Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:46
Subject: Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
It’s not about the money. There are high stress, tiring, low paying jobs that should count as much as a spouse who has a high paying low stress job. If I were a medical resident and bringing in $70K but working 100 hours a week, and DH was in finance working 9-5 and making $350x I would divorce him if he told me that I had to put in longer hours at home because I made a fifth of his earnings.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:45
Subject: Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Quit obsessing over fairness. Everyone always thinks they do more than their share and their spouse does less.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:36
Subject: Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
I don’t agree that money is irrelevant. It should not determine everything, but it is one consideration.
The problem you have is that your total hours worked are incompatible with having children and no nanny.
Something has to give.
We earned about the same and had a nanny that worked 3 to 6 every day. We needed to pay more to get someone to work those hours but it was worth it.
I would add you are both working long hours for the pay you are getting.
The problem you have is that your total hours worked are incompatible with having children and no nanny.
Something has to give.
We earned about the same and had a nanny that worked 3 to 6 every day. We needed to pay more to get someone to work those hours but it was worth it.
I would add you are both working long hours for the pay you are getting.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:35
Subject: Re:Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
On weeknights, can you compromise by prepping something simple the night before and have him finish it off? Our schedule is crazy right now, and my 3 young teens do this for me all the time. My DH works very late. If my 13yo DS can manage it, a full grown man should be able to.
For example, I’ll make a 9x13 of baked penne the night before (fairly mindless), cover and put in fridge. I’ll leave baking instructions for the kids (time temp and what time to put in) and then just serve with bagged salad. Or even prep/season chicken the night before and same thing- leave baking instructions, trying to time it to be done 15min after I get home (leaving me time to make quick sides). This would work with a lot of oven meals. Or I might prep/chop season a meat/veg stir fry the night before, and have one of the kids put rice in the rice cooker at x time. Teen DD can easily cook the stir fry in the wok (doesn’t take long) or Ill do it when I get home. Sheet pan meals (fajitas etc) can be prepped the night before and put it in freezer sized ziplocks- dump on a sheet pan and put in oven, pull out tortillas and condiments from fridge and voila. If I have nothing prepped, I’ll call one of the kids and have them dump a bag of frozen meatballs and a jar of sauce in the slow cooker to warm, and then just make the pasta when I get home. Things like that. I’m sure if you brainstorm you could come up with some ideas that would work. Surely your DH can spare 5-10min from his desk to go throw something in the oven. You could also straight up just prep dinner (all the way through) the night before and have him just reheat while you are on your way home. Not a fan of most slow cooker meals but a few are ok- that could work also.
And obviously DH should be doing 50% of the cooking on weekends. Ridiculous that he does not. Mine did, even when the kids were small and I was a SAHM. It is a joint responsibility on weekends at minimum.
For example, I’ll make a 9x13 of baked penne the night before (fairly mindless), cover and put in fridge. I’ll leave baking instructions for the kids (time temp and what time to put in) and then just serve with bagged salad. Or even prep/season chicken the night before and same thing- leave baking instructions, trying to time it to be done 15min after I get home (leaving me time to make quick sides). This would work with a lot of oven meals. Or I might prep/chop season a meat/veg stir fry the night before, and have one of the kids put rice in the rice cooker at x time. Teen DD can easily cook the stir fry in the wok (doesn’t take long) or Ill do it when I get home. Sheet pan meals (fajitas etc) can be prepped the night before and put it in freezer sized ziplocks- dump on a sheet pan and put in oven, pull out tortillas and condiments from fridge and voila. If I have nothing prepped, I’ll call one of the kids and have them dump a bag of frozen meatballs and a jar of sauce in the slow cooker to warm, and then just make the pasta when I get home. Things like that. I’m sure if you brainstorm you could come up with some ideas that would work. Surely your DH can spare 5-10min from his desk to go throw something in the oven. You could also straight up just prep dinner (all the way through) the night before and have him just reheat while you are on your way home. Not a fan of most slow cooker meals but a few are ok- that could work also.
And obviously DH should be doing 50% of the cooking on weekends. Ridiculous that he does not. Mine did, even when the kids were small and I was a SAHM. It is a joint responsibility on weekends at minimum.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:28
Subject: Re:Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You’re having a discussion with someone who talks to his spouse about how much she earns in relation to their partnership as parents? WTH is wrong with him? Shut that nonsense down.
This isn’t a YOU problem, it’s a WE problem. You both have to sit down and figure this out. Maybe you trade off days for meal/pickup. Maybe you invest in a meal prep service. Maybe you each adjust your schedules. Maybe he’s in charge of Saturday dinner and you’re in charge of Sunday dinner and then you alternate each weekend.
