Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 20:14     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
A lot of the best swimmers do not swim HS because they are more likely to be recruited through Club and not HS.


How do they gain the varsity experience colleges want, then? I have a teen who wants to go to the Air Force Academy. Shouldn't he focus on high school?


Most club swimmers do both. They do club practices and then a couple of high school practices a week. They swim in all HS meets.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 19:12     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
A lot of the best swimmers do not swim HS because they are more likely to be recruited through Club and not HS.


How do they gain the varsity experience colleges want, then? I have a teen who wants to go to the Air Force Academy. Shouldn't he focus on high school?

Swimming is all about times, not a “varsity experience”. High school swim lasts 2 months and the rest of the year the kids that aspire to swim in college are competing with their clubs. Colleges all know that club swim is far more competitive, they are not recruiting swimmers based off of their high school resume.


This isn't about recruiting. It's about putting "varsity" on an application where 80% and up of admitted applicants played a varsity sport.


If you want to swim in college, you are recruited by your club times.

You don't need varsity for college applications, when you can say you swam competitively year round.


This is absolutely incorrect for service academies.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 18:34     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Can someone give me the Swimming for Dummies explanation of how club and school swimming work together (or conflict). Calendar, schedules, etc? We're leaving the DMV before DD is in middle school, so general is more helpful than specific.


I can give you an answer for outside DC, with the caveat that this doesn't apply to the kids who definitely know they'll have trials times and are basically on track for the Olympics. I can think of 1-2 of those kids here and I don't even know if they do HS swim.

Kids are affiliated with their club year-round. The HS meet season where we are does not overlap with the important part of the club swimming season and when HS season concludes, that's when club really ramps up. Most of the HS coaches have affiliations with a club and coach there the rest of the year, so training is fairly aligned and coordinated. HS championships are dominated by club swimmers in the biggest division in our state, with the exception of a few rare athletes who do HS water polo + one more HS sport in their off-season and club workouts in the summer.


Thanks, this is exactly what I wanted to know!


Here's the thing though... there are states that do not allow participation in both at the same time. Kids put club "on hold" for HS season, they train and compete with HS team during that time. Maybe they get lucky and have a club coach who also coaches HS or maybe they don't and they could have a major downgrade in training during that season as compared to their usual training, depending on level (or opt out of HS swim depending on goals/preferences). Ohio is one of these states, I think some others in the midwest as well. . I know swimmers can get special permission to swim a "big deal" club meet during the season (i.e. Winter Juniors in December).

There are states where boys and girls have different HS seasons as well. For example, MN girls are fall and boys are winter. I think fall swimming benefits club swimmers, it's really hard to keep everything going with a season like DMV where in the heart of the winter/early spring season has many HS meets and kids gearing up for club championship meets.

As far as the fastest kids around here (Olympic Trials cuts and such), the majority do HS swim. Katie Ledecky, Jack Conger, Phoebe Bacon, Erin Gemmell, all did. They pop in for meets as needed. The exception would be areas without HS swimming (Howard County for example). Around here, the norm is for club swimmers to practice with their club teams all the time and compete in as many HS meets as works.


I was the PP at 12:25 and my experience is with both Ohio (boys and girls in winter) and the west coast (girls in fall, boys in winter). I think the Ohio schedule is ideal. Because of where it falls in the club season, HS swimming remains nearly as intense as club at the powerhouse suburban and independent high schools, most of which have their own pools and elbow out clubs for in-season pool time. Smaller and rural schools are different. It is fully expected that club swimmers will swim HS in the winter and clubs work around that; kids who are at high schools that don't run doubles or weekend practices might pick up morning club practices during HS season. The HS I know best and that produces at least 2 and up to 10 D1 recruits per year between both teams runs 2-a-days that are semi-optional. Kids who are club swimmers and on state-bound relays are at every single practice for sure. A non-club swimmer who occasionally picks up the 3rd entry in varsity meets might not do every morning practice but will be at every afternoon practice and dryland/lift.

