testing in all academic areas - reading & math & writing, spelling & oral language standardized normed tests reported with scores and percentiles as well as tests like the Ray-Ostereith and CTOPP or some other assessment of rapid baming.

I am also concerned that the school itself acknowledges that DC has a "time
management" problem - that is a classic flag for attention and executive function issues, so teacher & parents should have been asked to fill out an ADHD questionnaire (Connors or Vanderbilt) and the BRIEF (questionnaire about executive functioning). If you shared that DC was at one point identified as ASD by a Dr. the school should also be administering all those tests.

You also note other "adverse impacts on education - need for extra time, need yo have assignments repeated multiple times, etc. That is the second prong of the IEP test. First is qualifying disorder but it sounds to me like school has done inadequate assessment to consider all possible disorders (thus failing their legal Child Find obligation.)

What did the IQ show - can you provide the verbal, perceptual, working memory and processing speed? What achievement testing was done? Were any attention or ASD assessments done?

This is all new to me, but I just checked the report from psychologist and this is what the scores say:

FSIQ - 93 (32 PERCENTILE)

VCI - 100 (50 PERCENTILE)

VSI - SS-92, 30 PERCENTILE
FRI- SS -88, 21 PERCENTILE
WMI - SS-91, 27 PERCENTILE
PSI - SS-86, 18 PERCENTILE

At age 7, pediatrician also didn't think DC was autistic and we never went back to follow up on this since we had an IEP going into K since we came from I&T and then PEP

Anonymous wrote:The services you mentioned that you think your child needs are all actually accommodations that can be provided under a 504 plan.

Can a 504 plan be instated without any SLD or other diagnosis.

Anonymous wrote:Do a private eval. MCPS evaluated DS for LD when he was in 2nd after turning me down many times and then found no issues. We followed up with a private eval. It found a very severe LD that it’s hard to believe the school missed. Clearly they didn’t want to find anything. I will never trust MCPS again. A private report should be enough for a 504.

I'm curious what kind of eval you did? What services does your DC get now? What was the LD?

Anonymous wrote:How old is your child? Aside from needing extra time, what signs of disability are you seeing? Kids of all IQs can have disabilities, so I don't understand what they mean by his IQ was too high to qualify. But at the same time, accommodations are only available for students with disabilities and you haven't given us enough information to evaluate (other than an autism diagnosis, which absolutely counts if you think it's correct).

Child will be going to MS next year. They didn't say IQ is high, they implied that DC's scoring in tests is what is expected of DC's IQ which is in 30+ percentile. What I got from the meeting was my kid has an average IQ and meets the benchmark so does not qualify for learning disability.

What I see at home - takes twice the time as sibling for similar tasks, generally low processing speed, needs repetitive instructions, needs very detailed specific instructions.

Although we had a diagnosis from Childrens when DC was 2 we did not want that to be on any records thinking it will impact DC and that doc gave the diagnosis in second visit. We also didn't believe DC has autism. Later our pediatrician also didn't think it was autism. We never mentioned that to I&T so it was never on mcps school records.

The services you mentioned that you think your child needs are all actually accommodations that can be provided under a 504 plan.

This is the problem with the "significant discrepancies model" of qualification for IEP. Your school is essentially saying that DC is performing at a level above her predicted ability by IQ. Is there a significant difference between any of the 4 IQ subcomponents? If, so it is inappropriate to use the composite IQ to judge ability. (Sometimes schools will use composite or average scores in ability and/or achievement in order to hide discrepant subscores that would otherwise be qualifying.)

But, I am concerned that the school is using bare minimum "data" to do so. It sounds like she has not had a full evaluation - neither in school nor privately - because you mention IQ and 1 norm. A full assessment would involve IQ, full achievement testing in all academic areas - reading & math & writing, spelling & oral language standardized normed tests reported with scores and percentiles as well as tests like the Ray-Ostereith and CTOPP or some other assessment of rapid baming.

I am also concerned that the school itself acknowledges that DC has a "time
management" problem - that is a classic flag for attention and executive function issues, so teacher & parents should have been asked to fill out an ADHD questionnaire (Connors or Vanderbilt) and the BRIEF (questionnaire about executive functioning). If you shared that DC was at one point identified as ASD by a Dr. the school should also be administering all those tests.