All I know is that the salary each person makes has to be taken off the table. It’s getting in the way of a reasonable but challenging discussion about parenting and household responsibilities.
As a last result, you can get a copy of the Fair Play book. That has been recommended here and would be helpful in your situation.
Agree mostly with this, and have also done the Fair Play cards and thought it was useful. That said, I make 4x what my DH makes and that definitely enters into the equation somewhat.
Can you make up the missing hours after kids go to bed? That’s what I do. Something has to give and for me it’s personal time, of which I have basically zero during the week.
And that's totally unfair to you. He should do way more of the household stuff if you earn 4x the income. More like he should be doing 75% minimum if not everything. Obviously there may be some logistical issues and you have to pitch in now and then or maybe certain things you actually enjoy doing and have time for do you should get to decide what those things are. It should be entirely up to you as a first approximation but for example maybe you have more time on weekends or maybe you enjoy some stuff involving the kids. But pretty much all the drudgery type stuff should be his to do. If you like to cook maybe you can do some of the meals when you have time for it
You not having any personal time is absurd and unhealthy, and not fair.
It's not just about how many hours someone puts in. It's about how much value is actually being contributed. Doesn't change depending on genders.
The people who say the money doesn't matter are being absurd because that's a direct measure of value being contributed to the family. If my wife earned 4x my income I would HAPPILY try to do as much as possible chore wise to make her life easier I certainly wouldn't insist on a 50/50 split that'd ridiculous.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:26
Subject: Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Sounds like he has a 50hr a week job, and you have a 45hr a week job?
Although practically, it doesn’t matter what DCUM thinks - if your husband isn’t going to step up, he isn’t going to.
Do you both have the same rest/off duty (childcare, household work, paid work) time off?
I’d say lower your expectations - make dinner prep easier, get a housecleaning service, have enough underwear etc for 2 weeks. It’ll get a little easier when your kids are older and don’t need the oversight they do now, but then activities will start.
Time shift your work if you can - a few days a week at 6:30, you catch-up on work for a few hours.
I’ve always made more than my husband and always did more around the house - including childcare - because my job has been more flexible. But we also stopped with one kid, and I have very low standards for what constitutes meal prep - a lot of easy meals, prepared food, and takeout. We also have a house cleaner every two weeks.
The other thing to keep in mind is your husband may not really like his job - even the less intense one, and is somewhat resentful that you are able to take on a ‘passion’ job because he’s working a job you decided you didn’t like. Can he get a 45hr a week job that pays $100K that he loves? Will that free up more time for him to take on more household responsibility?
Although practically, it doesn’t matter what DCUM thinks - if your husband isn’t going to step up, he isn’t going to.
Do you both have the same rest/off duty (childcare, household work, paid work) time off?
I’d say lower your expectations - make dinner prep easier, get a housecleaning service, have enough underwear etc for 2 weeks. It’ll get a little easier when your kids are older and don’t need the oversight they do now, but then activities will start.
Time shift your work if you can - a few days a week at 6:30, you catch-up on work for a few hours.
I’ve always made more than my husband and always did more around the house - including childcare - because my job has been more flexible. But we also stopped with one kid, and I have very low standards for what constitutes meal prep - a lot of easy meals, prepared food, and takeout. We also have a house cleaner every two weeks.
The other thing to keep in mind is your husband may not really like his job - even the less intense one, and is somewhat resentful that you are able to take on a ‘passion’ job because he’s working a job you decided you didn’t like. Can he get a 45hr a week job that pays $100K that he loves? Will that free up more time for him to take on more household responsibility?
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:17
Subject: Re:Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Anonymous wrote:If my husband expected me to do more child raising, cooking, cleaning, shopping, etc. even though we both work full-time just because he made more, I would lean into and quit. Now you make infinitely more, honey, and I actually have time to do literally everything else for our family. Win win.
Or he could divorce you and he would be totally better off.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:14
Subject: Re:Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You’re having a discussion with someone who talks to his spouse about how much she earns in relation to their partnership as parents? WTH is wrong with him? Shut that nonsense down.
This isn’t a YOU problem, it’s a WE problem. You both have to sit down and figure this out. Maybe you trade off days for meal/pickup. Maybe you invest in a meal prep service. Maybe you each adjust your schedules. Maybe he’s in charge of Saturday dinner and you’re in charge of Sunday dinner and then you alternate each weekend.
All I know is that the salary each person makes has to be taken off the table. It’s getting in the way of a reasonable but challenging discussion about parenting and household responsibilities.
As a last result, you can get a copy of the Fair Play book. That has been recommended here and would be helpful in your situation.
Agree mostly with this, and have also done the Fair Play cards and thought it was useful. That said, I make 4x what my DH makes and that definitely enters into the equation somewhat.