My most recent west coast state experience is in WA state, and those HS practices seem way more casual, are 1x/day, and girls don't fully step off the club practice circuit in fall. We have very limited pool space, though, so take my observation with a grain of salt.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 14:16     Subject: Club + school
My HS senior swims club all year round and swims for his HS team when the club schedule allows. He does not practice with the HS team at all (they're so slow, he'd need a lane to himself to get anything done). He will swim a few HS meets to qualify for National Catholics and METROS, but his recruiting all came from the club side of things.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 14:00     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
A lot of the best swimmers do not swim HS because they are more likely to be recruited through Club and not HS.


How do they gain the varsity experience colleges want, then? I have a teen who wants to go to the Air Force Academy. Shouldn't he focus on high school?

Swimming is all about times, not a “varsity experience”. High school swim lasts 2 months and the rest of the year the kids that aspire to swim in college are competing with their clubs. Colleges all know that club swim is far more competitive, they are not recruiting swimmers based off of their high school resume.


This isn't about recruiting. It's about putting "varsity" on an application where 80% and up of admitted applicants played a varsity sport.


If you want to swim in college, you are recruited by your club times.

You don't need varsity for college applications, when you can say you swam competitively year round.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 13:56     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
A lot of the best swimmers do not swim HS because they are more likely to be recruited through Club and not HS.


How do they gain the varsity experience colleges want, then? I have a teen who wants to go to the Air Force Academy. Shouldn't he focus on high school?


It is not a thing for college. Since (at least in the DMV) HS meets are not USAswimming sanctioned most colleges are not going to look at it. Regional and State championship only. And there is no need to swim HS if your times are there. Some swimmers do, because it is fun and they can be "stars" on their HS teams. In the DMV, HS is one step up from summer league.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 13:49     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
A lot of the best swimmers do not swim HS because they are more likely to be recruited through Club and not HS.


How do they gain the varsity experience colleges want, then? I have a teen who wants to go to the Air Force Academy. Shouldn't he focus on high school?

Swimming is all about times, not a “varsity experience”. High school swim lasts 2 months and the rest of the year the kids that aspire to swim in college are competing with their clubs. Colleges all know that club swim is far more competitive, they are not recruiting swimmers based off of their high school resume.


This isn't about recruiting. It's about putting "varsity" on an application where 80% and up of admitted applicants played a varsity sport.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 13:47     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Can someone give me the Swimming for Dummies explanation of how club and school swimming work together (or conflict). Calendar, schedules, etc? We're leaving the DMV before DD is in middle school, so general is more helpful than specific.


I can give you an answer for outside DC, with the caveat that this doesn't apply to the kids who definitely know they'll have trials times and are basically on track for the Olympics. I can think of 1-2 of those kids here and I don't even know if they do HS swim.

Kids are affiliated with their club year-round. The HS meet season where we are does not overlap with the important part of the club swimming season and when HS season concludes, that's when club really ramps up. Most of the HS coaches have affiliations with a club and coach there the rest of the year, so training is fairly aligned and coordinated. HS championships are dominated by club swimmers in the biggest division in our state, with the exception of a few rare athletes who do HS water polo + one more HS sport in their off-season and club workouts in the summer.


Thanks, this is exactly what I wanted to know!


Here's the thing though... there are states that do not allow participation in both at the same time. Kids put club "on hold" for HS season, they train and compete with HS team during that time. Maybe they get lucky and have a club coach who also coaches HS or maybe they don't and they could have a major downgrade in training during that season as compared to their usual training, depending on level (or opt out of HS swim depending on goals/preferences). Ohio is one of these states, I think some others in the midwest as well. . I know swimmers can get special permission to swim a "big deal" club meet during the season (i.e. Winter Juniors in December).

There are states where boys and girls have different HS seasons as well. For example, MN girls are fall and boys are winter. I think fall swimming benefits club swimmers, it's really hard to keep everything going with a season like DMV where in the heart of the winter/early spring season has many HS meets and kids gearing up for club championship meets.