You also note other "adverse impacts on education - need for extra time, need yo have assignments repeated multiple times, etc. That is the second prong of the IEP test. First is qualifying disorder but it sounds to me like school has done inadequate assessment to consider all possible disorders (thus failing their legal Child Find obligation.)

What did the IQ show - can you provide the verbal, perceptual, working memory and processing speed? What achievement testing was done? Were any attention or ASD assessments done?

How old is your child? Aside from needing extra time, what signs of disability are you seeing? Kids of all IQs can have disabilities, so I don't understand what they mean by his IQ was too high to qualify. But at the same time, accommodations are only available for students with disabilities and you haven't given us enough information to evaluate (other than an autism diagnosis, which absolutely counts if you think it's correct).

Do a private eval. MCPS evaluated DS for LD when he was in 2nd after turning me down many times and then found no issues. We followed up with a private eval. It found a very severe LD that it’s hard to believe the school missed. Clearly they didn’t want to find anything. I will never trust MCPS again. A private report should be enough for a 504.

You mention that y out are looking for extra time. Just a warning. Extra time on tests is one thing. Extra time for assignments often results in disaster because everything still has a drop dead due date and instead of keeping up, extra time often results in everything being due at the end and a crisis for the kid.

You can do a fast evaluation with a place like Stixrud. It won't be as thorough as KKI or Children's but it will validate his math weakness and need for extra time. They can get you in usually in a couple of weeks. It will be enough for a 504.

Back story - Our kid has been with I&T, PEP Classic and has had an IEP up to now. No evaluation in past few years and no official diagnosis (unless you consider a developmental pediatrician saying DC has autism at 2 years of age). At that point we did not believe that but accepted DC has delays. DC started out with speech and OT, did not speak until after 2 years of age, used to climb tables at that age and lined up shoes etc but had good eye contact. When DC was in preschool we noticed that simple Math was difficult and this continued through K, 1st and even now.

Covid meant no formal evaluation but this year we got the school evaluation. We were told that DC does not qualify for services anymore because DC meets the benchmarks. IQ evaluation they did shows DC at 32nd percentile and they concluded based on Wechsler(sp??) and another norm, that DC does not meet the criteria for disability services. DC is getting As in report cards but was at 55th percentile last year and 69th this last MAP test.

I understand where they are coming from when they say DC needs to learn time management and that a 504 is not possible given that DC does not qualify for disability criteria according to their assessment (Principal actually thought of that but since DC does not meet disability criteria, it cannot be provided now).

I do realize that DC cannot always depend on extra time and needs to prioritize things and this is also with life in general, not just academics and taking away the crutch now may be better than later. But I am very worried as DC will be attending MS next year.

When I spoke with DC, DC feels that having extra time would help. DC also needs to write down stuff to understand, and questions should be repeated a few times for DC to actually get it. DC has a wonderful caring teacher this year who genuinely cares about DC and helps DC when they need anything. But we cannot be guaranteed good teachers like her all the time and that is when some formal accommodation might be helpful. She has promised to wean out DC by year end with slowly cutting the extra time DC gets now. I'm just worried what will happen in middle school though if DC does not get the time management right. DC is anxious by nature and gets stressed out if assignments are not completed.

Now my question is - is whatever the school evaluated enough? Do I need to ask for an independent assessment? My spouse happily agreed for DC's release from IEP but I know how DC struggles with simple Math. DC also takes a long time for any task at home. For example, if sibling takes 20 minutes to get ready in morning, DC takes 40 minutes. Little things like that. But based on their assessment DC's IQ is low and this is not a disability.

We have never done a neuropsych eval. Will doing any of that help? School says that if we see DC failing we can always have DC re-evaluated by school. Can this be done easily if DC is in MS?

I want to rejoice that if DC is released from IEP, that means DC is doing just fine, but I am unable to. I know of people in my school lawyering up and eventually getting services but we have never had to do that since we came through I&T. The school system has treated us fairly so far, so I am not sure what to do. Do I just accept this and move on and work with DC at home?

Also, how long does county maintain records - in case it needs to be revisited at any point?