Can you make up the missing hours after kids go to bed? That’s what I do. Something has to give and for me it’s personal time, of which I have basically zero during the week.
Stop making it about money. I’m a public school principal. I work 65+ hour weeks. I will never make as much money as a spouse who, say, works in finance. But we’re both working just as hard.
This is about a partnership. When you reduce each partner’s contribution to the care of children and the house by dollars made, something’s wrong.
If it's not about money than OP should sign a post nup in which whatever money they have saved until now all goes to her spouse. He can use some of his money to pay for hired help for his 50% of the chores.
Going forward, since it's not about money, all household expenses should be split 50/50 and he can bank as his own money any extra leftover from his income, less any amount he needs to pay to outsource his 50% of the chores. She can do the same. If her half of income isn't enough to pay her half of the household expenses, she can sign a promissory not to him as a loan. If need be she will need to quit her dream job and get a higher paying job.
Is that fair enough for you?
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:14
Subject: Re:Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
If my husband expected me to do more child raising, cooking, cleaning, shopping, etc. even though we both work full-time just because he made more, I would lean into and quit. Now you make infinitely more, honey, and I actually have time to do literally everything else for our family. Win win.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:07
Subject: Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Anonymous wrote:For most of our marriage, I've had flexible low-paying jobs or freelanced, while DH worked an intense finance job, making 300-500k. (I started in finance too, but I didn't like it and I thought our life would be easier if one person had more flexibility, so I changed fields). So I was responsible for most of the house (and kids, when they came along). He did bills, taxes, car maintenance, and took out the trash. Sometimes he'd help clean up or run an errand. This worked for us and felt fair.
Recently, we both made major job changes. He was burning out and took a less intense job. He now makes 200k and works 9:00-6:30 (from home), plus 6 or so hours on evenings and weekends. I found an opportunity I love that's semi-intense. It pays 100k and I need to work like 45 hours/week.
He picked up a bit more at home, but I still do the lion's share. I can barely fit in 40 hours with all the responsibilities at home.
I am really struggling and dropping the ball both at work and at home. Probably the hardest part is meal prep - I run out without finishing my work to get the kids from aftercare and daycare, I get home and they're hungry and want attention, and there's nothing to eat. Repeat every single day. On the weekend, if we don't have plans to go out, I'm the default person to think of and prep a meal too.
We can't afford a nanny, esp one who will cook. I would like to split the workload more equally with DH. For example, have him stop at 5 and do the pickups and watch kids while I cook dinner, or vice versa. DH says that's too much for him. Since I still make half what he does, he thinks it's fair and it's just the price I pay for following my passion rather than taking a job that's either part-time or higher paying. Of course if I had a higher paying or part-time job, this problem would disappear, but I am working at my dream job and don't want to give it up.
I need an outside perspective. What is fair here?
He is right. You are wrong.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:07
Subject: Re:Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Anonymous wrote:Anonymous wrote:You’re having a discussion with someone who talks to his spouse about how much she earns in relation to their partnership as parents? WTH is wrong with him? Shut that nonsense down.
This isn’t a YOU problem, it’s a WE problem. You both have to sit down and figure this out. Maybe you trade off days for meal/pickup. Maybe you invest in a meal prep service. Maybe you each adjust your schedules. Maybe he’s in charge of Saturday dinner and you’re in charge of Sunday dinner and then you alternate each weekend.
All I know is that the salary each person makes has to be taken off the table. It’s getting in the way of a reasonable but challenging discussion about parenting and household responsibilities.
As a last result, you can get a copy of the Fair Play book. That has been recommended here and would be helpful in your situation.
Agree mostly with this, and have also done the Fair Play cards and thought it was useful. That said, I make 4x what my DH makes and that definitely enters into the equation somewhat.
Can you make up the missing hours after kids go to bed? That’s what I do. Something has to give and for me it’s personal time, of which I have basically zero during the week.
Stop making it about money. I’m a public school principal. I work 65+ hour weeks. I will never make as much money as a spouse who, say, works in finance. But we’re both working just as hard.
This is about a partnership. When you reduce each partner’s contribution to the care of children and the house by dollars made, something’s wrong.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 12:02
Subject: Re:Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Anonymous wrote:You’re having a discussion with someone who talks to his spouse about how much she earns in relation to their partnership as parents? WTH is wrong with him? Shut that nonsense down.
This isn’t a YOU problem, it’s a WE problem. You both have to sit down and figure this out. Maybe you trade off days for meal/pickup. Maybe you invest in a meal prep service. Maybe you each adjust your schedules. Maybe he’s in charge of Saturday dinner and you’re in charge of Sunday dinner and then you alternate each weekend.
