Anonymous
Post 06/22/2023 13:39     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
First smart move I've heard.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2023 13:38     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Retrofitting light rail makes no sense. For the same price, you could dedicate a bus lane and buy electric busses.


Light rail makes no sense if your only concern is cost per rider.

Light rail makes perfect sense if you are also concerned with economic development along the rail corridor.

The fact is, affluent people prefer rail to bus, and businesses prefer to serve affluent people. The streetcar was never about efficient transit, is was about redeveloping the area it served. There's a reason the Wilson Blvd corridor is massively developed and Columbia Pike isn't despite it being well served by bus lines.


Affluent people also prefer a streetcar which operates well and efficiently, and without a dedicated lane, this street car does not.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2023 13:36     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Retrofitting light rail makes no sense. For the same price, you could dedicate a bus lane and buy electric busses.


Light rail makes no sense if your only concern is cost per rider.

Light rail makes perfect sense if you are also concerned with economic development along the rail corridor.

The fact is, affluent people prefer rail to bus, and businesses prefer to serve affluent people. The streetcar was never about efficient transit, is was about redeveloping the area it served. There's a reason the Wilson Blvd corridor is massively developed and Columbia Pike isn't despite it being well served by bus lines.


Basically everyone prefers rail to bus. The difference is that people who are able to choose whether or not to ride transit will rarely choose to ride a bus but will more often choose to ride rail.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2023 13:33     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Charles Allen is the worst but the streetcar is a stupid waste of money and has done nothing to improve H street.

More cops would improve H street.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2023 13:07     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Retrofitting light rail makes no sense. For the same price, you could dedicate a bus lane and buy electric busses.


Light rail makes no sense if your only concern is cost per rider.

Light rail makes perfect sense if you are also concerned with economic development along the rail corridor.

The fact is, affluent people prefer rail to bus, and businesses prefer to serve affluent people. The streetcar was never about efficient transit, is was about redeveloping the area it served. There's a reason the Wilson Blvd corridor is massively developed and Columbia Pike isn't despite it being well served by bus lines.


Hasn't done anything for Springfield or Tysons.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2023 12:53     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Retrofitting light rail makes no sense. For the same price, you could dedicate a bus lane and buy electric busses.


I would rather ride light rail a million times over...


Why?


DP, but aside from ride quality, streetcars and light rail offer significantly higher throughput than buses. Not to mention that railcars last significantly longer than buses.
Anonymous
Post 06/22/2023 11:47     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:Retrofitting light rail makes no sense. For the same price, you could dedicate a bus lane and buy electric busses.


Light rail makes no sense if your only concern is cost per rider.

Light rail makes perfect sense if you are also concerned with economic development along the rail corridor.

The fact is, affluent people prefer rail to bus, and businesses prefer to serve affluent people. The streetcar was never about efficient transit, is was about redeveloping the area it served. There's a reason the Wilson Blvd corridor is massively developed and Columbia Pike isn't despite it being well served by bus lines.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2023 16:43     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
So the streetcar investment was ok when it benefited Allen’s ward, but not when it would help Gray’s?

That has to be a bitter pill for Gray, because I think the initial investment was done when he was Mayor.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2023 15:33     Subject: Re:Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:This would be different if the original streetcar design (1) made sense, or (2) was working well. They screwed it up. The streetcar is great when it works, but all it takes is one wonkily parked car or a double parked delivery vehicle to throw the system into disarray. Because they chose to create the streetcar with no dedicated or even preferential lane, and they chose to run it on the outer lane and keep all parking, they've created an inefficient, delay-prone system that would be hard to expand.

I don't actually like Allen very much but I think he's correct on this one. The frustrating thing is that the Council is inept as is most of the transportation policy makers in the city, so while delaying the extension makes sense, they are probably not going to come up with a better solution either.

What they should do is get rid of parking on H street (which people will absolutely lose their minds over despite it being a corridor incredibly well served by public transportation), expand sidewalks, and install more preferential lights for the streetcar AND buses along the corridor. No one has the guts to do that though.


I’m not sure if this will result in a dedicated lane for the Streetcar (and buses), but they seem to working on something: https://ddot.dc.gov/page/h-street-ne-bus-priority-project

But I’m fully in agreement that the design compromises have made the Streetcar borderline unviable. It’s a shame that it took our local government so long and so much money to produce something so bad.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2023 15:26     Subject: Re:Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:This would be different if the original streetcar design (1) made sense, or (2) was working well. They screwed it up. The streetcar is great when it works, but all it takes is one wonkily parked car or a double parked delivery vehicle to throw the system into disarray. Because they chose to create the streetcar with no dedicated or even preferential lane, and they chose to run it on the outer lane and keep all parking, they've created an inefficient, delay-prone system that would be hard to expand.

I don't actually like Allen very much but I think he's correct on this one. The frustrating thing is that the Council is inept as is most of the transportation policy makers in the city, so while delaying the extension makes sense, they are probably not going to come up with a better solution either.

What they should do is get rid of parking on H street (which people will absolutely lose their minds over despite it being a corridor incredibly well served by public transportation), expand sidewalks, and install more preferential lights for the streetcar AND buses along the corridor. No one has the guts to do that though.


Poorly done transit or bike infrastructure for that matter, is worse than no infrastructure change at all. When it fails, it will be held up as an example of why we shouldn't try for a generation. Do it right the first time, or don't do it at all.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2023 13:45     Subject: Re:Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
This would be different if the original streetcar design (1) made sense, or (2) was working well. They screwed it up. The streetcar is great when it works, but all it takes is one wonkily parked car or a double parked delivery vehicle to throw the system into disarray. Because they chose to create the streetcar with no dedicated or even preferential lane, and they chose to run it on the outer lane and keep all parking, they've created an inefficient, delay-prone system that would be hard to expand.

I don't actually like Allen very much but I think he's correct on this one. The frustrating thing is that the Council is inept as is most of the transportation policy makers in the city, so while delaying the extension makes sense, they are probably not going to come up with a better solution either.

What they should do is get rid of parking on H street (which people will absolutely lose their minds over despite it being a corridor incredibly well served by public transportation), expand sidewalks, and install more preferential lights for the streetcar AND buses along the corridor. No one has the guts to do that though.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2023 13:38     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:Retrofitting light rail makes no sense. For the same price, you could dedicate a bus lane and buy electric busses.


I would rather ride light rail a million times over...


Why?
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2023 13:33     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Anonymous wrote:Retrofitting light rail makes no sense. For the same price, you could dedicate a bus lane and buy electric busses.


I would rather ride light rail a million times over...
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2023 13:29     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
Retrofitting light rail makes no sense. For the same price, you could dedicate a bus lane and buy electric busses.
Anonymous
Post 06/21/2023 12:12     Subject: Charles Allen killed the EOTR Streetcar
It’s a nice play on the song, but it’s also has some truth to it:

https://dcist.com/story/23/06/08/eastward-extension-dc-streetcar-delayed-again/

Up to this point, I’ve struggled to see why Charles Allen serves as such a lightning rod for outrage, but decisions like this make me wonder what he has achieved during his tenure on the Council.