As far as the fastest kids around here (Olympic Trials cuts and such), the majority do HS swim. Katie Ledecky, Jack Conger, Phoebe Bacon, Erin Gemmell, all did. They pop in for meets as needed. The exception would be areas without HS swimming (Howard County for example). Around here, the norm is for club swimmers to practice with their club teams all the time and compete in as many HS meets as works.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 13:02     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
A lot of the best swimmers do not swim HS because they are more likely to be recruited through Club and not HS.


How do they gain the varsity experience colleges want, then? I have a teen who wants to go to the Air Force Academy. Shouldn't he focus on high school?

Swimming is all about times, not a “varsity experience”. High school swim lasts 2 months and the rest of the year the kids that aspire to swim in college are competing with their clubs. Colleges all know that club swim is far more competitive, they are not recruiting swimmers based off of their high school resume.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 12:52     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
A lot of the best swimmers do not swim HS because they are more likely to be recruited through Club and not HS.


How do they gain the varsity experience colleges want, then? I have a teen who wants to go to the Air Force Academy. Shouldn't he focus on high school?
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 12:30     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Can someone give me the Swimming for Dummies explanation of how club and school swimming work together (or conflict). Calendar, schedules, etc? We're leaving the DMV before DD is in middle school, so general is more helpful than specific.


I can give you an answer for outside DC, with the caveat that this doesn't apply to the kids who definitely know they'll have trials times and are basically on track for the Olympics. I can think of 1-2 of those kids here and I don't even know if they do HS swim.

Kids are affiliated with their club year-round. The HS meet season where we are does not overlap with the important part of the club swimming season and when HS season concludes, that's when club really ramps up. Most of the HS coaches have affiliations with a club and coach there the rest of the year, so training is fairly aligned and coordinated. HS championships are dominated by club swimmers in the biggest division in our state, with the exception of a few rare athletes who do HS water polo + one more HS sport in their off-season and club workouts in the summer.


Thanks, this is exactly what I wanted to know!
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 12:30     Subject: Club + school
If you are asking about Club and HS swimming. HS swim is very short - think two months and most Club swimmers will continue Club practices because honestly they are usually better practices. Around here HS meets are Friday and Saturday evenings. So Club swimmers can still attend meets on the weekend that are local.

There is one big meet in December that there are usually HS conflicts and a lot of the good swimmers choose that meet over HS.

A lot of the best swimmers do not swim HS because they are more likely to be recruited through Club and not HS.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 12:26     Subject: Club + school
I don't think I completely understand the question. But, like any sport, you work your schedule. You choose a club near your home that you are able to get your kid to the practices. That might be either before school starts or in the evenings. Your kid does homework during the other times. If your kid is elementary they would probably only swim 2 to 3 days a week.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 12:25     Subject: Club + school
Anonymous wrote:Can someone give me the Swimming for Dummies explanation of how club and school swimming work together (or conflict). Calendar, schedules, etc? We're leaving the DMV before DD is in middle school, so general is more helpful than specific.


I can give you an answer for outside DC, with the caveat that this doesn't apply to the kids who definitely know they'll have trials times and are basically on track for the Olympics. I can think of 1-2 of those kids here and I don't even know if they do HS swim.

Kids are affiliated with their club year-round. The HS meet season where we are does not overlap with the important part of the club swimming season and when HS season concludes, that's when club really ramps up. Most of the HS coaches have affiliations with a club and coach there the rest of the year, so training is fairly aligned and coordinated. HS championships are dominated by club swimmers in the biggest division in our state, with the exception of a few rare athletes who do HS water polo + one more HS sport in their off-season and club workouts in the summer.
Anonymous
Post 10/11/2023 11:52     Subject: Club + school
Can someone give me the Swimming for Dummies explanation of how club and school swimming work together (or conflict). Calendar, schedules, etc? We're leaving the DMV before DD is in middle school, so general is more helpful than specific.