All I know is that the salary each person makes has to be taken off the table. It’s getting in the way of a reasonable but challenging discussion about parenting and household responsibilities.
As a last result, you can get a copy of the Fair Play book. That has been recommended here and would be helpful in your situation.
Agree mostly with this, and have also done the Fair Play cards and thought it was useful. That said, I make 4x what my DH makes and that definitely enters into the equation somewhat.
Can you make up the missing hours after kids go to bed? That’s what I do. Something has to give and for me it’s personal time, of which I have basically zero during the week.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 11:38
Subject: Re:Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
You’re having a discussion with someone who talks to his spouse about how much she earns in relation to their partnership as parents? WTH is wrong with him? Shut that nonsense down.
This isn’t a YOU problem, it’s a WE problem. You both have to sit down and figure this out. Maybe you trade off days for meal/pickup. Maybe you invest in a meal prep service. Maybe you each adjust your schedules. Maybe he’s in charge of Saturday dinner and you’re in charge of Sunday dinner and then you alternate each weekend.
All I know is that the salary each person makes has to be taken off the table. It’s getting in the way of a reasonable but challenging discussion about parenting and household responsibilities.
As a last result, you can get a copy of the Fair Play book. That has been recommended here and would be helpful in your situation.
This isn’t a YOU problem, it’s a WE problem. You both have to sit down and figure this out. Maybe you trade off days for meal/pickup. Maybe you invest in a meal prep service. Maybe you each adjust your schedules. Maybe he’s in charge of Saturday dinner and you’re in charge of Sunday dinner and then you alternate each weekend.
All I know is that the salary each person makes has to be taken off the table. It’s getting in the way of a reasonable but challenging discussion about parenting and household responsibilities.
As a last result, you can get a copy of the Fair Play book. That has been recommended here and would be helpful in your situation.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 11:27
Subject: Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
Sounds fair to me. You just can't keep up with your share of fairness.
Anonymous
11/11/2023 11:25
Subject: Fair division of household responsibilities vs. income
For most of our marriage, I've had flexible low-paying jobs or freelanced, while DH worked an intense finance job, making 300-500k. (I started in finance too, but I didn't like it and I thought our life would be easier if one person had more flexibility, so I changed fields). So I was responsible for most of the house (and kids, when they came along). He did bills, taxes, car maintenance, and took out the trash. Sometimes he'd help clean up or run an errand. This worked for us and felt fair.
Recently, we both made major job changes. He was burning out and took a less intense job. He now makes 200k and works 9:00-6:30 (from home), plus 6 or so hours on evenings and weekends. I found an opportunity I love that's semi-intense. It pays 100k and I need to work like 45 hours/week.
He picked up a bit more at home, but I still do the lion's share. I can barely fit in 40 hours with all the responsibilities at home.
I am really struggling and dropping the ball both at work and at home. Probably the hardest part is meal prep - I run out without finishing my work to get the kids from aftercare and daycare, I get home and they're hungry and want attention, and there's nothing to eat. Repeat every single day. On the weekend, if we don't have plans to go out, I'm the default person to think of and prep a meal too.
We can't afford a nanny, esp one who will cook. I would like to split the workload more equally with DH. For example, have him stop at 5 and do the pickups and watch kids while I cook dinner, or vice versa. DH says that's too much for him. Since I still make half what he does, he thinks it's fair and it's just the price I pay for following my passion rather than taking a job that's either part-time or higher paying. Of course if I had a higher paying or part-time job, this problem would disappear, but I am working at my dream job and don't want to give it up.
I need an outside perspective. What is fair here?
Recently, we both made major job changes. He was burning out and took a less intense job. He now makes 200k and works 9:00-6:30 (from home), plus 6 or so hours on evenings and weekends. I found an opportunity I love that's semi-intense. It pays 100k and I need to work like 45 hours/week.
He picked up a bit more at home, but I still do the lion's share. I can barely fit in 40 hours with all the responsibilities at home.
I am really struggling and dropping the ball both at work and at home. Probably the hardest part is meal prep - I run out without finishing my work to get the kids from aftercare and daycare, I get home and they're hungry and want attention, and there's nothing to eat. Repeat every single day. On the weekend, if we don't have plans to go out, I'm the default person to think of and prep a meal too.
We can't afford a nanny, esp one who will cook. I would like to split the workload more equally with DH. For example, have him stop at 5 and do the pickups and watch kids while I cook dinner, or vice versa. DH says that's too much for him. Since I still make half what he does, he thinks it's fair and it's just the price I pay for following my passion rather than taking a job that's either part-time or higher paying. Of course if I had a higher paying or part-time job, this problem would disappear, but I am working at my dream job and don't want to give it up.
I need an outside perspective. What is fair here?